Is that a yes from you that it's worth the 70mu cost?
Certainly, as long as you're comfortable with the limited option of commanders and their more long range defensive focused use compared to Bars they're an excellent option. |
VSL is stronger alternative. Funnily enough PG G43 are worth using after so many years of been meme upgrade.
I've heard a lot about G43 Pgrens being able to rompstomp over whatever they want but I've never seen it in action. What's the stat difference between their default STG's vs the G43 upgrade that makes them so superior? |
Thread: Abandon5 Feb 2021, 20:30 PM
I do understand the need to minimize that kind of RNG when its actual money at stake.
But then again, they already play on a mod which removes it.
No one is getting paid anything on ranked nor ranked is limited in any way to anyone however.
I have played DoW3 and its scary how CoH2 becomes more and more like DoW3 gameplay wise with removal of all the series defining traits.
I've played DoW2 when synch kills were removed from all units but heroes.
Did it help competitive play? Sure it did. But it also killed defining feature of DoW series, DoW3 never had any synch kills and there was massive community outrage about it too.
I would hate to see CoH go the same way, because if people keep complaining as they do and these features will get nerfed to the ground and then removed, we might see DoW3 CoH edition in the future.
My understanding of DoW3's failure was a smorgasbord of absolute failure that alienated everyone in some way or form be it game mechanics, artstyle, core features removed, and just terrible support all around. I don't think Coh2 is going to go down that route since the core game is in place and is enjoyed by the small but loyal playerbase that already exists and considering the major change being discussed in this thread is at best an obscure event that will probably only be changed to be less game swingy in the off chance it does happen you probably don't have to worry about the game going into DoW3 territory.
The thing that does worry me though is how absolutely fucked the recent 64 bit and map patch was. Also it's such a minor thing but it speaks volumes to the professionalism of the patch, but the 1v1 and 2v2 maps still after multiple map patches do not have correct labeling when it comes to what gamemode they are for " (2) Crossroads" this part. With the last map patch still having (1) and (2) for 1v1 and 2v2 respectively, while this map patch all of the new maps have no player indicator at all. It's just sloppy and shows a complete lack of care indicative of laziness or lack of desire on part of whoever was overseeing this update. I just sure hope I'm wrong though. |
Thread: Abandon5 Feb 2021, 19:47 PM
i dont think voicing against the removal of core mechanics like abandon and mgc is due to lack of basic understanding of the game.
again, your post proves what i felt earlier. about the elistist pov, discussing on concepts like this, concepts over in game results, about shooting down people, about randomness is bad mechanics, about the need to align with the hulks and the 'pros', about lack of contribution because some are not elite enough to join in the chorus for removal of abandon.
i guess life is bad mechanic too.
You are a daft boy and you make me angry.
My only hope is you come around and change your perspective, but until then have fun in rank 2000 forever with your unwillingness to learn and baseless claims with no merit as everyone laughs at you for your willful incompetence while anyone who tries to help you is labeled elitist. I only hope for your sake that doesn't carry over into your personal life. |
Thread: Abandon5 Feb 2021, 19:20 PM
i watched dozens of tightrope and ae casts. i played dozens of 2v2 rank 1000. i dont remember an abandon tank becomes an i win thing. it is still a p4, and tiger, a t34, and it stills need to be recrew..
again, i feel like you are just arguing against the concept from an elitist pov, rather than something that has badly affected the game.
Your judgement of balance is already lacking given your insistence that the Brumbar is now UP with a 3% addition chance to Pen against it. It does not surprise me that you lack any and all understanding of the concept of resource advantage.
This does not come from an elitist perspective. It comes from a perspective of basic understanding of the game and it's working mechanics enough that I can freely comment on topics I can conceptually and practically understand. You should opt to post less authoritatively on topics you have little understanding of and seek to be more inquisitive from those who do. Eventually with enough learning you'll even reach a point where you can provide meaningful contribution yourself.
For an example, I just a few months ago considered Ass grens OP. Instead of whining and complaining how they're unbeatable I took the time to do a little research, play more games, and come to understand how to properly beat them with better unit positioning and a more tailored strategy to countering them. Now I can impart that wisdom onto others instead of perpetually complaining that they ruin the game. |
Thread: Abandon5 Feb 2021, 18:55 PM
how many games have you lost to abandon btw? do you just critise this mechanical because it does not conform to predicable expectations?
the counterplay is to destroy or recrew your abandon tanks. i mean if you allowed the opponents to crew and repair and reused against you, why cant you do it faster than them?
Did you read anything I said? Do you comprehend words and concepts? This has nothing to do with my personal experience with abandon. It happens for me, it happens against me. It's fundamentally poorly designed is my point because it doesn't fit with other concepts of RNG the game is based around. The point of RNG mechanics is to provide a working system for conceptual play for strategic purposes while not having every result be purely binary in minor way with a win if I "x" or lose if I "y" way. Abandon and MGC deny strategic play, and if they happen will result in a much more severe I win the game if I "x" (Get the abandoned vehicle) or lose the game if I "y" (Opponent gets the abandoned vehicle).
Yes you can sometimes destroy the vehicle, sometimes you can't. When you can't the game is lost for whoever is on the unfortunate side of the abandon. The defending player is almost always going to result with the abandoned tank because players generally will be fighting over the defending players side of the map and the attacking player will likely have a lot more losses due to being the attacker. Like I literally don't know how to explain this to you any better.
