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How about you guys, go and watch some OKW plays in form last tourney, where they have lost?
Pretty much closer to the end of the tourney OKW was consistently loosing games. Wehr wasnt. Even same players who have lost as OKW, have won as Wehr against same allied faction they have played before.
I got it that its easier to look at one particular game, where top player wins as OKW and say that this is somehow proves that OKW is alright.
Sure its possible to win as them, they are not broken faction and they are playble, but it in no means proves that faction is on pair with others and plays nicely. |
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It has different role. I wont consider and compare it to any other rocket arty.
In direct complacent its kinda lackluster, considering the fact that any other rocketarty is much more efficient at denying ground or wiping spreadout blobs due to the scatter.
However, stuka is much more effective against support weapons and against any ambient garrisons, also it can destoy LVs and any type of scout cars quite good, aswell as finish or damage enemy armor.
For me personally, I try to use it on retreath paths, this is where it shines. Because player has no countroll over it and cant doudge it. If you know the maps and retreat paths then stuka really become quite potent.
Its much harder to use it effectively then any other rocket arty, but again when it works it works much better then other rocket arty.
On the other hand is it have a good unit desing that is the question. |
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The most frustration thing about it, is how teamgames are searched for pre-mades and in general team lvl.
You usually can see rank 16-19 players playing pre-mades, and having their team rank at 11 or 12 and being matched against players with 11 and 12 ranks. |
Totally agree a kv1 rush can be a problem. But OP is talking about limit to 1, that does not affect the rush at all
All KV needs is CP unlock cost to match up Churchill timings or at least be slightly faster to obtain then it. By no means any of KV1\8 should arive 2-3 mins after first medium. |
KV1s you just have to outrange with Panther or StuG spam - you don't have to kill it but if you make it impossible for him to push forward with risking a few back to Pens then it's hard for him to use it effectively. Having Stuka CAS in your loadout helps too - just wait for it to be damaged and then pop it when you see an opportunity for the kill.
To be frank, CAS or any other skillplanes are unusable because of how OP M5 AA vs planes. If there is 1 around (and any good soviet player will most likely get it) your best bet is 1 strafe maybe 2 if you are very lucky.
And regarding stugs, it has like 20 more penetration at long range then PIV, which is still un-relable vs KV frontal amor. Panther is counter but panther arrives much later then KV. It will have relayble penetration only from the rear (which is major fk up from soviet, if he letting you shoot rear with stugs), while PIV can somewhat penetrate KV rear only at close range, which is death sentence most of the time.
Also snowballing into su-85 should be considered.
As was already pointed KV timing is pretty much sligtly delayed medium armor one, while its has proper heavy tank armor.
KV-8 is even more retarded, because by its timing proper counters would be only AT guns, which it can just charge and de-crew. |
a bit of correction here but stock churchill have only 240 front armor, which is the same with OKW p4, and so AT, TD like stug or JP4 all have decent change of pen it front. Churchill's survivability come mostly from it HP (and the smoke) and it also mean a Vet dispenser for all units pen it.
Yeah 240, my mistake. Regarding veterancy, it was the case when it was more expensive, with its correct cost, it provides as much vet as penetrating regular medium I belive.
i dont mind if the commet become a Panther clone but you have to careful with what you wish. Currently, the commet AT is OK-ish at best
What is OK-ish btw? I mean, just as panther is supperior and can beat any medium without a problem, aswell as its mobility + free war speed provide you with great flanking options. Its penetration will always penetrate rear of any heavy tank.
I mean, the only big difference between Panther and Comet, is that Panther can somewhat fight heavies frontally. |
I mean sure but the point I was making still stands. Pfusies are a straight upgrade over volks in every way except certain types of utility.
Pf are upgrade because of how volks are presented in the meta. If snare was awaible after track arrival, if over-all damage and scaling was better for volks and their match up vs other mainline inf, it would have been debatable.
But as it is right now, yes. Because PF provide you with snares, better upgradable weapons and better scaling.
Thats is the point, if balance is working correctly then call-ins should be an optional, debatable chose which gives you more ways to play with the faction, when core units or faction is not working properly, then we have meta\no-brainer\pick-or-lose commanders and call-ins. Either that or its elite armor on release.
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But AT penals are worthless beyond the early game unless they get a lucky satchel off.
Pzgrens are absolute AT beasts, hence why the change is more polarising.
In 1v1 comparacent yes.
If you add mark target or guards pin or mines, they are still quite good. |
IDK pfusies are kind of just an upgrade past the first couple engagements over volks.
It have to do more with in general bad OKW tech tree and volks being frontline inf without properly being one, against anything but cons.
Same way Fallshimjaegers or JLI is better then obersts, not because of their perfomance, but because Obests are just arrive too late to make an bigger impact which Fallsh or JLI can do. |
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Tank destroyers and AT guns already eating all armor frontally anyway.
Regarding its AT, its pretty much panther slow panther with slightly less penetration, I belive tiges has 10 or so less.
Regarding AI, it depends on how you use it. When squads are damaged its AI is alright, against full HP squads it takes time to kill them, since AI damage comes from AOE and MGs, rather then sniper hits.
Overall tiger is more of a slowly moving support unit, rather then advance unit.
In general, all at least heavy tanks should follow tiger example, with damage comming from AOE and Mgs rather then sniping shots.
As a unit Tiger is good, when compared to King Tiger\IS-2\Comet\ISU\KV2 its AI is lackluster.
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