Profile of Krötentöten

I realy dont understand this discussion. Before I start, a disclaimer; vet 5 is dumb. You NEVER reach vet 5 in any game of any skill as it is over before. Its still dumb to have vet 5. As far as I care they can scrap vet 5. I never reached it anyways, replace it with a 20 % reload on cp or something. They can replace it with an ability to fart pink ponies for again, you dont reach it. Already vet 3 is very rare.

I cindly ask those people who say it needs nerfing so bad to simply play a few games with the CP and actualy reach those vet levels... I have attached a video of a CP reaching vet 4.5 and I still loose. Granted my mate was not up to the challenge but thats then exactly how it should be eh?

The truth is you cant skip the last tech with any commander atm as you simply need obers and/or tanks. You might do it with pfüssiliers and jagdtiger but thats about it and I dont advise it either. And once you have t1/t2 and t3 up it is a mere 120 +65 or 55 fuel more for a KT.

I have analised the CP in more detail in my last post. But again, yes it is a good unit, no it needs atleast 2 other tanks to be stronger than just a regular panther, not counting mark vehicle which is very strong but costs munitions. Thanks to mark target the CP is always worth it over a normal panther which is fine as it costs more and is the defining unit of the commander. Why wouldnt it be good? The elefant, isu, jagdtiger/tiger are also all way more effective/price than stock units. If this werent the case then why have doctrines?

Ahhh finally a discussion about one of my favourite units. The commando panther.

Now to start to one has to look at all the facts about it.

At vet 0 it is an ordinary okw panther with the bonuses from its vet 0 aura (the ONLY bonus the CP gives itself, 2 CPs give each other their aura but it does NOT stack on units that already have the aura, it simply alternates between the 2 CPs auras depending on which one is nearer i assume)

The vet 0 aura is +20 sight range, +10% speed, +10% ac/de-celeration.

The sight is useful. It can spot for itsself. Its not that much more than useful though as often you use combined tactics in which sight range is already given through other units.

At vet 1 it gets blitz, identical to the normal panther.

At vet 2 it gets +20% accuracy to its aura and +10% armour, +20% health, +10% weapon rotation speed for itsself.

The normal panther gets the same but 40 % weapon rotation speed. So in the end the CP trades in 30 % weapon rotation speed against a 20 % accuracy

At vet 3 the CP gains 10% reload, +10% rotation speed, +10% ac/de-celeration
Opposed to the nornal Panther getting
-30% reload, +20% rotation speed, +30% ac/de-celeration. The CPs aura gains -20% reload. So you trade 20 % reload 10 % rotationspeed and 20% acc amd deexcelleration vs a 20 % reload aura.

At vet 4 the CP gains nothing for itself as well as at vet 5 while the normal panther gets +10% range -25% scatter and at vet 5 +25% accuracy on the move, +11 sight radius vs the aura of +5 range and at vet 5 finaly infantry affected too.


Now remember, the AURA of the CP does not affect the CP, exception beeing the vet 0 aura, what does this mean?

This means that by itsself based on stats the CP is inferior to the normal panther at any vet over vet 2 beeing almost identical at vets below or at that. This also means that a panther and a CP duo at over vet 2 is weaker than a simple double normal panther duo. If you have 3 tanks the setup with the CP is favoured.

Now keep in mind that the CP also has substantialy higher vet requirements than the normal panther whilst doing LESS dps from vet 3 on as it only get 10 % reload vs 30%. As a sidenote, there are also -5% reload bulletins for the Panther whilst the CP just has 5% top speed.

The CP has a saving grace beeing mark target. It is very strong and alows the CP to stay competitive IF spammed. If used with other units it can be extremly potent.

Tldr: The CP is worse than a normal panther by itsself for a higher cost and higher vet requirements. You need approximatly 3 tanks counting CP or 2 tanks benefiting from the aura for the CP to pull ahead of a normal panther.

Mark target is what makes the CP better than a normal panther even though tje above mentioned limitations.

A vet 5 cp is sick! But though I love the CP and play it a lot I have never had one. I would have many old replays of cps in action but due to patches they cant be watched anymore. I do have 1 on youtube though where i get a vet 4.5 cp thanks to some lucky rng, and guess what? We still loose the game.

Also, please take note how long the game is and how little time if it the CP actualy is above vet 3 and how damn lucky i got...

 https://youtu.be/AWQ1pCMdGIE


Seeing as the CP is the commander defining unit i think its role as beeing all together a better panther for higher cost ok. Its by itself quite a lot worse than an ordinary panther for higher cost but it scales with the amount of tanks and it has mark target.

