Sprint is activated once you give an attack order and not once you fire, so it can be used to close distance while remaining in cover...You can close in by moving normally if you wish...
I was not aware that sprint worked like that, and this smells like a bug.
Normally, when you give an attack order commandos will open fire (thus breaking stealth). However, I can see that you can circumvent that using the following procedure:
- Force your commandos to face the other way
- Give the attack command
- Immediately move before the shot is fired (or just tell them to attack something behind a shot blocker)
- Presumably commandos will benefit from sprint while stealthed (I've never tried it like this)
I'm not saying there isn't a difference but I just tried it again and I'll be buggered if I can notice any extra damage being dealt.
In fact I'm wondering if the ability is itself bugged.
This is a situation where both of us are correct:
1. The damage buff IS significant in close (near melee ranges)
2. It is very difficult to know when the damage buff actually triggers.
Commandos ambush works like a double-edged sword. The accuracy buff is the plus side. The speed "buff" works against you; a sprinting commando will not be able to fire on the move, and if you aren't moving, how are you going to close the gap?
Thus, the optimal strategy right now is to gain the buff once, and do your best to never trigger the ambush bonus again.
Am I interpreting what you write about the commandos correctly like this? After they got their ambush bonus once they will have it for the rest of the game? Or just for as long as they stay in cover?
The 50% accuracy will probably still apply for the rest of the entire game.
Another question. If it does hold, does it stay even after a retreat? What if 4 models die and get replaced, do they still habe the buff or just the 1 remaining guy. All of this would need to be met otherwise to much effort for effect.
This is a very good question. I didn't try this (it's difficult to verify it), so I added it to the bug report.
50% added on to truly sucky accuracy is still sucky.
Spinflight is right on the money. Range affects both accuracy and burst length (how many shots will fire).
Even when I cranked the accuracy bonus to 40000% (for my test) commandos still had issues defeating grenadiers at max range with their stens (stens would fire 2 shots per second at max range)
Commando is currently one of strongest infantries in the game...
The bren is also a good upgrade...
Cruzz:
"Commando Bren is significantly (~40%) stronger and can fire on the move with 50% accuracy."
while it costs the same as other brens...
But this type of debate is not meant to be done in bug section....if you want to debate more it would be better to be moved to balance...
This is a topic better suited for the strategy section; we wouldn't want the balance section to lose more of its currency with irrelevant topics. If you open a discussion there, I will give you my opinion on brens/piats etc.
Cruzz is back, and there was some interesting discussion going on in his thread. Cruzz did the vast majority of the detective work, I am just merely reporting it:
1. Commandos ambush bonus (accuracy) is bugged (infinite duration)
2. All artillery reticules are misleading; scatter_offset complicates things further
3. The popcap cost of the doctrinal soviet mortar (120mm) is too high @ 13 popcap
4. The DPS of Tommy vet3 scoped rifles is, again, inferior to the vanilla riles they have
5. AEC Thread shot bug (clue)
6. Comet projectile still not fixed
7. British infantry benefits from additional -10% received accuracy in light/heavy cover (intended?)
8. Three shades of Bren (The Dropped Weapons edition)
9. British medics & The Hippocratic oath (oversight?)
10. Sapper destroy cover doesn't work vs constructed sandbags
11. British default weapon crews (Vickers/AT guns etc) have a 6.6 rear armor (probably doesn't affect anything)
Maybe it stay as long as you fight the same target...
If I recall correctly, I finished off two squads with the bonussed-up commandos. In the meantime I went in and out of combat multiple times:
- Sometimes I let the commandos benefit from cover in the interim (not firing from cover though)
- Other times I made sure to avoid cover altogether
Where do I find the commando ambush bonus in the attribute editor? I would like to modify the values a bit so that I can better observe the extent of its uselessness.
I've already found commandos_assassinate and commandos_infiltrate (or something like that), but I haven't seen anything that looks like an 1.5 accuracy modifier
.. and it seems that Cruzz was right about scatter_offset.
I did some trials with a 1.0 offset sexton and a 0.0 offset sexton.
Predictably, the 0.0 sexton had an even scatter area and the 1.0 offset sexton had its scatter area displaced entirely to the further side of the target.
Now we know that the earth is not flat, but doughnut-shaped.
However, there is one crucial detail missing; what is the effect of the scatter offset on:
a) The scatter area
b) The distribution of shots in the scatter area
Previously, I think we were both led to believe that this only affects (b). However, your sexton test uncovered that it actually affects (a) (and perhaps not b at all).
Verifying (b) is tedious. However, we could still benefit from what happens with respect to (a)
Would it be possible to create 3 clones of the same unit (e.g. Sexton) and give each clone a different offset value?
- 0 offset
- 0.5 offset
- 1 offset
My intuition is that the effect of the offset value is to "nudge" the scatter area scatter_offset * vertical_scatter units further. If you do the math, this has the same effect as making (50 + 50 * scatter_offset)% of shells to overshoot.
Thus, scatter_offset will act more like an offset than a bias.
This would also perfectly explain what I experience when aiming PIATs.
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