Osttruppen Discussion and Feedback

Jump back to quoted post15 Dec 2020, 08:07 AMSmartie

I really dont see any reason to move Assgrens behind t1; Assgrens in their current state are NOT over performing, there completely fine.
And I really doubt that it's a wise decision to do such drastic changes because of 1 op Unit (osttruppen) that is ONLY op in the least played game mode. Right now the 1v1 mode has taken all the team modes hostage.
If you decide to move Assgrens behind t1 then you also have to look at Pathfinders and other allied 0Cp call-in units.

Jump back to quoted post15 Dec 2020, 00:18 AMJibberJabberJobber

I voted for call-in with T1 requirement.

I'd set it up as follows:

• BP1 cost change reverted from 50 to 40 fuel, fuel cost moved back to T1.
  
• Osttruppen and Assault Grenadiers require T1 built before they can be called in.
  
• Assault Grenadier cost from 280 to 260 manpower.
  
• Recharge times and everything else remains the same.
  

This has the most benefits and not many drawbacks:

• 2 MG42 + 2 Pio builds and T1 with Osttruppen builds not affected (these are not considered problematic builds, nerfing these would just harm diversity, which is what more expensive Osttruppen / BP1 would do).
  
• Good timing delay on MG42 + 3 Osttruppen builds (1:53 T1 vs 1:48 35sec 220mp vs 1:35 live). Also, most of the added cost is upfront and the Pioneers will be busy building T1 at the start (all add up to a less oppressive early game). MG42 + 3 Gren builds take 2:42 to field.
  
• Panzergrenadiers and T2 delayed for Osttruppen and Assault Grenadier builds.
  
• Wouldn't be just a straight up cost nerf to MG42 + 3 Osttruppen builds, but give access to earlier Faust and T1 units.
  

Jump back to quoted post15 Dec 2020, 07:03 AMVipper

Half of Ostheer problems are that they need to get T1 up to get an infatry out so moving Ostt and AG in T1 will simply kill these doctrines.

Jump back to quoted post15 Dec 2020, 08:40 AMGiaA

The current change is the one that's drastic. It cripples all T1 skip strategies. Jibbers suggestion literally only affects the problematic units directly as opposed to changing the entire tech price distribution. Assgrens are absolutely overperforming. But tbh that's not even really relevant in the context of this suggestion because you could easily exclude Assgrens if you were convinced that they are balanced in their current state. Jibber only included them (presumably) because the current version also nerfs both Osttruppen and Assgrens.

And please just stop with the "it's unfair, the other side deserves a nerf too" line of argument.

Jump back to quoted post15 Dec 2020, 10:20 AMJibberJabberJobber

To clarify: they wouldn't be build from T1, just require T1 to be called in, so the first Osttruppen / AG squad would still arrive at the same time as live, because the recharge starts at the start of the game, not once T1 is built.

Jump back to quoted post15 Dec 2020, 10:44 AMVipper

So Ostheer not only will not have mainline infatry available from T0 as other faction have but they will now not even access to Doctrinal T0 unit with T1.

That make little sense especially since some of the problems Ostheer actually have start with having their mainline infantry arriving the latest.

Moving them to HQ is a far better solution since their timing will be the same regardless of map.

Jump back to quoted post15 Dec 2020, 10:47 AMKatitof

They were literally NEVER meant to.
That's why their T1 is so cheap and quick to build.


That was fixed by having strongest HMG in game arrive first.


Osttruppen are still call-in.
They just require T1 to be built in that suggestion.

Jump back to quoted post15 Dec 2020, 10:44 AMVipper

So Ostheer not only will not have mainline infatry available from T0 as other faction have but they will now not even access to Doctrinal T0 unit with T1.

That make little sense especially since some of the problems Ostheer actually have start with having their mainline infantry arriving the latest.

Moving them to HQ is a far better solution since their timing will be the same regardless of map.

Jump back to quoted post15 Dec 2020, 11:03 AMHannibal

Ostheer teching is barely comparable to teching of any other faction. "Faction X has this, faction Y needs it too" barely works here.

Jump back to quoted post15 Dec 2020, 11:34 AMVipper

This is irrelevant to teching argument. Ostheer's mainline infatry arrive later than all other faction. That is simple fact.

The end result is that when the move for the first engagement they are in worse position although their are defensive infatry.

Jump back to quoted post15 Dec 2020, 11:35 AMKatitof

Its meant to and balanced around it.
That's a simple fact.


This is why HMG42 is T0, that's a simple fact.

Jump back to quoted post15 Dec 2020, 11:35 AMKatitof

If you want to play mainline spam faction, ost is not it, that's also a simple fact.

Jump back to quoted post15 Dec 2020, 11:57 AMAlphrum

voted for t1 too but this is a 1v1 only issue, ostruppen are terrible in team games. But has the mod team realised that ppl are crutching on ostruppen? and that grens are underperforming

Jump back to quoted post15 Dec 2020, 11:36 AMVipper

Nope it is not balanced.

If it was Ostheer player would not have to playing only commander that allow them to skip grenadiers.

Once more, these feedback threads are not about what I want it about improving the game. That is also simply fact that you have fail to understand so far.

Jump back to quoted post15 Dec 2020, 11:34 AMVipper

This is irrelevant to teching argument. Ostheer's mainline infatry arrive later than all other faction. That is simple fact.

The end result is that when the move for the first engagement they are in worse position although their are defensive infatry.

That is one of the reasons Ostt are even worth while, they allow Ostheer to hold ground early.