As for 4v4... well... there are many units who scale a lot better in those modes, all rocket artillery for example, or a sturmtiger etc...

And last but not least. The british command vehicle gives the stronger buffs to infantry and tanks from the get go for only 75 min. It does half all the stats from the carrier but if its an aec or carrier who cares. -30 reload, +30 acc -30 rec. Acc.

What is a regular churchill??

All I ever see is Crocs and very rarely (by myself) avres. Is this a new commander that I've missed?

Seriously though, there is a reason you never ever see it in any high ranked game. People say it acts as a meatshield, for what? Your firefly? Either your opponent has the same range like the firefly and targets it directly or he hasent and just drives by your churchill. If its only sight you care about there are many more easier options.

The churchill was strong pre nerf, i honestly didnt find it OP then either, 2 stugs ate it alive and were so happy for their "earned" vet 3. The same with okw's jp4 or commando panther. Not to speak of elefant and jagdtiger...

Yes, it would shred packs and shreckblobs for the unprepared. But in that regard it was little different then an US player going for sherman spam and a tiger shows up. Sometimes you just need to adapt to counter and that doesnt make a Unit OP. And with it beeing tied to the last tech its not like it shows up midgame or you dont see the opponent is going for late game tanks.

It was barely acceptable when they nerfed its armour. But when they nerfed its armour, increased the price and fixed the grenade (which was the nr 1 reason the churchill got any cind of meaningful kills) it got outright useless for its cost.

Even on the topic of heavy engineers, they have a cost and a very noteable weaknes with their speed, thats almost a meere sidegrade. I know that even ig it were attainable without tech i would by far not always give it to my sappers.

There are many units that dont pull their weight, but in the churchills case its sad as it is a)the main reason for a endgame tech decicion unlike for example penals who are in the sniper building as well and t1. And b) it used to be good. So it did work once.

I hope a relic employe gets to see this before it gets flooded of the boards with other posts demanding more attention.

With all the complaining beeing done and a lot of it rightfuly so, with ever new bugs coming out, some of which you truly scratch your head and wonder whether even a single test game has been made before releasing a patch, I wanted to tell you my imense gratitude for 1 thing I am extremly pleased with.

The new matchmaking system

I have played about 20 games or so since you last patched it. And I must congratulate you for an immensly satisfactory change. I played on my own as rank 1-3 okw 2v2 random and I might have had to wait for 15 minutes for it to find a suitable game which ofc hurts me as I often only have an hour to play at a time but I am faced with and against fair odds.

The same with my 2v2 at team with my rl buddy arround rank 150 to 100, search times are much shorter and the games very enjoyable.

A few examples
Alone I had anything ranging from
R2, R1 vs R10, R20 to R1, R200 vs R40, R70

With my mate it was even better. Not a single game was mire than 50 ranks apart.

This is a huge change in my eyes as it avoids 2 immensly important issues for this game. 1 is the loss of new players due to them beeing matched up vs experienced ones, (the 10 placement games still can be harsh, they should realy add a popup when you are in the placement games to inform you about this) and the frustration coming from beeing overrun in 10 minutes. The second is the loss of veteran players who after a streak of beeing matched up in unfair games (i once had myself as rank 3 with a rank 1200 vs AT team 11, i went to rank 15..., meaning approx 5-15 wins needed to compensate for that) loose too much of their rank and just quit.

I bow my head to you Relic on this one.

Ps: I would personaly love to know the exact mechanism if possible. Is it percentage based or simple your rank +-a number. Does it still widen the search with time? If so, is there a limit to the widening or am I still advised to restart the search if no opponent has been fpud after quite a while to avoid beeing matched in one of those ludicrus games again.

Thanks a lot

Oh right, I forgot that offensive vet was always working since day 1 of CoH2. But what do I know. I'm just going by numbers I saw once and my in game experiences.

Some1's beeing salty... do you want to truly argue like that? I know that offensive vet didnt work since months and that IS and RE didnt get their devensive vet either... but that will all change on the 9th. So do you realy want to make a fuss about it now?

And the numbers thing is because I actualy did bother to look them up once, they havent changed since and I simply dont remember them by heart and cant find the time to look them up atm. Doesnt change that when I argue about a units performance its normaly built on actual knowledge and not just some random opinion and when I dont know I dont make claims but inquiries first. It is true for example that double equipped RE's are not the same strength as double equipped IS.