So the problem doesn't exist in live because both the unit and its commander are absolute rubbish and it doesn't exist in the mod, because it has been fixed. So why is that even discussed, especially in a thread aimed at something completely different?
This was not presented as problem but an explanation in response to OP suggestion to remove engine damage critical from snare that hit the front of the vehicle. It was used to explain why that would be a bad idea.
Valentine was brought up since in live it the best crusher in the game and that is an issue regardless if the unit and/or commander sucks. I guess that Relic understood the issue and removed crush human from the unit although in "ninja" change.
The unit's mobility remains ridiculously high even at the revamp patch especially when vetted and it is combined with "war speed".
The rest is people perceiving everything as an attack to their favorite side.
You want OST to be the benchmark but propose to nerf OST in the same post? I think the current OKW/SOV/OST balance should be the benchmark as it's inherently easier to buff two factions than to nerf three.
I clearly said if ostheer prove to be superior after the revamp patch and that faction should meet halfway. The reason I am saying that is that units have been buffed continuously and soon there will be little time for superior tactics to have a real affect on fights.
The benchmark need to be 1 faction not three, it becomes way too complicated if ones attempts to use more than 1 faction as the benchmark. Ostheer used to be benchmark and it makes sense to become the benchmark once more, in addition they are the best design faction that requires the use of different units.
If I had to touch the Ostheer I would start with better redesign of commanders, by removing OP combinations of abilities.
Buffing the DPS of unit to solves balance issues is a step in the wrong direction. High DPS means that fight last less and the impact and the importance of tactics reduces.
If Ostheer/OKW remain stronger than UKF/USF after the revamp patch then Ostheer/OKW/Soviet should all be nerfed to find middle ground.
Actually balance would be allot easier if Ostheer become once more the benchmark to will all other factions where measured.
I have played with the Valentine in the mod, I have not attempted to crush infantry thou because I don't like cheesy tactics and the 50% more AOE in the main gun allows the unit to deal with infantry.
The fact that MOD have remove "crush humans" (undocumented) simply prove my point that effectiveness of the unit to crush human in live is too high and it should be looked at.
It also proves why snares being able to cause engine damage frontally is necessary which this thread suggested removing.
On the other hand it is true Valentine can not crush humans in the MOD.
For one thing, demos are 2 times as expensive as the stormtrooper flamenade, and for another thing, they’re practically useless in this patch. By at least allowing them to kill caches it’d give it one form of utility that really never should have been taken away....
The grenade does not kill a cache, Demo charge does it also kills a bunker (if I remember correctly. The utility has not been taken away, one simply needs to wait for CD to pass, it has become a bit more tricky to pull off.
Saying the new stormtroopers overlap with pgrens with ambush camo is a little silly for a couple reasons. First and foremost, having commando-type camo opens up wayyy more possibilities than ambush camouflage. There’s no way you could pull off the same things commandos (and now stormtroopers) can with ambush camo pgrens. In addition, they have mp40s instead of stgs which makes them a little better at ambushing IMO because they have better close range dps (better midrange dps on stgs is irrelevant if you close with the enemy in camo and engage them at minimum range as commandos do). Storms also get smokes and a different nade as well as tactical assault for wiping stuff on retreat better than pgrens could (not that pgrens are bad at that).
I am sorry to say but you analysis is based on flawed assumptions.
Facts:
Pg camouflage was improved in DBP and it allows them to move when cloaked
Pg get a first strike bonus that St.T do not
Pg get an elite grenade which has allot more shock value than the flame grenade
St44 has great DPS both close and mid so they can continue firing on infantry even after they hit the retreat button.
Pg can sprint
Pgs can actually set an ambush quite effectively.
The main thing St.T have is tactical movement which is great but comes with 3 drawbacks, it increases their own size to 1.5, slows them down and the effect linger even if they run in trouble and have to retreat. The ability is more effective when used against retreating infantry.
Commandos are simply way better at ambush combining 5 men, elite grenade, high moving DPS and a vet speed bonus.
Actually I have little to add on subject, imo commandos are already a great unit and do not need further buffs, they are out of scope and the argument the "grass is greener on the other side" is basically flawed.
The 45mm ATG is good ability for the commander since it helps protect the HQ fuel investment from light vehicles rush and as such it should be focus in dealing with light vehicles. In it current implementation the unit is simply way too cost efficient and problematic.
Comments:
Ambush camouflage is good addition, on the other hand first strike bonuses are not necessary. The rakketen start getting them from vet 3 and there is little reason for M-42 to get the earlier. If it need to scale better they could be move to veterancy.
The ability to move while cloaked is bad since the unit can be used for scouting, it should actually be removed from all ATG.
The change in arc, rotation speed and horizontal trucking are all great and in the right direction since they help the unit deal with light vehicles. If first strike bonuses are removed a small increase in accuracy might be helpful.
The increase in far penetration is unnecessary especially with the first strike bonus penetration (I guess that is the third first bonus) since the unit has very good chance to penetrate the rear/side armor of PzIV even at max range.
The vet 1 ability (although I am not sure it is working properly) is over the top since it can probably negate the effect of smoke for free. Such power abilities are locked at higher tier in UKF for a reason and should not be available in 200 MP/2CP unit. One could replace by moving camouflage to vet 1 or some of the first strike bonuses.
The canister shot is simply problematic, being able to fire on hmg outside their range is simply wrong. In addition the ability is extremely good in destroying buildings and can be used to destroy enemy heavy cover with immunity. The ability is actually unnecessary for a unit that has the role of countering light vehicles but it it stays it should become timed with a munition cost and redesigned.
My suggestion would to increase damage to 100 so it can kill all light vehicles with 4 hits, move static camo to vet 1, reduce pop to 5 and keep the changes that help it vs light vehicles only.
Else the unit need to have its price increased.
Veterancy:
One should have a look at the vet bonuses and maybe move some of the buffs (that the unit got) to veterancy bonuses. AT vet 3, first strike and max range the unit should currently have around 69% chance to penetrate a PzIV frontally, and 87% at range 30, with a reload of 1.46 Sec! allowing the unit to be very effective when spammed.
Stormtrooper changes are literally ment to mirror commandos, including commando-like stealth and powerful SMG.
Why are you crying about commandos demo claiming just because storms got flame nade commandos shouldnt be buffed because they would be too similar to Storms, but the whole point of Storm changes was to make them more like commandos since people enjoy their playstyle, thats literally what Jae for Jett said
Seriously dude, your mental gymnastics in this thread are on another level
Dir kirrik pls try to provide useful feedback to Relic instead of commenting on my posting habits, this thread is about the revamped commanders and not me.
Inf.C are not part of revamped commanders and they actually perform good and do not need a buff.
St.T on the other hand in live perform poorly and bring little to the table in the patch. They perform rather mediocre as shock infiltration unit since they spawn with rifles and bring little to the table compared to "camo" Pgs.
If St.T are meant to "literally to mirror Inf.C" then do so making them a 3 men squad armed with smgs able to reinforce to five, able to equip 2 lmgs or 2 AT weapons and so on...currently that is not the case.
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