Antitank guns are supposed to fight tanks, obviously. If anything, I think the Soviet AT-gun underperforms vs. armor. I agree that six man crews are an issue, and screws upp the COH-formula, but I dont see making tanks effectively counter AT-guns doing much good for the game.
It would turn the game into even more of a rush for fuel and tech, something wich this game certainly dont need. |
I think they underestimated the word of mouth effect. COH1 wasnt only "the highest rated RTS of all time". Whenever I read through threads on gaming forums where people were asking about what RTS they should buy I would always find noumerous post reccomending COH1. It was such a good game that it provided its own PR by simply beeing godd, and pretty much sold itself.
COH2 has gotten a reputation for being P2W, in addition to being a dissapointment, compared to the original. I dont see people on forums reccomending the game, and contrary to COH1, the design provides itself with bad PR.
My point is, even though the game is improving and getting much better, I think whatever they do it will be to little to late. Simply changing the DLC model now isnt realistic, as the dammage is already done, and putting that much work into the game probably wouldnt be worth it. Hopefully they have learned, so they dont repeat the same mistakes when COH3 hopefully will be made. |
Thread: Ram 7 Mar 2014, 08:48 AM
I will answer it with Shazz's comment because it perfectly illustrates the situation:
There's nothing more that needs to be said here. Ram is a stupid but presently necessary gimmick. Remove ram and give soviets more AT in other areas, either in the form of infantry AT or upgunning the T34. End of story.
Something wich we seemed to agree about a couple pages ago. Again, I have no idea how you got this worked upp, but I see no point in arguing for the sake of arguing. We seem to agree about ram for the most part. We could either leave it at that, or you could start bringing up irrelevancies to argue about, like you just did.
On the side note. I write my comments in context, and they should be read and answered as such. Trying to defeat points out of context (one by one) means that one is trying to win argument not argue the point.
FYI: you split those paragraphs up yourself, and I answered them in the order you listed them. You are kind of grasping at straws when you start criticising me for answering your post the way you divided it yourself. |
Thread: Ram 6 Mar 2014, 17:08 PM
I didn't misread your comment or got it wrong.
Yet you totally misunderstood the entire point of my example from using ram myself.
What I am saying is: you cannot just go on ramming any tiger you see. You can attempt to, but most good players will just inflict a lot of MP and resources drain on you, if you go on ramming their well supported Tigers/Panthers.
Noone is saying you can. Simply that the mechanic of T-34s, in a 1v1 situation, rendering Tigers useless in a diceroll is a really bad mechanic, that itself dosent promote skill.
Unless you plan your attack well, and execute it well, and have sufficient force to back up the ram and finish of the target tank. The only thing that will get hurt is ramming T34, Panther/Tiger gets repaired straight away.
Goes without saying. That dosent change the mechanic of ram itself, wich you seemed to agree was a bad one just a couple pages ago.
So your analogy of how you don't have to think about anything and just press ram button is bias, in my opinion.
Its a huge difference between pulling of a ram, and a kill. Though I think we both agree that if you saved up for your armys most expensive tank, you will probably be weaker in regards to the rest of you army, compared to the guy who just wasted his cheapest.
If you go around marauding with Tiger, get rammed and lose your Tiger. Well you deserve it.
Obvioulsy, in the form of enemies exploiting your exposed flanks and outmanouevering you. Prefferably not by the enemy light tank driving into you frontally to render your tank useless.
So people disagreeing with you are defensive and angry? And you are calm and rational, I see
Not all people of course, but the ones who cant discuss without making assumptions about me, and my "love" for certain unspecified units, obviously are. As you said yourself:you hate ram, yet here you are arguing against me, even though it seems like we agree on most points. |
Thread: Ram 5 Mar 2014, 09:01 AM
Hey, you brought up example of how easy it is to ram Tiger in the ass in narrow street. I don't see how me mentioning combined arms reflects on me, rather than on your bias example.
Im sorry, you got it all wrong. I brought upp an example of how luring the enemy into that street wasnt easy at all, and how much I enjpyed ramming that Tiger when I did a lot of planning and positioning to set up the ambush. Point was, when I realised that I didnt have to do anything of that, and could just have rammed him head on anyways, ramming wasnt fun anymore.
You asked why people don't see problem with ram, most do. But not in way you represent it.
See you find problem being ram in isolation, an awkward and tactically uninteresting ability.
I think what I did ask was why some of you cant discuss issues like this without getting all defensive, and asuming a lot about other people. I didnt know how sensitive some people are.
I find the problem with ram to be other awkward units and abilities as well, that cannot be excluded.
Why would someone use combined arms if you can negate skilled player taking up positions with simple click of the button, like strafing run that hangs for 5 min?
There goes your button and at nade, leaving those SU85's pretty much defenseless vs Panther/PG's
I have no idea what you are trying to say. Im no fan of straferuns, and there are a lot of units and abilities I have voiced an oppinion in other threads. Thing is, this is the "ram"-thread, as I am sure you have noticed. Bringing up the problems with ram therefore would be quite natural in my oppinion.
If you cannot see the larger problem in game design, then as you said: 'its pointless to talk anymore'
You just keep going dont you? I have talked about different shortcomings of the game at countless occations, the Soviet faction in particulair. I have stated several times that whatever happens to ram the Soviet faction should be compensated, and I have been verry critical of a lot of the design decitions of the game. This is the thread called "ram" though. Should give you an idea why I comment on the ram ability. |
Thread: Ram 3 Mar 2014, 19:10 PM
Because you are mentioning one single thing out of game full of gimmicky abilities, units and call-ins.
