I think everyone more or less agrees that there is a very high chance of the real Deadbolt being a hacker, if we assume that to be the case... doesn't it make sense that he would suddenly be able to beat players above his skill?
No, because map hacking doesn't increase your CPM and make an average player learn the mechanics of the game and game sense. When Deadbolt cheated it was blatantly obvious as he simply isn't a good player and can't hide the use of hacks. You could say he didn't even bother hiding the use of maphacks by the way he played. Just look at those satup replays.
If the D E A D B O L T account that is currently rank 1 UKF 1v1 played like this people would have noticed way earlier.
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I have been watching this thread since the beginning and have remained silent. I thought most of those clips were inconclusive with perhaps a few suspicious exceptions, which I believed to be excellent game sense/luck. Most of the clips were neutralized when more context was provided for review.
Regardless of Seeking's play, it was determined that he was playing on his uncle's account (who had map hacked prior if my understanding is correct) after being warned not to.
My only question, and I apologize if was answered already, what was the 100% crystal clear evidence that he was playing as Deadbolt? I imagine this should be straight forward as it was the evidence used to give Seeking his ban.
Thanks for helping me understand!
CPM analysis and the fact that Seeking is miles ahead of deadbolt in terms of skill. If an average player suddenly beats very good players in 1v1 and 2v2 there is obviously something strange going on. |
So the big takeaway here should be that Relic looked at the evidence and determined that "there is nothing definitive". That should have been the end of it IMO. Instead we got some random explanation about how Coh2 has 2 CMs now or some other nonsense.
Sure looks like a witch hunt to me. I feel bad for Seeking for having to go through this. Shameful shit.
The thing that needs to be understood here is that no one at Relic is actually capable of deciding if someone is map hacking or not. They don't have functioning tools to check for hacks and they also don't have any people working for them that are actually familiar with competitive C0H2. The way these cases have been handled in the past was that people contacted Sturmpanther with their suspicions and then Sturmpanther checked for hacks by watching replays (as well as asking other respected high-level community members for their opinion). It seems that in this case Sturmpanther and the community asked Relic to ban Seeking but they declined because Seeking is a "high-profile case". This might also have something to do with the new community manager we recently got. It would be very naive to think that Relic and their skeleton crew could actually watch a replay and decide if a person is map hacking. To spot hacks and judge a replay you need to be a good player with competitive experience (the likes of which were mentioned in the first google document). |
From how I read the messages, Relic refused to ban Seeking due to lack of evidence even before everything went public.
Yes and that's what I feel is a bit weird considering I am sure Relic would have banned other people if presented with the same evidence. This is also confirmed by seeking's document where a screenshot shows how Relic literally says that in a "high profile" case like this there needs to be more evidence than in regular cases.
For me this seems unfair as standards applied for banning people for map hacking should be the same no matter their popularity. |
Did seeking get banned from automatch? You're comparing apples and oranges.
No he wasn't which is exactly my point. Preferential treatment. |
Wrong! Stupid! Ridiculous!
You are mixing up two completely different scenarios. ML is not Relic, ML doesn't ban players from the game, ML is a community funded effort and as such there is always some sort of collective decision about "big" actions. Suspending/Banning someone FROM ML has always in ML history been done via consensus of patreons.
Since Relic didn't see fit to help us out in a timely fashion, Sturmpanther and A_E took it up on themselves to publicly present the problem based on some very serious accusations in order to protect the integrity of the tournament and start gauging opinion of Patreons about the situation. Whether that was right thing to do or not, it is debatable.
Every single in-game ban thus far has been issued by Relic. Sometimes based on community provided proof or based on their own investigations. WE DID NOT HAVE THE LUXURY OF RELIC'S ASSISTENCE this time around and that was clearly stated when this whole mess started.
As part of the investigations into hacking, we discovered other proof and decided to act based on what we know 100% in order to avoid further controversy and splitting of Patreons' vote and Seeking was accoringly suspended from ML within a day and a half.
This has nothing to do with race, ethnicity, country or whatever color of panties Deadbolt wears. Please stop with "woke" liberal BS, you are plain wrong.
Please read what I wrote and try to understand my point. What you just wrote has nothing to do with my point.
I have never said that the ML and its organizers ban players from COH2.
My point is that Seeking has received preferential treatment compared to an average coh2 players when confronted with hacking accusations. The point is this: Some random automatch player would have never gotten a chance to defend himself. He would have just been banned by Relic and that would have been it. Meanwhile Seeking had the chance to explain everything and has now not been banned even though the presented evidence would have easily gotten someone else banned. |
Complete and utter BS. That situation never happened. I see you are relatively new but don't just spew pathetic nonsense out.
Historically speaking, community organized tournaments have always reacted to Relic bans, regardless of the player's stature. If Relic bans your account, well guess what? You have no game client to play the tournament on. There is no SOMEBODY and NOBODY, if you are a cheater you get banned.
If Seeking was some random Asian or Eastern European automatch player he would be banned already just because of the clips. He wouldn't have been allowed to respond to the claims either. Seeking recieved very preferential threatment and if you think this is wrong I suggest you start talking to people who got banned for map hacking before and ask them how many days/chances to form a defense against the accusations they recieved.
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What's his reasoning?
In his opinion the HQ ability of Soviet Urban Defense is broken and breaks maps. |
Is it intended, that on the new maps some buildings are out of capable Territory so they cant be converted to special buildings like forward HQ?
Yes. Whiteflash talked about that a while ago.
He implemented this so the Soviet HQ can't be used anymore. |
Here are the most of the replays. Not sure if i grabbed/ found all.
The replays vs Isildur in the finals are there to show the difference between seeking looking and acting in fow, while a ref is watching him, and without ref / without streaming in automatch. Feel free to self watch VOD from February, January before this went public.
Just from watching his Twitch streams and comparing them to the clips provided it is pretty clear there is a big difference. When streaming he rarely has his camera on FOW while in these clips he is on FOW a lot. I found this difference quite big. |
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