I find OKW is probably the easiest faction to play and get the hang of. Volksgrens and JLI are so cost effective it's just super easy to overwelm your opponent without much thought.
Against good plays OKW can be tough, Scout car spam from Soviets is a nightmare and the Bren can be a huge pain the ass. Sure, you can place a mine, and put a rak down. The rak means your 1 less volk on the field, the car means u can be anywhere to pick off lone squads. The mine is luck, and if you're facing good players they're not going to let you out-mass them. They'll just wait, move, get an MG early.
Both Brits/Sov can get an MG out early to help with early pushes and and as OKW you just have to sort of face tank it and flank while you wait for a your own indirect fire that comes after your first tier building is built which comes late enough you've got 4 volks on the field and a rak.
Personally I think the brits are the easiest faction to play, defensive, you can blob if you want, and they have reliable tanks. Sexton if you want indirect, and the arty nade is fabulous, and your stock infantry is probably the best in the game. |
That's some kind of bad sarcasm or you're completely oblivious to the fact that accuracy has gone UP, DPS mostly stayed the same/very slightly went up and damage dealt became RELIABLE instead of full on RNG?
Also, penals deal 10 damage.
Penals SVT rifles did 16, and Cons/Engineers did for awhile too as far I remember. They nerffed the Cons to 12 damage (this is back when Penals has flamers if I recall).
Then everyone spammed Engineers until they too got nerffed down to 12.
Then later we got Penals buffed to be actually useful because they had some AT and weren't tooled by lights.
That being said, where the hell is the coh2 stats page, it says the websites down. I'll edit that post if I'm wrong....
Is this https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1IX68mtMEFLUVZCJpdgLxtm9cLajZATNRwISihru8rZM/edit#gid=0
Penals do 8 in this, Engineers 16.. Cons 16.. this has to be outdated? |
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I mean does anyone remember when Cons dealt 16 damage a shot just like Penals instead of 12 damage a shot?
It was hilarious, con spam was the way to go. The change to drop it to 12 is what really put them in the back seat. Because blobbing cons wasn't awful, even against upgraded Volks or Grens. You'd just katty them, kv8 them and still have this big durable blob of essentially.. Penal DPS that was harder to kill and has more utility.
I don't want to see the con blob back, no more than you want to see the volk blob with shrecks back. |
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The problem is depending on the game mode you play depends on how useful you feel some units are.
The argument to give conscripts an LMG upgrade like the DP-28 has been as old as time itself. But a very durable squad with 6 men, and receives great vet bonuses as well as accuracy increases, has good utility and is dirt cheap and acts as "in the field " reinforcement sort of gets silly when you allow them to also upgrade their guns to add more DPS.
Soviets have access to Guards and Shocks, as well as the KV-8, and these are all good at wiping infantry.
What are the options for OST? G43's, an extra man now (with german infantry) Storm Troopers (which are still 4 man and are meh).
You really can't make conscripts any better, it would be too imbalanced. If you think cons aren't good, I assume these are 4v4 matches because cons are great for what they can do and what they cost.
I'd fix Grens by fixing their veterancy. I recently had a game where I managed 2 vet4-5 obersoldate as OKW and I had 3 M18 Scotts firing at me. I was sweating bullets, but they missed so much I had to assume it was the stacking received accuracy. If those obers were vet0, they would of been dead the moment 3 Scotts targetted them (and that feels bad, but hey that's necessary as USF has no non-doctrinal rock arty ).
So I'd give Grens a -29% received accuracy at vet3. You don't need to give them 5 guys, adjust their cost, or anything. Grenades will still be lethal and so will indirect fire when it does hit the small 4 man squad that has a hard time spreading out.
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Put grenade, mg and five man behind a fuel+MP upgrade and why not. Tommies also cost more pop cap 5man, so you would need to up gren pop cost too.
Maybe Brits can get a mortar and rocket arty if we are going the clone route.
Grens can't just get this stuff for free while being cheaper out the gate.
The problem is getting to the late game and having the resources to buy that rocket arty, or using mortars without being overrun.
When the 5 man tommies start equipping brens their blob will start annhiliating machine guns leaving a very team weapon heavy faction caught out. But if you blob too, your blob just isnt as good. Your blob cant easily heal anywhere on the map or get the utility that tommies can get. The one big push over tommies used to have is being vunerable to vehicles and now engineers can snare so thats no longer a weakness (and engineers totally needed this).
