At least most people agree Ost is fairly weak. That's a good sign.
For 1v1, the bigger the game mode, the stronger ost is to the point, where its 1st or 2nd strongest faction in 4v4.
Faction Rankings in 1v1
23 Nov 2019, 10:17 AM
#21
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
For 1v1, the bigger the game mode, the stronger ost is to the point, where its 1st or 2nd strongest faction in 4v4.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
23 Nov 2019, 18:06 PM
#22
Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2
How did the UKF on release not make your list, specifically the Crocodile? I stopped playing OKW 1v1's for awhile, largely due to that one unit.
Because UKF release was extremely weak on 1v1 and didn't make it to late game. It required IS buffs and making it to AEC spam to made them worth. Croc was a monster, but an expensive one.
I considered it, but i just decided it was part of the whole UKF release.
Or six months of Penals with ourah and flamers
Compared to the list, yeah. It doesn't make it. That tells you how much worst comparatively the other patches were. You could add it to the last list but it wasn't necessarily short nor as annoying. T1 lacked any AT, it made you choose Guards doctrine almost 100% (which were stonk) or still tech T2 for needed AT guns/mortars. It was a high damage high bleeding strat which still didn't trump much higher over maxim spam or LMG meta.
My controls weren't working
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
23 Nov 2019, 19:00 PM
#23
Posts: 682
Every faction has had its awful buff patches.
Nothing UKF ever had or did is as bad as the March Deployment reign of terror, IMO.
90 range phosphorus rounds with arty cover and bofors / centaurs instantly killing garrisoned units was definitely a better time than jlis, I agree
/s
23 Nov 2019, 19:04 PM
#24
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
90 range phosphorus rounds with arty cover and bofors / centaurs instantly killing garrisoned units was definitely a better time than jlis, I agree
March deployment patch allowed 100+ win streaks for good players on ost and allowed bad players to compete against top players in long games that would've been stomps otherwise.
Even OKW infantry on release wasn't as bullshit overpowered as march deployment grens, they literally roflstomped any other infantry unit without even giving them a chance.
What you've said is nothing compared to march deployment patch. The sole fact so many people remember that despite it being first year patch speaks volumes about its impact.
Hell, I managed to pull of 1h+ game against Jesulin back then just because I picked ost and his superior skill and micro got literally nothing on a-moved grens.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
23 Nov 2019, 22:54 PM
#25
Posts: 2358
For 1v1, the bigger the game mode, the stronger ost is to the point, where its 1st or 2nd strongest faction in 4v4.
Would you mind the offtopic please? Everyone agreed this is a 1v1 thread. For what matters UKF has the same scaling on team games and you didnt mention it.
23 Nov 2019, 23:53 PM
#26
Posts: 682
March deployment patch allowed 100+ win streaks for good players on ost and allowed bad players to compete against top players in long games that would've been stomps otherwise.
Even OKW infantry on release wasn't as bullshit overpowered as march deployment grens, they literally roflstomped any other infantry unit without even giving them a chance.
What you've said is nothing compared to march deployment patch. The sole fact so many people remember that despite it being first year patch speaks volumes about its impact.
Hell, I managed to pull of 1h+ game against Jesulin back then just because I picked ost and his superior skill and micro got literally nothing on a-moved grens.
You're right. It was bad. During beta I knew that there was no way there could be any way that this game to have a chance for years to come.
/s
24 Nov 2019, 03:48 AM
#27
Posts: 789
I personally believe Soviets are stronger than USF as OKW are the most viable Axis faction and Soviets can out-power them in the late game reliably, due to superior manpower economy as the game wears on. With USF they tend to trade equally vs. OKW and so the advantage isn't as pronounced.
the near DPS buff to rifles made them super good vs Whermacht... people say OKW was too good vs all factions... why not nerf volks near dps instead of buffing rifle’s long range?
Most of my ideas are probably bad, - but I try and share lots of them
and maybe some of them will be good an improve the game
One can hope
and maybe some of them will be good an improve the game
One can hope
24 Nov 2019, 08:58 AM
#28
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
the near DPS buff to rifles made them super good vs Whermacht... people say OKW was too good vs all factions... why not nerf volks near dps instead of buffing rifle’s long range?
They were already stomping grens at that range, literally nothing changed here, except for engagement ending 3-5 seconds faster(because you're not going to stay there until you're wiped, are you?).
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
24 Nov 2019, 09:09 AM
#29
Posts: 3602 | Subs: 1
They were already stomping grens at that range, literally nothing changed here, except for engagement ending 3-5 seconds faster(because you're not going to stay there until you're wiped, are you?).
Then why suddenly USF goes to top1 when last patch was only about that and several other nerfs? That's a true question.
24 Nov 2019, 09:27 AM
#30
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
Then why suddenly USF goes to top1 when last patch was only about that and several other nerfs? That's a true question.
Volks nerfs.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
24 Nov 2019, 09:53 AM
#31
Posts: 378
1 - USF
2 - OKW
3 - SOV
4 - OST
5 - UKF
All the factions remain viable in 1v1 though, except UKF.
