Sov seems to consistently gain CP faster than Ost does.
I've had a niggling feeling before, but never specifically paid attention to it.
Anyone else noticed this kind of thing?
anytime i pay attention to CP it seems even. i havent directly tested it, ive looked at it when testing other things. for example i tested sector artillery not long ago. to get the CPs for that, i had a friend suicide cons at my mgs. his CPs stayed even (or atleast very close) to mine even though he wasnt getting kills or doing damage.
my guess is the CPs use the old system for unit xp. it used to be 50% for dealing damage and 50% for taking damage. they changed unit xp to 75% for damage dealt and 25% for damage recieved. i bet they didnt change the CP system though. just my guess though, i really have no idea how CPs work. |
Well for one the Germans could build tank traps, and then get some MG42s behind them to quite easily make something that's very hard to break through. The Russians can't do that. Second, Germans have heavy tanks that can crush tank traps (or least they could in vCoH) that they can build without having to choose a specific doctrine. The Russians only have the ISU-152 and the IS-2, which you need to choose a specific doctrine for.
whaat? germans cant build tank traps... or are you talking about vcoh? its hard to tell
also germans have no heavy tanks that arent doctrinal. panthers are not heavy tanks. i guess brummbar is considered a heavy, but its an assault gun. |
No, the weapons used are different and so are the damage output values. Conscripts with PPsH not only get just 2 PPsH(As opposed to Shocks getting 6), the PPsH with the Conscript upgrade is a different weapon model and puts out different damage values to the Shocktrooper PPsH.
Really, what do you want? You're paying 20 manpower to reinforce instead of 45. This is a trade off. If you have a problem with the reinforcement cost, then compromise. Otherwise, suck it up. Shocktrooper models are incredibly powerful. You pay the 480MP to get a high DPS squad on the field that has several grenade options and is initially extremely durable. You pay double the price for the impact of such a powerful unit, and then you maintain the DPS and special grenades by merging them with Conscripts. What is your problem?
i dont know about using a different weapon model, but they use the exact same stats. there actually isnt 2 files for ppsh. theres only one file named shocktroop ppsh, which the conscripts also use. youre right that cons only get 2 and shocks get 6 though. |
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damaged engines reduce vehicle speed with a .4 modifier. blitzkrieg gives a 2 modifier. that means even with blitz, vehicles with engine damage only move at .8 of their normal speed. i had no idea lambos were so slow.
also, snipers have 5 more range than mgs. setting up an mg to fight snipers and su85s is a horrible suggestion. its outranged by both of them. waste of mp and, worst case, you just gave the soviets a free mg42. then, those pgrens are going to have a much harder time walking up to the su85s |
right now i only remember the damage values of flame weapons i posted in some other thread.
it was 13 damage for hand-held flamers, 20 (2x10) damage for the SdKfz 251 dual flamer and 40(!) damage for the KV-8 flamer.
that number alone is op by all means. the weapon performance of the 251 flamer is already pretty bad ass in my eyes and the KV-8 doubles this performance. that's insane.
a single damage tick brings down any infantry man to 50% health and therefore have a 10% chance to brun-crit him right away. if not, the second tick will grill an infantry nevertheless.
i don't clearly remember the rate of fire of flamers but i think it is simply 1 over the board. that's just enough for the KV-8:
40 damage -> 1sec -> 40 damage ....
all infantry men only have 80 health, so there will be a kill crit with the 2nd hit. so its no joke when people are talking about "killing within a sec".
in addition to this come the general, reliable characteristics of flame weapons basicly always hitting, doing area damage and surpassing infantry armor, as well as the pretty nice and resilient platform this weapon comes on.
i havn't found any other weapon yet that is soo cleary op by its stats alone.
thank god the meta isnt encouraging players to get KV-8s which doesnt mean they definitly need an adjustment.
as a personal note:
i often see poeple arguing "yeah its op but XYZ is also op and that 'balances' this out."
I think cant even express to you how stupid and wrong by itself such an statement is. sorry but it is soo dumb.
just don't do it. No. Just don't.
regards
ace
your damage and rate of fire numbers are correct. flamers also have accuracy of 11, which i believe means they never miss. |
ZiS requires 3-4 shots to destroy a FlameHT,first shot hits,then the HT just goes around the ZiS and we have fried Soviets for lunch 
And about the damage,that was just my opinion don't know the stats and maybe was bad micro but 4 Conscript squads burned in mere seconds,I was like Wtf just happened?  )
it only takes 2 hits to kill a ht. 320 hp. ZiS does 160 damage |
Me plays COH2, you? Piv kills 3-4 Conscripts with one shot, very very often. It almost never kills more than 1-2 Rifle guards or Shocks with one shot.......
I don't see how you logically concluded that T34 must wipe out grens with one shot....
Because they are are both tanks shooting @ infantry? or because T34 is better?
ha do you realize how you contradicted yourself there?
tanks dont care what infantry theyre shooting at. armor is irrelavent. so shooting cons/guards/shocks is all the same. they all die in 1 hit since they only have 80 hp. so either youre exaggerating cons or exaggerating guards/shocks. i think its the first one.
he very logically concluded that t34 would wipe grens in 1 shot because based on your claims, a panzer 4 can wipe 4 men in a shot very consistently. a t34 has less scatter than a p4 (meaning its better vs inf), with the same aoe, so it should kill an entire squad of grens if what you say is true... |
It is the same people who wont admit the Germans are just the better faction, Great frontine troops with lmgs and good veterancy bonuses, mgs that supress and does more damage then maxims and turbo mortar s.
hahah vet bonuses are identical for infantry at vet 3. |
I dont know who you are playing VS, but I would be extremely disappointed in myself if I allowed squad of grens to freely come in behind my t34 and then fire of pfaust at it.
That situation would result, vs any decent player, in you losing your grens to T34 without firing of that pfaust.
Your theoretical analysis and scenario only do one thing and that is, you don't actually play as Soviet and haven't actually tried to put it in practice.
-You cannot AT nade scout car, only promote it. so conscripts are useless
-You WILL suffer high losses with low possibility attempting to AT nade damage Piv engine. Semi-useless
-you can cap points with conscripts late game but eng are much better option to have: you can have flame, mine sweeper (mind you, some people actually mine their points as defensive measure) plus you can reapair and build stuff. Why would you chose conscripts?
So yeah Conscripts are semi-useless and rifle grens and eng are much more versatile combo to have
you cant AT nade a scout car? since when? you say engineers are more versatile.. what will they do against a scout car?
same with late game. you claim that lmgs, pgrens or scout cars will deny conscripts. what will engis do against that? flamer isnt enough to counter any of that. |
as long as PZIV is called FINE when it can smash a T-34/85 head on with ease and 2 PZIV can deal with a JS-2 no problem, KV-8 is FINE
My point, PZIV a Tier3 medium tank should not have the same damage alpha(160) as a JS-2 and Tiger or Panther tank, and reload is the fastest among them
you conveniently ignored the fact that the p4 also has the weakest armor and lowest penetration out of all of them. |
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