The topic is the Jackson. There is no Pershing in the game. There will most likely NEVER be a Pershing in the game.
The topoc os the Jackson needs a slight buff. And it needs it because there is NO PERSHING. If this is to remain true the Jackson needs to have better Penetration. Period. Even at the cost of the allmighty and unique 240 damage a shot that somehow only the USF have in the mighty mighty Jackson.
Your arguments about the power of the SU85 vs the Jackson are just false. If played to its strengths the SU85 simply has better pen and more DPS. Its up to the player to leverage this.
The Jackson has its benefits too. It is easier to use. It doesn't require mines to be effective. It has a turret so its harder to flank. All of this is true. To most players (since people like the path of least resistance) the Jackson is better.
None of that however makes the Jackson magically kill a tank that is sitting in front of it faster then an SU85 could. 240 Damage once Every Minute isnt very impressive is it? The same comparison applies. Unless of course your targets all have 240 HPs or less.
Profile of JHeartless
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The PTRS's are fine as they are. Whenever i'm up against Guard Infantry, I always have to be careful with my vehicles or the Guards will completely destroy them. Good range, good damage and fairly cheap; if anything, the PTRS should nerfed since it's ridiculously good for the price. Even in the hands of Conscripts, the PTRS's are extremely potent.
Post History of JHeartless
Thread: Jackson needs a slight buff13 Jan 2015, 17:39 PM
In: COH2 Gameplay |
Thread: Jackson needs a slight buff13 Jan 2015, 17:20 PM
Jackson kills,su-85 can push back and needs support.It can't finish off.Ur DPS thing over time ignores realities,tanks will hardly stay in ur firing cone for 20 secs and let u get shot after shot.All u get is 1-3 shots before it moves back,smoke or away.Jackson is a beast in this regard and can kill while backtracking which su-85 can't do against any save low health pz 4s.Jacksons are a terror in number.2 jacksons are far far better than 2 su-85s. You make 0 sense here. You are defying Physics. It doesnt MATTER the number of shots if the TTK is slower. Unless of course your talking about just causing damage and not killing. Dont you see how your logic breaks down? Jackson takes LONGER to kill a tank then an SU85. Yet somehow in your argument since it does more damage per shot its magically going to kill a tank that would otherwise speed away from an SU85? If you chase with a Jackson you LOSE the Jackson in almost all cases with any support. Its not worth the risk unless your talking about the final blow on a KT or Tiger. Both TDs are defensive. The Jackson does have any easier time pushing with support if you have the Micro due to its turret and its speed. But if you take Tank A and snare it then the SU85 will kill it faster. Its got a better gun. You just need to overcome its weaknesses. Its not viable in the meta because of the maps combined with how they overnerfed the SU85 combined with the crappy Tier cost. It has nothing to do with the SU85 quality of Penetration, Range and Damage. Since we are going into Scenerios let me give you this. Against a Heavy how do you site for the Jackson? Let me tell you! You PAY for it. Either with Fuel or Manpower. Any tank that sites is a potential loss and infantry will get butchered. This is something the SU85 DOESNT have to deal with. But again why use a slow fat TD when you can do better with high HP Mediums? Why? Give Easy 8s Mark Vehicle and NO ONE would use the Jackson...And an Easy 8 doesnt even have the HPs of a T34/85.... You seem to think and tow the party line that THE ONLY THING IN THIS GAME THAT MAKES OSTHEER T3 NOT VIABLE IS THE JACKSON!!!!11111 No Guards motor does the same thing. IS2 does the same thing. T3 sucks because MEDIUM TANKS just plain suck. Heavy Mediums are ok like the Panther and the T34/85 but actual Medium tanks anything with 640HPs or less are not cost effective for most players in the current Meta. In: COH2 Gameplay |
Thread: Jackson needs a slight buff13 Jan 2015, 16:52 PM
I dont need a Forum to tell me what the stats tell me. Does the Jackson kill more tanks in multiplayer then an SU85? SURE! Its used in almost every game. Why use an SU85 when you can do better with other options that are more useful? The USF has nothing more useful. But if for example you tomorrow gave 30 muni mines to the USF and gave them both Mark Vehicle and an SU85 then you would see it used and used effectively. Hell even giving the JP4 with mines to the USF you would also see it used and used effectively. There are many many many reasons not to use the SU85 as the Soviets. Just as there are many reasons to not use the JP4 as OKW. Also if tomorrow you gave the USF a no tech heavy tank call in option you would probably never see the Jackson again. No one likes a one trick pony in the armor department. Especially one that is expensive (SU85 with Tech, JP4). Cost will make a unit non viable. Evidently you have a short memory. When they first nerfed the SU85 and the IS2 and ISU hadnt yet received their buffs Soviet players used Mark and the SU85 as it was the only thing back then that would stop Panther spam. And they were used with copious amounts of mines. In: COH2 Gameplay |