Final try, Accuracy and Pen RNG mechanics good because strategy fun, Abandon and MGC mechanics bad because no strategy not fun. |
Commander have a lot to do with faction design since they influence the performance of core units directly or fill blank spots in core roster. So they have to be looked at when you are balancing the core game.
The problem with that is that you need to set a baseline for the commanders to work around. Attempting to balance every single aspect of the game as a whole is a surefire way to result in disaster because you're playing with entirely too many variables that co-exist within, apart, and combined with each other.
If fundamentally fixing core factions results in breaking commanders temporarily that's probably okay, Commanders can be fixed afterwards when you have a stable operating table of a faction to base the commanders around.
The reason the Soviets work so well is because they have a solid well-rounded if a bit weak base to structure themselves around which allows their commanders to provide the punch required to push them above the line. Guards, Shocks, T-34/85, KV-1 IS-2, Dshk MG, etc all of these things provide interesting ways for a Soviet player to play their style of game.
The Brits are an absolute mess across the board in terms of their core design (primarily due to Infantry Sections) which results in their doctrines having wildly outdated tools, insanely powerful abilities, weird off timing items, and and just overall janky things because these are hamfisted attempts at fixing the faction and relics (heh) of a bygone era when the faction operated differently. |
Thread: Abandon5 Feb 2021, 18:25 PM
what? im open with tweaking abandon and randomness but against completely dropping it unlike pip
im definitely against the elitist view that randomness is a low skill low effort mechanic
Okay. In that case let me try to explain the point of RNG mechanics in a way that helps you differentiate good and bad rng.
So lets take a Gren vs Conscript match up. In every case that occurs (not just arbitrary ones), accuracy dictates that the Grens will win at long range because their long range accuracy chance is higher than the conscripts. The random roll of accuracy says that when given the odds, Grens will hit more shots at distance killing and forcing away the cons. So as the Soviet player, your goal is to maximize your accuracy by getting as close as possible since your numerical superiority and higher relative accuracy at close range will out muscle the Grens and force them away. This is how to use RNG mechanics to provide a dynamic and interesting fight because there is always the odds that the Conscripts at long range will plink a Gren model early, or the Grens will bully the Cons but in likely odds the winner will be whoever takes the engagement correctly and at worst you will have a 40 to 60 Manpower penalty for not being in the gods favor. Hardly a punishment but enough to keep things interesting. This is a core tenant of the game in many facets.
Now, when you take abandon or MGC mechanics. Things turn a lot harder in a negative way. The high rarity of these instances means that you cannot actively frontline consider them when making decisions as they often run counter-productive to winning an engagement. Not to mention if you were to consider them as your primary concern, games would quickly become defensive slogs with no interesting attacks and mere poking at each other from distance. Some people might like that but lord are they boring to play and to watch. But anyway, when looking at the other instance of RNG in the above paragraph, the main selling point is that it provides a constantly applying dynamic way to maneuver and take engagements to provide yourself the highest chance of success. You cannot fundamentally do this with abandon or MGC because they are arbitrarily divvied out by raw rng with no pre-emptive counter play. They happen on a whim and when they do happen in such an uncontrollable fashion you often lose the game as you've taken a roughly 400-800 Manpower disadvantage, and a 100 - 200 Fuel Disadvantage. This is harsh and destructive unlike a small engagement that results in a minor manpower loss. Those resources going directly to your enemy or being taken away from you in these instances is unpreventable in any logical scenario.
I just want you to see how it's not the act of RNG that people are upset with seeing as the game is based around the concept, but the implementation of it that goes against core game philosophy and only causes frustration when it occurs. It's a mechanic that actively hurts the game. |
Thread: Abandon5 Feb 2021, 17:39 PM
removing abandon mgc and randomness is not improving coh. stop putting 'top' players up the pedestal.
and eek sports is not comparable to real sports if it chases chess like outcome. thats a fact.
Look, you need to stop whining and repeating yourself. You said what you had to say, for the love of god stop multiposting the same thing 100 times over. Just because you say it more than anyone else doesn't make you right.
Holy shit man.
Also top players are top players because they are good at the game and understand it to a degree that provides them a unique benefit to providing accurate information and (hopefully) reasonable input into changes. People are allowed to disagree or question their input based on whatever information that individual player has but if all of your input is mindless "I don't like strategy in my strategy game keep bad mechanics" that is asinine. If you want a WWII game without strategy, you shouldn't be playing a Real-Time-Strategy game. There are plenty of others to choose from where you can have mindless fun.
Obviously you're not in the crowd of people who play the game for any strategic purpose, but changing abandon (not removing) affects more than just the top upper echelon of players. It affects basically everyone in the top 1500 for every faction who even if they aren't very good at the game, still want to win and outplay their opponent which the abandon mechanics undermine. Your sheer and utter disregard for anyone who dares even consider playing the game above your level for a change that you won't even fundamentally notice baffles me. The only non-degrading thought I have is that you are either uninformed of how many people abandon affects, or you're simply being a contrarian for contrarian's sake. |
Thread: Abandon5 Feb 2021, 16:49 PM
Honestly Tournament and Automatch should be using the same balance patches, which should be the one tailored for "Tournament mode". It doesn't make sense for the game to change between the two "modes", and it makes things even less consistent.
I agree completely, but for lack of changing automatch abandon immediately, I'm glad the tournament mod exists for tournaments atleast until it gets changed. |