You should use the reload figures. since reload is a significant part of every engagement, and a defining factor on actual DPS. Also, you seemingly neglected to realise that G43 Grens only have 2 (two) G43s, whereas the entire Penal unit is armed with SVTs.
Key: Near / Medium / Far
Penals: 34.674 / 21.816 / 8.952
G43: 23.956 / 16.484 / 9.012
LMG: 28.423 / 18.848 / 9.273
These are the combined DPS figures for the entire unit, including reload.
PS: I calculated this same comparison about a month ago, but its buried under other posts. I could swear that Penals and G43 Gren had very close stats back then, but now, according to these figures, Penals seem to be much better.
Source- https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0ApmrrrPr20ncdEpuSHcxNko1VGVFYjczYXpFZWhqOHc#gid=0
Yes, Penals = Grens with G43s, comes out later in the game, and cost 50% more to reinforce and don't have AT nades or Orrah. Constant manpower drain crap. |
I disagree with this. Every single top-level player went through a phase of just spamming a ridiculous amount of games. It might have been 2 years ago or 2 months ago, but I guarantee you every single tournament winner went through something like that at least once.
Of course, playing a ton of games does not equate to success. But in order to be successful, you have to put in the time at least once. After that it becomes a lot easier to recover your previously attained skills in a short period of time.
CoH2 is still too young to have true top-level players; everybody is still terrible at this game, even if skills carried over from vCoH have accelerated the learning process. But go back to vCoH and look at that game's best players; of course, I wasn't around when you were, but from 2009 on you had players like Sepha, Seb, DrHorse, Sweix, SiberianPlatoon, Kot, Symbiosis, Aimstrong, 12azor, Gosu, and others who played massive amounts of games in close proximity to very deep tournament runs and/or victories. I can't think of a single player who didn't spam a ridiculous amount of games and managed to make it far in a vCoH tournament since 2009.
Well, yes, you do need to play a ton of games to be the best of the best. I was merely pointing out that some people are far more efficient at improving than others. Whether that's due to intelligence, ambition, or the purposeful studying of tactics is up to debate. |
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They seem terribly OP as they stand right now. |
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You don't need to play a lot to be good. You just have to play smart.
Some top players have very few games played. Then there are ppl like sageofthesix, who is good, but has thousands of games played. |
why are you comparing the stug and t70/su76 in a 1v1 fight? the stug is clearly an AI tank, its not really meant to fight tanks. a good player wouldnt leave a stug all alone in the first place, they would use it to support their infantry, so comparing them in a vacuum is pointless.
the stug E is quite good AI, much better than an su76. the only redeeming factor for the su76 is its very long range, better penetration and barrage ability. i dont think 60 munitions for a barrage makes it have "more AI ability", but it is better AT than the stug.
i will admit that the t70 is better AI than the stug though. thats not really an issue with the stug, but the t70. i think the t70 is too accurate, especially while moving. this is because moving doesnt affect scatter, so its just as accurate when moving or stationary. the stug will be moving and shooting far less since its slower and doesnt have a turret.
also, youre wrong about the stugs weak point ability. doesnt seem like youve ever used weak point before. that ability can never bounce. it penetrates 100% of the time and stuns its target.
The SU76 barrage ability is free actually. It's still bad AI though. |
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On a map with barely any buildings? Sure. |
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Pretty bad bug. |
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A better change is to just improve Penals and also decrease the build time of T1 and T2 buildings. |
You weren't asking me, but I'll give it a shot-
Cost- 200MP/60F would seem reasonable. About the price of a shock unit- the T70- not too little, so the german player can capitalize on seeing PPSHs with the appropriate counter (another MG?)- but not too much such that it becomes impractical.
What tier? After all conscript upgrades from the HQ, and after one of the two tiers (T1 or T2) are built. So that's 150 fuel- 25+25+40+60- from the start of the match, minus 40(?) fuel the soviet player starts with.
How many? 2 seems about fine currently. 2 PPSHs means conscripts still lose handily to Grenadiers with the LMG, but they put up a good fight and can win with a well placed molotov.
How do you justify it? Soviet teching places more emphasis on the Conscript as the mainline fighting unit, as seen from it being the only combat unit out of T0 and all other tiers taking a long time to build. This is as opposed to the Wehrmacht, where the T1 building is quick to finish and built right at the start usually, and provides a balanced mix of units that should supplement each other. Observe the rifle/volk dynamic in coh1- the rifle was better than the volk, and significantly better with BARs, but wehr T1 was balanced to american T1 because wehr T1 was built with the whole combined arms thing- MG, infantry, sniper- working together to fight american barracks with only one main fighting unit- the rifleman.
What does that mean in this context? The conscript squad could be better than the grenadier in terms of utility, and approach it it terms of combat strength, because the soviet system forces the soviet player to rely on the conscript alone for the early game whereas the german system promotes the use of the entire T1- not grenadier spam alone.
Ladder page? http://www.coh2.org/ladders/playercard/steamid/76561198047219124
+1, perfect reply. Although, I find PPSH to be terrible and hardly find it worth upgrading. HTD is way more useful than PPSH.
Also, Penals are utter trash. They are only good for their satchels which might wipe squads due to command lag. They lose HORRIBLY to LMG grens for cost. |
Penals rape Grens with lmg, just saying <.<
1. No, they don't. The fight can go either way. It all depends on if the flamers get lucky crits. Without flamers, they get OWNED.
2. They cost 50% more. Which means they actually lose horribly for cost.
3. They come out from an expensive and slow to build T1 building. Meaning they come out very late. You give up total map control while building the T1 building. |
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