wow this was very helpful,up until now I've been shuffling my conscripts in all possible tanks asses  thx
i havent done much testing of it so im not entirely sure how often it happens. theres also no stat i can just look up that would explain the chance of it either. my guess would be it has to do with if the tank is moving or not and maybe how close your conscripts are to the tank. thats just my guess though.
so dont expect your AT nade to penetrate a p4 100% of the time when thrown from the front, but it should be atleast slightly better than the 63% that the stats show. if youre able to, its still worth getting around the back of most german tanks. ostwind is probably the only one that it wont matter against. |
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i dont think the issue is flame duration or even its armor. its the damage. 1 shot from 1 of the halftracks flamers does 10 damage. 1 shot from the kv8 does 40 damage. thats the equivalent of an ostwind shell that has 100% accuracy, much bigger aoe, and a chance to instantly kill infantry.
people say ostwind is ridiculous, yet most of its shots miss. the reason it still does damage (but reduced damage, if you understand aoe in this game) is because of its aoe radius. the kv8 does FULL damage since it never misses. its fine that its a heavy tank and can take a beating. the damage is just insane. and for only 20 gas more.
could you imagine how many threads there would be if the ostwind performed that well? |
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theres one pretty big difference that isnt quite as obvious when just looking at their dps. pioneers fire 27-45 shots per reload with worse accuracy. engis fire 5 shots with better accuracy. their accuracy is indentical only when within 10m. the higher rate of fire makes the pioneers damage a bit more consistent, while the engis is more similar to burst damage. if the engis get a few lucky hits in a row (at 16 damage each hit compared to 2.3 for pios) they instantly gain the advantage.
this may not be relics reasoning, but thats how i see engi vs pio fights play out. if the engi is lucky, it wins. if its unlucky, it can be anyones fight. pioneers dps is much more stable. |
lots of misinformation in this thread, so i went ahead and added new sheets to our vehicle/AT statistics tab.
here is the complete vehicle sheet.
and here is the penetration chances for panzerfaust
and AT nade
also, pqumsieh has told me that becuase AT nades are thrown in an arc, they have a chance to hit the rear armor even if thrown from the front. panzerfausts do not have this chance since they fly straight. |
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i wouldnt really consider it op. youre supposed to pick bulletins that work with your play style. if you use lots of infantry, bulletins that increase inf hp/damage/accuracy will give you a slight advantage. thats the whole point. if your opponent also uses inf bulletins, they will pretty much cancel out and no one has the advantage.
if someone doesnt use much infantry, those bulletins wont have much influence on the game at all. so i dont think you can claim those influence the game more than others. its all dependent on your playstyle. i know people that use light vehicle bulletins. some use the pgren vet bulletin. i personally like gren bulletins with elefant rotation speed. |
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what endeav was way too lazy to type out is, there is no difference at all. all infantry have identical chances for all crits. so any squad, regardless of type, will have a 33% chance to blow up if it has a flamer. |
This makes me wonder do any of you play this game? Alot of people agree conscripts are useless, except you guys.
if youre talking about late game, youre somewhat right. they dont scale well into the late game and relic has said this was a deliberate decision. i assume it was to promote soviets using their elite infantry, which is why they are in almost every doctrine.
if youre talking about useless in early game as well, youre very wrong. multiple people have given you stats that show otherwise. a con squad is not squishier than grens and they do almost identical dps to grens. until you provide some sort of stats that show why theyre useless you dont really have any argument here. saying "alot of people agree" isnt a very good argument. youve given no facts, just opinion. |
Nice post, but there are threads that more comprehensively detail them.
If people bothered to search the forums back, they are pretty clearly labelled and still valid, since there has been no change to bulletins or Cons since then.
im sure there are, but he wasnt just asking for math, he wanted opinions on which of those bulletins was worth using. is there actually a search function for old threads? i cant find one if there is. that makes it pretty hard to find old threads, especially if you arent sure one exists in the first place. i just quickly glanced through the first 20 pages and didnt see anything on bulletins like you described. its honestly easier to just answer his question, although you have a point. if everyone does that, theres going to be a ton of repetitive threads. but id say thats a reason for them to add a search function, not a reason to stop being helpful to other people.
also, i was referring to, "Not that you give a shit about stats."
maybe you guys had a disagreement in another thread or something, but i dont think anything in his post warranted that response. |
Dramatically increasing rotation speed would help fix this, and be realistic, as catepillared vehicles turn VERY fast on the spot, as very different from wheeled vehicles.
Unfortunately, this would fuck all kinds of other things ingame.
Still, in theory, it would help compensate for bad pathing.
and the effectiveness of all tanks without turrets would also increase dramatically. not really an option |
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damn nullist. way to be a dick.
joker, im guessing youre talking about 5% damage, 3% health, and 2% accuracy bulletins. these are all pretty minor differences, but thats what bulletins are supposed to be. heres the math.
damage:
16*1.05=16.8
health:
80*1.03=82.4
accuracy:
near:.5*1.02=.51 far:.25*1.02=.255
molotov range:
15*1.05=15.75
so of these bulletins, molotov range is pretty worthless. .75 range will barely ever make a difference. health will probably give you the biggest difference. weapons that deal 80 damage (mortars, rifle nade, bundle nade) will no longer 1 shot a full hp con with that bulletin. also, ostwinds deal 40 damage, so it will take 3 hits to kill rather than 2. as for the damage and accuracy, those will increase your dps, but the effects are pretty minor. a 5% damage boost or 2% accuracy boost will translate directly into a 5% or 2% dps boost respectively. so damage is obviously the better choice, although accuracy should make your dps a tiny bit more consistent.
molotov is working properly. a big complaint right now is weapon teams dont die quickly enough. relic is working on fixing that, but its not a molotov issue. molotovs dont function like rifle nades obviously. rifle nades deal all their damage on impact. molotovs deal less damage on impact, but then burn squads that remain in the area. theres also a chance for it to instantly kill entities if youre lucky. if the unit moves out of the fire right away, molotovs will not be very effective.
edit: abdul just mentioned what i was talking about. if an entity has >50% hp, it has a 5% to burn instantly. if an entity has <50% hp, the chance goes up to 10%. that means theoretically you could kill an entire squad instantly if youre lucky enough. obviously wont happen alot, but the molotov has much more variability in its effect. |
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