This is wrong.
Soviet do have a stronger late game but it's all due to their reliable tier 4 as they currently have the most inferior manpower economy with the most expensive reinforcing costs in the game.
2 - OKW
3 - SOV
4 - OST
5 - UKF
All the factions remain viable in 1v1 though, except UKF.
I personally believe Soviets are stronger than USF as OKW are the most viable Axis faction and Soviets can out-power them in the late game reliably, due to superior manpower economy as the game wears on. With USF they tend to trade equally vs. OKW and so the advantage isn't as pronounced.
This is wrong.
Soviet do have a stronger late game but it's all due to their reliable tier 4 as they currently have the most inferior manpower economy with the most expensive reinforcing costs in the game.
T34 85 needs to have slightly less AI. It's shells are basically on par with Sherman HE yet it does everything.
24 Nov 2019, 11:08 AM
#32
Posts: 1487
1. Wm
2. Su\okw
Camping wm is impossible to beat for me esp. on certain maps.
2. Su\okw
Camping wm is impossible to beat for me esp. on certain maps.
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25 Nov 2019, 02:28 AM
#33
Posts: 3053
bruh who said usf is the weakest lol
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25 Nov 2019, 06:55 AM
#34
Posts: 626 | Subs: 1
Soviets, USF, OKW all seem quite close even after the tourney it's quite hard to call.
Seems to be a clear consensus Ostheer brits as 4th/5th, though Ostheer is still fun and worth playing to me.
Which is very interesting that ostheer is so behind even though they got quite nice buffs recently. Pgrens, ostwind, stugs, tigers, better survability for grens, reduce tech cost. List is quite long but still they are behind OKW which on the other was nerfed by increasing the cost of volks and starting resources. It's like OKW is standing mostly on 1/2 commanders that keeps them in lead
To the ranking - i agree with all above - SOV->USF->OKW->OST->UKF. Although it's not like there are huge difference between them (expect brits).
I wonder if we gonna see After the grand championship i wonder if we see a next incoming patch directed to buff Brits. Though unlikely it's gonna be release before incoming 2v2 turney
25 Nov 2019, 11:12 AM
#35
Posts: 56
I've suggested this before but how about just removing tech lockouts for a start. The design to further limit the faction with the least versatility sounds strange when its clearly under-performing. So I don't
see why building AEC means you can't get cheap anti-air emplacement and why hammer means you can't get anvil.
Skillplanes require UKF a significant investment to deal with when teching the standard AEC route as opposed to other factions. And anvil is hindered with other weird handicaps like short vehicle tracking. I'm not saying get the other upgrade for free - but the price is there and you should be able to unlock it if you want. ATM it makes no sense - imagine having AT gun and mortar mutually exclusive for some other faction.
see why building AEC means you can't get cheap anti-air emplacement and why hammer means you can't get anvil.
Skillplanes require UKF a significant investment to deal with when teching the standard AEC route as opposed to other factions. And anvil is hindered with other weird handicaps like short vehicle tracking. I'm not saying get the other upgrade for free - but the price is there and you should be able to unlock it if you want. ATM it makes no sense - imagine having AT gun and mortar mutually exclusive for some other faction.
25 Nov 2019, 13:38 PM
#36
Posts: 2358
I would like to see people say how big is the gap between factions, because we can rank them up but maybe they all are in the same plateau of power level
25 Nov 2019, 15:22 PM
#37
Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2
I would like to see people say how big is the gap between factions, because we can rank them up but maybe they all are in the same plateau of power level
In a scale of 1 to 5, analysing meta as heavy call in.
SU is a 5.0
USF is a 4.5
OKW is a 4.0
OH is a 3.25
UKF is a 1.5
Non meta
USF 4.5
SU 4.25
OKW 4.0
OH 3.5
UKF 2.0
My controls weren't working
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
25 Nov 2019, 16:56 PM
#38
Posts: 2358
Fantastic elaboration I also agree that ukf is unfairly far behind but not as far as OH to OKW.
Nice detail the non meta analysis, since not every player uses the current meta
Nice detail the non meta analysis, since not every player uses the current meta
26 Nov 2019, 01:10 AM
#39
Posts: 789
Snip
I agree. I like the meta/non meta comparison too
Most of my ideas are probably bad, - but I try and share lots of them
and maybe some of them will be good an improve the game
One can hope
and maybe some of them will be good an improve the game
One can hope
26 Nov 2019, 03:17 AM
#40
Posts: 479
Honestly instead of buffing the power creep of Ostheer and Brits I would work on slightly toning down Soviets, USF, and OKW where they overperform. Falls, T-70, Rifles, HE Shells on Shermans etc. Obviously heavy call-ins also make these factions strong as the IS-2, Tiger, and Pershing are especially powerful. Either need more tech to be required for heavies or they need a CP adjustment to levels around what they were before but maybe 1-2 CP's fewer.
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