M3A1 scout car scaling

Jump back to quoted post29 Jul 2020, 00:36 AMthedarkarmadillo

Now now you are better than that hyperbole. I think the idea is that should you manage to keep our around or should proved you SOMETHING. Look at other early arriving shock units: ass grens now get a 6th man to help them deal with increased enemy DPS later on. Ass engies get mines and what not to keep them providing. Ostroppen get an lmg to centralize DPS. The 221 gets the 223 upgrade that turns it into a cache AND map hax. The kuble gets shared vet and map hax. The wc51 gets arty, mark target AMD can reuse the crew in another vehicle if it survives. The 222 gets great scouting vet. The 251 gets mines.... The m3a1 gets shock? In a game based around unit preservation a unit shouldn't have a "shelf life". Sure it can lose its ability to operate on the front but it should still bring something to the table if it survives. I think that's all people want (if we discount the katy/ml-20 barrage, fear propaganda, b4 direct fire off map crowd. Which we should....

Jump back to quoted post29 Jul 2020, 02:20 AMShadowLinkX37

So 50% of those units all come in doctrines as opposed to the m3a1 which is literally in t1 just to bully OKW. I remember argueing with Mr. Smith 3-4 years back against this oppressive unit to remove it and Mr. Smith's reasoning for the garbage design of bullying OKW was "the unit needs to do something". We don't need another jesus vehicle that does everything like the WC51 which continues to break 1v1. Not because of it does everything lategame, but because it's oppressive early game. If the m3a1 receives buffs OKW should get fausts from the go like OST. Kubels, UCs, m3a1 from minute 1 are all garbage design. Encouraging buffs to non bleed units is just removing cover combat of the first 5 or so minutes of the game to pushing units from cover because of pathing.

Jump back to quoted post29 Jul 2020, 03:22 AMthedarkarmadillo

It sounds like your complaint is against OKW not having an answer (aside from a mine or their t0 at gun) not the car scaling. You seem to be mixing them up and arguing one on account of the other. When tmyoy decide what you are arguing hit me up and we will resume discussing it. What ever that it happens to be

Jump back to quoted post29 Jul 2020, 03:22 AMthedarkarmadillo

It sounds like your complaint is against OKW not having an answer (aside from a mine or their t0 at gun) not the car scaling. You seem to be mixing them up and arguing one on account of the other. When tmyoy decide what you are arguing hit me up and we will resume discussing it. What ever that it happens to be

Jump back to quoted post28 Jul 2020, 23:13 PMShadowLinkX37

Why are people so adamant on giving vehicles that you get at minute 1 5 different abilities.

Is the scout car not oppressive enough vs no faust OKW?

I think the 223 should be able to call in schwer gustav shells at vet 5.

Jump back to quoted post29 Jul 2020, 06:29 AMKiwiBirb

I would give it a med crate ability once T3 is purchased. This would be a reward for keeping it alive, but hopefully prevent it from allowing Sov to apply relentless pressure on to its opponents.

Jump back to quoted post28 Jul 2020, 19:44 PMmiragefla

It needs shared veterancy as a start, but having med-kits to drop off wouldn't be broken, even if it's early game to help stem T1's relatively large bleed/manpower investments.

If it needs anything else, I maybe a range boost to 40 so it can sit back out of small-arms fire and peg away, perhaps that comes with veterancy.

Jump back to quoted post29 Jul 2020, 10:00 AMblvckdream

Didn't read this thread but the M3A1 should definitely NOT get med crates because that effectively saves Soviets 250 MP(equal a unit) in early game and would very likely completely brake the balance against OKW because all of a sudden you don't only have have the M3A1 but aren't outnumbered anymore either.

It either means another Penal/Con on the field or faster Zis and both would not be a good idea.

Jump back to quoted post29 Jul 2020, 06:29 AMKiwiBirb

The M3A1 is very powerful early game, but so is the T70. Looking at the T70, we can see it gets a powerful support ability that you can use after its optimal timing if you can keep it alive.

However, giving the M3A1 a powerful support ability would give your opponent almost no time to breathe and recover, and Sov isn’t really suffering in viability right now.

I think there should be some reward for keeping it alive, and Sov does lack on the field healing. However, I feel like giving it healing right after its optimal timing would be too oppressive, as the time after that is where your opponent can recover from its power and take advantage of your damaged squads and lack of AT.

I would give it a med crate ability once T3 is purchased. This would be a reward for keeping it alive, but hopefully prevent it from allowing Sov to apply relentless pressure on to its opponents.

Jump back to quoted post29 Jul 2020, 03:42 AMSerrith

Well I agree that the M3 is quite powerful against OKW, a solution for that specific situation may be just putting faust behind a truck called in instead of a truck deployed.

Jump back to quoted post29 Jul 2020, 11:23 AMthedarkarmadillo

[...]
Similarly I think the scout car being able to toss a medkit on the ground would help it find a role when it's front line time has expired. No AOE. Just a kit if that's possible.

Jump back to quoted post29 Jul 2020, 12:37 PMMMX

not an expert on this but i don't think a no-aoe medcrate is possible without the potential exploit to heal multiple squads at once if timed right. hence why the sturmpio version got changed to aoe heal a while back. but maybe passive heal for squads inside the transport à la 251 ht might be an option

Jump back to quoted post29 Jul 2020, 10:16 AMVipper

If one want to increase the utility of this unit one has to lower its shock value...

Jump back to quoted post29 Jul 2020, 14:14 PMKatitof

Doesn't work that way + other vehicles are perfectly fine having both, shock value and usefulness outside that one minute it arrived tn.

Jump back to quoted post29 Jul 2020, 15:04 PMVipper

Yes it does work that way. The only justification for the current shock value of the m3 is that it becomes less useful as the time goes by.

Jump back to quoted post29 Jul 2020, 15:04 PMVipper

Yes it does work that way. The only justification for the current shock value of the m3 is that it becomes less useful as the time goes by.