Thread: Jackson needs a slight buff13 Jan 2015, 16:27 PM
I think the problem people are ignoring is that the Jacksons biggest weakness is it's low health and low armor. Really I think it's pen should say the same and it's damage be reduced. But it should have better armor and health. It's very mobile for a TD, and I think it having that mobility and the ability to take a hit would go a long way towards improving USF's late game without fucking over Ostheer harder. As it stands it already has a weaker gun then an SU85. Any nerf to it damage output without an increase in penetration would just make it total and complete crap. So if say we put its TTK a P4 to 20 seconds and make its Pen like that of a Panther it would balance out I think. Even if relic wants to plop a higher cost to it. Giving it more HPs would make it a bit easier to lose the game with. It needs to be able to tackle armor with over 1000HPs afterall being the Apex of USF AT. With a TTK a P4 of 20 seconds assuming that it would be shooting at a Tiger and up it would take around 35 seconds if 100% of the shots hit and penetrated. If you lower its damage and do not increase its Pen then your looking more like 60 seconds. So a Tiger can literally drive at a Jackson for a full minute without being destroyed. Keeping in mind a Jackson costs close to what a no tech Tiger costs. In: COH2 Gameplay |
Thread: soviet t3 and t4 cost issues....13 Jan 2015, 15:48 PM
Honestly, why dont we just buff the T-34 by either increasing damage, buffing the ram (before the nerf T-34 was viable), or decrease its cost. Why not increase the damage output or accuracy for SU-85? I just dont see a point of building non-doc unit at this point. 2-3 T-34s are almost worthless against OKW KT and Shrekblobs. SU85 already has the highest DPS of any non doctrinal TD in game. With Mark Vehicle there is no contest at all. It can kill armor faster then a Jackson by about 3 seconds even without Mark. Its gun is fine. Its mobility is not fine. Buffing its DPS would make it OP. It can kill a medium in about 13 Seconds with Mark. Could you imagine it killing Mediums in 10 seconds? Edit: And thats at Vet 0...at Vet....ewwwwwwww In: COH2 Balance |
Thread: Jackson needs a slight buff13 Jan 2015, 15:14 PM
So your ignoring the facts and putting in scenarios. Simple as that. The SU85 CAN kill armor better and especially with Mark Vehicle. Whether or not that is the meta is not relevant. There has been units with Turrets that did 240 Damage a shot since the game has been introduced. This means the ONLY thing that is special about the Jackson AT ALL is its mobility. Which is balanced by its terrible HPs and Armor. I can AS the Soviets do better with Dual T34/85s out of Guards Motor then I can with a Jackson. Then I have a combined 1600HPs doing 240 a shot at closer ranges and getting better Penetration as a result AND having AI. The 240 damage a shot at least in 1v1 where YOU CANT POSSIBLY have Mark Vehicle (as USF) is just a Straw Man. Especially when you consider there is no IS2 or ISU152 or hell even KV1 for USF. You can try all you want and throw in all this "What-Ifs" but the stats do not lie. All the Soviets need to do is snare a tank and the SU85 will do better then the Jackson. And Soviets do not lack snares. Now most people wont do that in the current meta because the Teching costs are fucked. That has nothing to do with the units. Edit: And sorry Double Zook rifles now that is hilarious. You must be talking about 4v4 there... In: COH2 Gameplay |
Thread: Jackson needs a slight buff13 Jan 2015, 14:42 PM
Your also forgetting that the Soviet faction has mines and AT nades. You kill snared tanks with the SU85 this has always been the case. Now if USF could run around planting 30 Muni mines everywhere and tossing AT nades rather then having to be Vet 1 and have the buggy often misfiring AT Rifle Nade then your point could stand. Big Damage Per Shot doesnt mean it kills anything faster. The SU85 still can drop a tank faster and much much faster with Mark Vehicle. Remember the SU85 DOES THE SAME DAMAGE PER SHOT AS THE JACKSON WHEN MARK VEHICLE IS UP. Hell even the T34/76 does(and it has a turret! Dear lord lets not talk about the T34/85!) OMGOP!!!! The damage is just that. Wow I can possibly do 240 damage to you before you blitz away rather than 160. Not to mention the lower Pen that the Jackson has. Oh yeah and of course it cant focus site.... Edit: Also in your example your going all balls to the walls crazy to take out a Tank Destroyer with a Tank? Thats like trying to throw Rifles at an Obersoldaten...You better have more then 1.... In: COH2 Gameplay |
Thread: 120mm Mortar M1943 - no counter, no weakness12 Jan 2015, 22:00 PM
Yes a Giant Soviet Bear wrestler. In: COH2 Balance |
Thread: Company of Blobs, if you only solo, dont read12 Jan 2015, 20:05 PM
The History Of Blob Warfare: Parts 1-9000 Just plain awesome. Thank you sir. In: COH2 Gameplay |
Thread: Something you wish you could do better12 Jan 2015, 20:01 PM
Dodging Rnade Squad Whipe monsters when fighting more then one Skirmish at once. I lose so many squads to that thing this patch. Just fighting fights in more then one location in general. I can micro one fight but the other I tend to get owned due to things like nades flying and me hearing it but not know which fight its happening in. In: COH2 Gameplay |
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