But it leaves a hole, I play a loooooot of allies... and I've been switching because of the queue times.. and I really feel the imbalance. I feel like I'm waiting for my opponent to fuck up to get an advantage, or they're just bad. But a good allied player just makes it so hard to push through as OST. Double brit in 2's is terrifying, and worse in larger games
Such durable blobs, and you can blob in a SMART way. Spreading when you hear rocket arty isn't that hard when all your focus is on your blob. OKW can do the exact same thing but with lesser effect these days.
I'm not sure what the best call is on this, the 5 man G43 upgrade from German Infantry does feel about right, locking out the LMG. But thats a commander only call in and having non-dotrinal G43 may not be the best idea. |
It's a specialization and role change upgrade that has the opportunity cost of locking out medical kits and flares with a higher munition cost than either. It's a choice and one of the ways for the commander to use ammunition. If their durability or the timing is an issue it can be changed, but they are geared towards dedicated AI work unlike a unit such as Cavalry Riflemen who have AT Satchels to fend off vehicles or PGs who can transition to AT.
Still have access to grenades, phosphorous grenades, satchels though correct? It seems like a very powerful squad if that is the case. Med kits and the arty nade isn't that bad of a thing to lose, you only need 1 of those usually. |
Good feedback. Yes, all grenades should share cooldown.
btw. Gammon bomb won't be revamp becouse it's out of scope.
Again, agree, too much smoke. Should be replace BUT not with a unit. M3, mortar and M10 that's all units you get from a commander and you want to add 4th unit?
Commander needs more ammo base supportive ability. If not the "assault" theme of a commander i would suggest "Hold the Line" which highly needs a revamp.
Simple "flare" ability from artillery regiment OR recon plane would be enough in my opinion. Brits curently doesn't have many reconnaissance options. It wont make commander in any form overpowered but also it's not gonna be useless ability
Give it a recon loiter, that would be ideal. As you mention they lack any form of accessible air recon. You often just get it through the command vehicles or the commando officer.
Also
Gives the squad 2 Thompson SMGs, Sten Guns (with Assault Engineer Grease Gun stats) No.77 White
I don't agree with this upgrade, 2 Thompsons and then 3 Sten gens? So 5 guys with close quarters guns? This isn't a normal upgrade.
PPSH doesn't give 6 cons 6 PPSH's, the STG44 arent given to 5 Volks, Rangers get 2-3, Paratroopers get 2-3 ?
I don't see why British Tommies, an already very durable, hard to kill squad, with bonuses in cover (and no penalties out of cover). This seems incredibly powerful, why not give them 2-3 thompsons and leave their rifles? That way they aren't brutally devastating at close range?
There's a reason they didn't give the Panzergrenadiers a 5th man with an SMG in the Infantry Doctrine, they just made them run faster! Hah, can you imagine 5 panzergrens ontop of you? Well.. tommies are probably right up there if you give them 5 SMG's in the unit that most Brits build 4 of. |
Best solution.
Also fix the issue of Tier 4 OKW Ostwind by simply making it worth it.
I'd rather a Brumbar over a buffed ostwind, its a great tank.
Give it great AI power, right now the P4 is the go to tank for both OKW/WEhr and that's the reason. |
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I disagree with a lot of this. Snipers are a tool, your opponent is spamming machine guns, mortars and is just doing great in terms of combined arms.
So you dump 360 manpower into a unit that "might" change the tide. Could be wiped by a random mortar, dead to a flank, chased down by a scout car.
It's a huge investment that puts you on the back foot usually, and you need to really push it to make sure you get those gains. When your opponent begins to dive the sniper you just use him as bait. Keep that in mind, a good player is using the sniper as bait as much as he's using it to attack.
Giving it more hp and a reliable way to kill is just counter to how COH2 really works for infantry fights. It sounds like you dove hard into a particular play style and a sniper is hard countering it.
I don't agree with wiping stuff on retreat easily, it's probably the most frustrating part of Coh2 for me. You fight an engagement, both sides clash. But then there's some assault engineers, sturms, commandos, falls, sitting on your retreat path and just obliterating them. It's a feels bad moment, it's a viable tactic but it's a horrible time. |
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Tommies already make every axis player wake up at night, now they'll get to fight ASSAULT tommies. Really, what can't the brits do anymore? I see the main complaint is not enough offmap to deal with arty.
You've never had to fight a brit who's good with a sniper have you? Just slip past enemy lines, huck a nade, bye bye arty.
I agree, not every doctrine has to have everything in it. |
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