Incremental accuracy, which at first, should only matter if you were trying to suppress multiple squads.
The thing is, there is something else which matters as well.
New set of tests:
Test 1:
Testing the same MG34/MG42 against 1 model on the open. Results are the same as before with complete squads.
Test 2:
6 x squads of 1 model Cons behind a sandbag at range 20 against MG34. It takes ages (16 bursts).
Test 3:
Now this is the interesting part.
6 x squads of 1 model behind sandbag at the left (A).
JUST RIGHT OF IT, a 6 model Con squad on NO COVER (B).
1 model Conscript squad right of the 6 model squad in NO COVER (C).
1 x squad of 6 model behind cover (D).
T 3.1:
If i aim at the right most model of (A), the 6 man conscript squad will not be suppressed. EVEN if all the bullets are hitting the unit (2.00 acc (MG34) x 0.5 (cover)), which should be what matters for suppression AOE. I tested both, perfectly aligned (by cancelling a sandbag construction) and spread formation.
T 3.2:
Same situation but now i aim at (C) which is farther aside from (B), compared to (A). 1st burst suppress on (C), 2nd burst pin (as before) and at this point it also suppresses (B) as it should.
T 3.3:
1 squad of 6 models behind sandbag (D) and (B). Aiming at (D) doesn't seems to change the result (i suppress in 5 bursts) but (B) doesn't get suppress after 2 mags (12 bursts)
IMPORTART PART: Aiming at the squad OUT OF COVER, suppresses the squad behind cover in 2 bursts (normal 5).
Test 4:
MG42 (1% accuracy) aiming at (B) -no cover-, suppresses in 1 burst (D) -cover unit- as well.
This is something which doesn't align with what we know of suppression at all.
Huh. Interesting. |
They literally have sniper camo, what are you smoking
Lol yeah for some reason I didn't notice. No need to be hostile though. |
One of the main problems with the design of Fallschimhager is that they have not real weakness.
Other high damage infantry units are either only good at one range like Shocktroops being only good at close range or Obersoldaten being good at long range or have a lack of anti tank weapons like Paratroopers, Obersoldaten or Shock troops.
The easiest solution to give Fallschimjager a direct counter would be to remove the Panzerfaust. Now they can still be really good at all ranges like they are now, but still directly counterable if unsupported.
+1
They're the only elite infantry with a snare anyway and it's kinda cheesy when they can use it out of camo too. |
|
I've asked this multiple times but I just want to make a thread about it for discussion.
They're infiltration troops, made out of tissue paper 4 men squads, don't have a nuclear grenade, have to ambush etc. etc. You all know the argument. |
I like the concept of these abilities, but I don't think that they fit very well into the current game.
I would prefer an easy solution by replacing it with direct call ins of Osttruppen and AT Conscripts/Partisans (AT or SMG), respectively.
Vippers idea is interesting but might cause too many issues regarding exploits, balance and bugs.
+1 |
Improve suppression but increase pop cap, give it really slow build time and cost to 280 including higher reinforce time and cost. That way spamming it will be hard and it becomes a good support unit. After we are done with that we can take a look at Dhsk and make it more useful.
I like those suggestions for the maxim.
I think DSHK is in a good spot though. Durable and suppresses fast and does a lot of damage but has a shitty arc compared to other mgs. It's also pretty good against lights, especially with AP rounds. |
Im generally fine with live state of pak40. But it is marginal imo, not most capable, in terms of what it has to deal with, and what it can get countered. So if we are exploring help to marginal units, i consider pak40 more urgent than maxim
I don't think getting cqc decrew is fully doing wrong. consider allies are better cqc, much better than Wehr for sure. The amount of decrew chances against it is higher than others ATG.
Then you consider the vet bonus, i believe pak40 got the least. Allies got good vet bonus because at that time, they need to deal with axis heavy. Today, tide has turned against wehr or at least they are not scaling with the changes.
Pak40 is slowest reposition, has got the most counters, has lowest vet bonus and has to supplement wehr weak doc armor against allies armor
My point is that if you're letting the pak40, a 60 range ANTI TANK gun, constantly get attacked by cqc infantry, you're being outplayed anyway. That's how you counter AT guns. With infantry. Preferably flanking, close range infantry. Get some pgrens or use your 42 better next time. The pak40 does its job and does it well, it doesn't do things that aren't its job (like getting shot at or fighting infantry) very well. Shocker.
People complain about maxim because it barely even does its job in the first place and gets bodied by single infantry squads on occasion because of the deathlop, which is an entirely diferent phenomenon than the one you're talking about now. |
Very interesting stuff, thanks for sharing.
On top of that, testing 7 squads of conscripts with 1 model, will make suppressing the targeted model takes ages as opposed as previous results (like 15 bursts and only 1 squad been suppressed).
Do we at all know why this happens? Seems like a weird phenomenon. Like what mechanic is it that makes suppression affect larger squads to a higher degree (if that's a correct statement)? |
|
This thing happens to all at guns, and it isn't the same as maxim death loop. If your at gun is constantly getting shot at, you're doing something wrong anyway. |
|
Sorry you can't frontally charge a maxim with a blob with 1 active braincell anymore. |
Bleb Feesh
LoopDloop
LoopDloop
Relic Entertainment