Posting in the "ram"-thread I am sure you can figure out why that is.
Then you are having biased opinion, and giving example that suits only your biased opinion
I think you illustrate my earlier point quite well, by getting all defensive and assuming that others are biased. I use ram a lot myself, and I am aware that russians needs something to even out the AT-gap. I have stated that in other discussions about ram and agreed that if ram was removed Soviets would need something to compensate.
You make ram look like 'i win ability' that there is no defense against, when it isn't so.
FYI, others play against and use Ram. It's affected by RNG in both directions, sometimes it hurts Soviet Player sometimes it hurts German player.
Again, I have written this on several occations. Ram is to RNG-dependant, and is frustrating for both the rammer and rammed. Wasting a t-34 isnt fun, and having your heavy tank rendered useless isnt either.
I hate Ram, and a lot of other people that are arguing with you and other biased opinions are not very happy with Ram ability.
Yet here I am arguing with you about Ram. That should be a clue for you
If thats the case, I have no idea what you are doing right now. You seem to have assumed I was some kind of german fanboy out to nerf the Soviets, when it seems we are in total agreement about ram. Awkward.
You are not objective in your analysis and offer absolutely no alternative or insight into what would happen if this annoying ability is removed without adequate nerfs to units you love or replacing it with something that is capable of performing the same thing.
Units I love? Its a game, I dont love units in a game. If its that serious to some of you guys I obviously stepped into a hornets nest. I gave my oppinion about an ability in the game and a suggestion for a change. I never said changes would have to happen in a vacuum, and I have, as mentioned, said that Soviets should be compensated somehow.
Ram is specifically designed to give Soviet army weapon against German 'heavies' as you called them, not to ram halftracks or stugs
Most people aren't stupid enough to stand in front of the 2 Su85's and Zis gun for 5 minutes with their Tiger or Panther.
Most people support their Panthers and Tigers and it is very hard to kill them with the ram, let alone trying to button them down for 5 minutes with rifles while they are supported by their own 'German combined arms'(yes that exist as well)
All well and good. As it seems we both agree that the AT-gap should be filled by something less awkward and more tacticly interesting than ram I dont se any reason to argue further. I honestly think your las line says more about you than it does about me though. |
Thread: Ram 2 Mar 2014, 21:12 PM
There needs no adjustment to Ram it has already been adjusted and is fine. Hit panzer tactician smoke it WILL break ram even in process. So will Faust. Tiger isn't meant to be an attack move/win unit. L2p
That is of course your oppinion. I dont think ram is a good ability and think it should be reworked regardless of balance, wich I havent critisized at all.
Now, why is it that hard for you, and others like you, to discuss certain aspects of the game without working yourselves up and getting all angry? This "shut upp, L2p"-attitude strikes me as kind of absurd. Its a discussion regarding aspect of a game, nothing to get all worked upp about. |
Thread: Ram 2 Mar 2014, 18:26 PM
Skill to pull off? Have you ever used ram? You have to be at a certain distance. You have to make sure there is nothing in the way, and you have to hope your opponent is caught off guard so he can't simply back away. You have to make sure not to get an engine damage by grens or mines to even attempt to pull it off.If you fail at any of those you get a 280 mp and 85 fuel investment that is dead in the water, and even if you do mangage to do all of that you get about a 60% CHANCE at disabling a heavy tank and your tank that you used to ram is completely useless until repaired. I don't know any other ability that has that many requirments to use.
And if you lose even a single T34 you can say goodbye to your number advantage. And considering the T34 can't penetrate the BACK of the tiger 50% of the time they aren't really good for direct combat with armor. There is only 2 situations where a smart soviet player will even attempt a ram. Either they can not destroy the target with convetional means (which is often due to lacking AT options) or the target is well behind enemy lines where the ramming tank can be easily repaired at which point you have no one but yourself to blame for having a unsapported tank so far away from your troops.
so what is it you are exactly do you want add that will add more "skill" to this ability?
Please read the post quoted above. If you did, you would find that I explained excactly what I wanted to be implemented to improve the ram ability.
Skill to pull off? Have you ever used ram?
Again, read the abovementioned post and you will find that I obviously have.
Feel free to comment on my suggestion, or give us your suggestions. I see a lot of people going all defensive, and I dont think it benefits any of us. |
Thread: Ram 2 Mar 2014, 13:22 PM
It sounds like a text for Meme
You lured Tiger into narrow street and rammed it in its ass, didn't even need to outsmart the enemy?
Anyone who goes into narrow street with Tiger, doesn't need outsmarting. He is retarded by default....
That might be. Point remains, ram wouldnt feel as awkward if it required some skill and manouver to pull off, and it would feel all that more rewarding when you actually did. |
Thread: Ram 1 Mar 2014, 20:01 PM
What if they implemented a limit to the ammount of damage a t-34 could take, while ramming, so that a frontal ram at a Tiger would probably fail unless the Tiger was distracted? That would make the ram require a minimum of skill to pull off, and make it all the more rewarding when it worked. It would also make sure rams against heawys would be harder, while rewarding skill and tactics.
The first time I pulled a ram I lured the enemy Tiger into a narrow street, manouevered a T-34 to the back, using truesight for cover, and rammed him in the rear, having the rest of my armour at the flank. It was great fun and fealt extremely rewarding. Once I realised that I didnt have to outsmart him and could just as easily ram him head on it wasnt fun anymore. |