MG42 over performing

that sounds extremely dangerous...


mg34 suppression is a bit too much... id change to around vickers level imo... in turn we can give something else like pgren smoke or smth similar...

There will not be any easy options, without making Ostheer's fraction design or early game broken or destory an unique unit. There were many bad decisions made over the years, many of old design-test led to new fractions, like OKW or Brits, instead of fixing older ones.

There was a time relic planed to buff Ostheers Pios, so Ostheer had an chance in ealry game. Relic decided to make money and released commanders with Assault-Grens. So they had to nerf Pios again, because they had same task. Without Assault-Grens Ostheer was trash, so Grens got buffed... over the yeas they simply moved HMG42 to T0, but like you see, even this isn't enough because PnzGrens moved lower as well. But why? Because needed changes were introduced for OKW's fraction design.

All over, Germans are realy bad designed, Ostheer AND OKW.

Edit: One important problem is, that Relic was trying to make a different experience for CoH2 fractions.
Resulting in a design-sillbirth.

Edit of the Edit:

If I could change something, I would intermix some elements of OKW and Ostheer. So they become less edgy and more smooth.

There was a time relic planed to buff Ostheers Pios, so Ostheer had an chance in ealry game. Relic decided to make money and released commanders with Assault-Grens. So they had to nerf Pios again, because they had same task. Without Assault-Grens Ostheer was trash, so Grens got buffed... over the yeas they simply moved HMG42 to T0, but like you see, even this isn't enough because PnzGrens moved lower as well. But why? Because needed changes were introduced for OKW's fraction design.

Where did you learn all of this stuff? Because most of it is just not true. Relic DID overbuff pios at one point and it led to diverse meta builds such as Pio-pio-pio-pio-251 flamethrower. They were severely overperforming following a substantial buff to their dps and could charge from long range at conscripts and win.
Pios did not get nerfed because of assault grens, they were nerfed because at the time they were overperforming. Ostheer was fine without assault grens.

Grens have actually recieved several nerfs. Like they initially came with x2 LMG42s and that was reduced to 1. G43s used to be so powerful that they made the old LMG42 obsolete even at long range. They got a well deserved nerf.

Panzergrenadiers were moved to HQ because the timing of tier 2 meant ostheer had too many squads on the field by the time panzergrenadiers were built and so no room for extra infantry. It had nothing to do with OKW.

How is the 50cal harder to get than an mg34?

You have to tech a certain way to get it vs getting it no matter how you tech? I mean... It's pretty straightforward frankly...

Where did you learn all of this stuff? Because most of it is just not true. Relic DID overbuff pios at one point and it led to diverse meta builds such as Pio-pio-pio-pio-251 flamethrower. They were severely overperforming following a substantial buff to their dps and could charge from long range at conscripts and win.
Pios did not get nerfed because of assault grens, they were nerfed because at the time they were overperforming. Ostheer was fine without assault grens.

Grens have actually recieved several nerfs. Like they initially came with x2 LMG42s and that was reduced to 1. G43s used to be so powerful that they made the old LMG42 obsolete even at long range. They got a well deserved nerf.

Panzergrenadiers were moved to HQ because the timing of tier 2 meant ostheer had too many squads on the field by the time panzergrenadiers were built and so no room for extra infantry. It had nothing to do with OKW.

Sure it was, I am playing this game since release without any brake and was testing every patch. I have to look for it. Game had so many changes and testing, it is crazy.

The hardcore Pio-Buff was ~1 1/2 year before OKW was announced. Good old days. ^^ I think is was a patch-beta, they had ca. same power as assault-grens in that test.

Sure it was, I am playing this game since release without any brake and was testing every patch. I have to look for it. Game had so many changes and testing, it is crazy.

The hardcore Pio-Buff was ~1 1/2 year before OKW was announced. Good old days. ^^

You are really confused and spewing BS.


Assault Grenadiers released a couple of months after the game release around 2013. Every freaking DLC commander was broken for one reason or another. It took them quite a long time to fix SI and TA as opposed to say Osstruppen/FHQ/AssG.

Pio became ubersmench when they reworked the damage profile of all weapons around march 2014 and lasted around a month. WFA released 2 o 3 months later.

Serrith explained it well for PGs.


You might have a different vision on design, but at least give proper justifications or correct anecdotes.


Ontopic: MG42 is fine outside of sometimes bugging out and missing and animation which will make it look weird.

Pio became ubersmench when they reworked the damage profile of all weapons around march 2014 and lasted around a month. WFA released 2 o 3 months later.

It isn't important if it was planed or not, but at that stage Ostheer had features of OKW design. And at that moment Assaut-Grens were obsolete. So or so, its a long time since this days.

thx for writing the correct timing. The timings between betas and patch-releases are often very confusing.

Edit: And still, the time for a real Ostheer-fix are gone, because it needs design changes. And that means making Ostheer and OKW more similar or mixing funkctions.

It isn't important if it was planed or not, but at that stage Ostheer had features of OKW design. And at that moment Assaut-Grens were obsolete. So or so, its a long time since this days.

thx for writing the correct timing. The timings between betas and patch-releases are often very confusing.

