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doesn't the command panther need to be stationary for the 50 range?
But now is the OP asking for a price reduction of the Jackson or command panther? |
Using Cover is the most realistic scenario, being a core component of the entire combat system and all. Using no cover isn't. Because cover is a core component of the entire combat system. The fact that JLI, 1cp 280mp infantry can beat even Obers, who are the latest arriving and some of the most expensive in the entire game is an absolute testiment to their power, that's before even considering they get a 50%accuracy bonus out of camo and camo allows them to select which engagements they want to fight.
This test is SPECIFICALLY testing the best long range squad, using ONLY long range squads, why would they test at any range but each squads optimal range? It's best case scenario for all those units and most likley the targets they will be facing (because trying to close against a long range squad is a guaranteed lost match up, as they can deal damage to you while receiving next to none) or is there something about this match up that you feel is skewed towards a particular long range specialist that makes it far and above other long range specialists?
But for the sake of fairness I too recommend we try the tests at 0 range on neg cover as it is the only way to possibly replicate the real game scenario of how one would use a long range squad.
And after that, I would like to match up shocks, Thompson rangers and commandos at 40 range so we can determine who (if any) is the king of CQB!
realistically, squads will be fighting in cover and without and at all ranges, just because cover is a core component doesn't mean it will be used at all times,a vet 5 JLI in green cover long range, is the most optimal area for them ofc they will excel in it. But JLI should be 300mp at least |
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i will gladly have it at 30% too with the ability to slow down tanks into sitting ducks |
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This ability needs vision to do something and can still get shot down. But hold on, don't you have enough time to move out of the area? because i'm sure it doesn't immediately start dropping its bombs, the first pass the plane makes doesn't do any damage.
If you stay in the circle that's your own fault. |
Probably because of the 60mp per squad difference o top of the 80mp in teching difference. Funny enough the maxim also has 160mp in teching over the mg42, and is inferior despite the same per unit cost...
Again, looking AT COST you might be able to figure this one out... Once you have figured that out, triple the cost difference and maybe you can deduce why penals might be superior troops....
Off the top of my head? The maxim comes after 160mp in teching and could maintain a smaller than average arc. I'd bump its cost too to try and prevent spam. Functioning at least as well as an MG34 should be acceptable, costing more but more durable with less arc. Seems reasonable.
The. 50 comes later than all other mgs and works fine when it works, but is inconsistent, so fixing the traverse might be enough.
The Vicky, I'll admit I'm not sure. An MG34 with more damage perhaps?
But tbh were actually here specifically to do what you are asking, so maybe sit back and let those that actually understand the various factors included in balancing a unit discuss? You might pick something up, like how cost relates to performance for example.
The mg34 works fine. It does its job. It shoots at the enemy and they get suppressed. That's really all you want in an MG, everything else is gravy and as the cheapest MG doing the bare minimum is plenty acceptable. The issue with the mgs that ARE mentioned is that they are more expensive by a fair margin and fail to do that basic role remember from earlier where you discovered that the more expensive unit is supposed to be more effective? It's exactly like that! Arnt you glad you were able to figure out that super basic factor of balance? The sky is the limit now!
SO now you've moved from performance to cost you keep changing ur narrative, initially your issue with MG's was they struggled with performance, nothing about its cost. You keep making claims that the allied MG's cant do the basics (while u claim the mg34 does, even though it the worst from the lot, this is a clear contradiction on your part), and that statement is simply untrue. if cost alone is the issue for you then fine reduce the costs. |
240mp Grens already overshadow 240mp conscripts. They also fare pretty well against Rifle sections and Infantry sections so long as they make use of their range and find cover.
A 260mp MG42 is a country mile beter than the 260mp Maxim. The maxim absolutely does not 'suppress fine' and is a terrible heavy machine gun. Better than zero heavy MG, but not good. If they don't have vet late game they are next to worthless, quite unlike even an unvetted MG42.
The 260mp Vickers is comprable but extra damage at the cost of suppression is not helpful in most situations. In the few that it is, a vet MG42 can also rule the roost, because it can toggle AP rounds. While they begin on similar footing the Vickers veterancy is also very lackluster.
The .50 cal is more expensive and arrives later, but it only about as good as the 42. Slowest target tracking, smaller cone, and the AP rounds are strictly inferior.
It's not like evwrybody else having a simlar return on investment for their machine guns is going to make Ost suddenly less powerful.
Yeah u compared grens to cons, but didnt bother comparing them to penals (and you know why). Both riflemen and IS are superior to grens. And please expalin how u would buff those MG's without breaking balance?
And ive noticed ther is little mention about the mg34 which is the worst out them all, i wonder why? |
Reckon you are very wrong then. Mgs should be able to stop enemy infantry via Supression, of the 3 factions there's is only one that can do that on occasion (the 50 cal) and even that one is buggy. The vickers bursts down models which forces it to reaim thus stopping applying Supression, will likely eat a flame nade. The maxim doesn't deal Supression... Or damage and will likley rat a flame nade, followed by a deathloop. All mgs should be stopping infantry that charges front long into them and the mg34 and 42 both manage to do that. Yuu don't get mgs to deal damage you get then to control infantry if they can't control infantry there is little point in getting them.
idk what game you play, but your acting like vickers dont suppress, please dont over exaggerate. Yes it doesn't suppress as quick as a 42 but in return in deals more damage, especially when units are not pinned and in green cover it dashes out very high damage to them. Maxim also suppresses fine, only issue with it is the death loop and .50 cal suppresses fast and does high damage too. All those MG's do stop infantry, you acting like they dont and are useless which is simply not true.
So what is your solution? give those MG's performance on the lvel of the 42? if thats the case, you guna start buffing grenadiers too based on ther performance against other main line infantry?
OST are far more reliant on the 42's suppression then any other faction |
Because I want all MGs to have their price increased and performance improved. Except the 42. It's already really good, so just a price increase is needed.
The rest of your post quotes somebody else and attributes it to me so I can't speak to that.
I can see why u think 42 needs a price increase, but i dont see any reason to buff the performance of the other MG's. You cant buff other MG's solely on the comparison with the mg42 ( best MG in the game). Thats like calling for a buff to the stug as it sucks if compared to the jackson. U have to look at other parts of the faction like e.g. performance of the main line infantry.
I reckon all Mg's perform as they should right now. |
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if penals are nerfed ther has to be a buff for cons, or soviets will just collapse. But generally u go for penals to have the edge in early, late game they will start struggling vs other main line inf |
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OKW is not supposed to have powerful support weps, the mg34 is cheap and performs as it should |
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