You need to factor in that one M3A1 will take those kubel out in seconds. Rarely do people go t1 and only go penals.
but rarely do they get one out fast enough to win the first fight, and put down a mine to cover the retreat of the kubel. |
I take your point. Realistically, there are many cheap and easily available counters to the Luchs also, that are not Penals. Take the oft-spammed Guard Rifle Infantry with PTRS rifles, or even a single Zis gun. But the point still stands. It doesn't matter that there are counters to the Luchs, because the Luchs is balanced. In fact, the Luchs is pretty sucky and only stands a chance against enemies who have no potential to deal damage to it (which, as it happens, is no troop... watch the Luchs reverse away frantically from a single Conscript squad).
Let's consider one Penal squad and two Conscripts. Conscripts Oohrah up to the Luchs before it can reverse and bugger out its engine with two anti-tank grenades (25 muni each) as well as dealing considerable damage. Penals can now outrun the Luchs, and are able to slap a 45 muni satchel on it, destroying it. That's a mere 95 muni to destroy a 265 MP and 60 fuel vehicle. Meanwhile, the Conscripts/Penals are unlucky if they have lost a single model. That is how bad the Luchs is. Test it, be my guest. I did (with a friend, to rule out AI derp).
And if I missed the point of you mentioning Obers, then please clarify.
Outlining an ideal situation is not a good argument to say that penals are OP.
My point about the Obers was that you must properly factor in the available and reasonable counters to a unit before you cry OP. The luch is a very good counter, mg's are a very good counter. A Kubel + sturms can effectively outfight anything in the first few mins. |
Meaning; "I failed to defend my argument and prove the viability of my proposed pro strat, hence I am blaming your person to cover it up"
Nope i mean exactly what I wrote. |
So you admit your argument was silly?
Nope, I'm asking you for your playercard (something that shows me that your current ranks are in automatch) because i think you are falling victim to penals due to a lack of skill.
Note: I mean no offense. |
The recent miragefla's brainstorm gave them a funny nade, remember?
They repel and/or destroy vehicles.
INB4 someone says "don't get close", ignoring the common aknowledge that axis AI vehicles don't do jack shit at range.
Playercard please. |
Go into the game and test it, then. Two Penal squads each with a single PTRS-41, versus a single Luchs. Luchs loses, almost always.
It's difficult to believe, but you are completely missing the point regarding Ober. Ober are 400 MP... thus, for the same cost, you can either have 4 Penal squads or 3 Ober squads. The 4 Penal squads wipe the floor with the 3 Ober squads. Penals are thus much more cost-effective, and do not require a 200 MP + 120 fuel building.
So, lets think about this: in order to fight the luchs you need to get 2 penal squads (600 MP), upgrade them to having 4 PTRS's (100 muni or something?) and then have the luch sit in-front of your units not moving, all the while your 600 manpower and 100 muni worth of squads is now crap at fighting over infantry.
Taking it further, in reality the luch will be moving, probably away from the penals, meaning the penals wont be able to get many shots off. You lose MP, the luchs get repaired for free.
I believe you missed the point of me mentioning Obers.
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Do you guys actually play the game or just complain about it? Since when did 2 PTRS's (or 4 or even 6) hard counter luchs/ostwind?
and no Penals don't counter Obers, and Obers are what 400 mp? 100 more than penals? Not exactly 'ridiculously' more expensive than penals. |
...damnit. I stated above I didn't want to get into the counter-to-the-counter, 'cos there are plenty of ways to kill a Luchs, using even a mere two PTRS-41 rifles against an 'anti-infantry' tank, or just mines/demos. And anyway, the Luchs is too impotent to be considered a true counter.
If you dont want to talk about what the Penals face then you have no basis from which to call them OP or UP. If Penals faced LMG Obers from 2 minutes into the game, you would call the Penals UP.
The luchs argument is particularly powerful as its the hard counter to all non-AT infantry, and can come very quickly. |
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what you guys dont know is that we are going to get both DevM and Luvnest drunk before the finals, player skill wont matter only the size of their liver. |
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have you tried going for a fast luchs? That is pretty much the way you counter everything as OKW. |
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