Edit: And still, the time for a real Ostheer-fix are gone, because it needs design changes. And that means making Ostheer and OKW more similar or mixing funkctions.

Or it might just generally be a bad to idea to give a faction that was (at the time) supposed to be struggling for life and focused on keeping the enemy at distance a very early tool to go toe to toe. Especially since Soviets only had the option of closing in.
Strong early game pioneers go directly against Ostheers defensive and static design. Is that design itself good? Debatable, but it also does not make sense to make a game with hypermobile factions only.
Currently, Ostheer's rooster is the best in the game in the sense that every unit makes sense at the stage of the game when it arrives plus even after that. Every unit has its unique feature that does not get overshadowed by another unit. And most importantly it does not have a shitty unit in the first place. Other factions can only dream of that.

I agree with Orangepest, its sometimes very good but most of the time just crap which you cant rely on. Orangepest pretty much explained why, prefer any other MG over the 42 any day

It isn't important if it was planed or not, but at that stage Ostheer had features of OKW design. And at that moment Assaut-Grens were obsolete. So or so, its a long time since this days.

thx for writing the correct timing. The timings between betas and patch-releases are often very confusing.

Edit: And still, the time for a real Ostheer-fix are gone, because it needs design changes. And that means making Ostheer and OKW more similar or mixing funkctions.

???

AssG were obsolete cause they were nerf hard. This was Relic with triple buffs and nerfs which made units either UP or OP. It wasn't a matter of design or overlap.

I disagree with OH having design problems nor that it has ever need a "real fix". OKW on the other hand...

It basically had a doom design from it's conception. So much that it was dropped few weeks/months prior to release.


OH has been the only faction across the whole life span of CoH2, that has needed the less drastic changes overall.
Compare that to SU/USF with the mentality of few units available but OP so they can carry, OKW/UKF with whatever they tried to accomplish with resulted in survive early game and just autowin in the late game.

I agree with Orangepest, its sometimes very good but most of the time just crap which you cant rely on. Orangepest pretty much explained why, prefer any other MG over the 42 any day

great... lets give the MG34 maxim and vickers MG42 suppression...

I agree with Orangepest, its sometimes very good but most of the time just crap which you cant rely on. Orangepest pretty much explained why, prefer any other MG over the 42 any day

I agree with you and with Orangepest.

MG42 is too clunky for what it has to deal with. The counter against it, is also avaliable in mass.

Even the incidenary rounds take too much delays to load.

The only redemption it comes earliest for early map control. Falls off the cliff soonest.

Worst MG for sure.

Worst MG for sure.

great... lets give the MG34 maxim and vickers MG42 suppression...

i wonder why biased ost players are delusional enough to claim the best MG ingame is the worst... it takes alot of delusion to come to that conclusion like... hello the MG34 and maxim exist yes?

the mg34 is essentially an MG42 with less suppression and the maxim has the worst suppression in the game coupled with bad arc and the deathloop...

You have to tech a certain way to get it vs getting it no matter how you tech? I mean... It's pretty straightforward frankly...

Well, I guess I prefer airborne and just drop them in. It's not so 'straightforward' but it's not so hard either.

great... lets give the MG34 maxim and vickers MG42 suppression...

I don't know about you, but do keep in mind that these are two very high level players. I think their opinions on the subject are valuable.

I don't know about you, but do keep in mind that these are two very high level players. I think their opinions on the subject are valuable.

the mg42 is objectively superior to the MG34 in a direct advantage-disadvantage assessment... ie: the MG34 has no advantage to the MG42 aside from a 10 mp discount... to say that the 42 is the worst without considering the mg34 is proof of subjective bias...

I don't know about you, but do keep in mind that these are two very high level players. I think their opinions on the subject are valuable.

Those high level players are trolling you. You have to be quite daft or so biased to believe the mg 42 is the worst mg.

hello the MG34 and maxim exist yes?

The HMG 34's suppression is virtually identical to the HMG 42's. The difference is like 10% which is barely noticeable ingame (0.1s slower to suppress at mid range). The only drawback is that it doesn't have as much DPS, but that's not what you get an HMG for anyway.

The HMG 34's suppression is virtually identical to the HMG 42's. The difference is like 10% which is barely noticeable ingame (0.1s slower to suppress at mid range). The only drawback is that it doesn't have as much DPS, but that's not what you get an HMG for anyway.

range 30 tests seem to indicate otherwise... how does the suppression value translate to actual suppression anyways? what are the variables involved with it?

also there are other drawbacks such as the tech requirement as supposed to a T0 MG

I don't know about you, but do keep in mind that these are two very high level players. I think their opinions on the subject are valuable.

And yet, they are not aware of traverse animation not always playing for ALL team weapons, which results in them believing it just points forward and does nothing, while in reality it simply traverses, hence the "snap" from forward looking to suddenly targeting something near the edge of arc.

Mg42 is fine as long as the axis player is smarter than his opponent because it has long deploy time and take year to aim.

Thankfully most allies player don’t understand you can just walk out of its firing range and attack from the side.

In a 1v1 situation with player being as good as the other, mg42 would definitely need a buff.