Profile of Esxile

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Thread: USF Pathfinder spam is too efficient (2v2)8 Apr 2022, 14:31 PM Jump back to quoted post8 Apr 2022, 14:04 PMVipper Panzerfussilies are inferior to Volks at spwan... In addition Fall/jli/obers price gap from VGs is nowhere near the price gap between rifleman Pathfinder so you the comparison is not helpful at all. (And Fall/jli/obers are not available before minute 1) You miss understood. I said Path and Pfuss aren't superior to mainline when they hit the field. JLI, obers, Falls are, that's why we call them elite like para or guards. In: COH2 Balance
Thread: The main problem with balance8 Apr 2022, 14:19 PM Jump back to quoted post8 Apr 2022, 14:04 PMMMX A bit off-topic, but I've always wondered if the game would benefit from slower repair and healing rates in general. Dealing health damage - both to tanks and infantry alike - isn't all that valuable in most cases since it can be restored rather quickly. This is of course especially true for infantry, for which HP damage is only really relevant in the very early stages of the game, but also for some tanks as you stated. Things like the Churchill and KV-1 being slower or faster to repair than other tanks is quite a clever and IMHO underused balance approach that could be applied to other units as well. they're gone because the modding team never understood balance. Some faction had faster and easier healing system which were offset by being more subject to casualties or more expensive reinforcement cost or simply being more dependant from it. Unbalanced they said and applied an equivalent rate to everyone. Same thing went for repairing time, people complained that it took too much time to repair their heavy tank not understanding that was also part of balancing them. They're slow to repair but the repair is free, not anymore, now they're still free to repair and repair super fast. In: COH2 Balance
Thread: The main problem with balance8 Apr 2022, 13:23 PM Jump back to quoted post8 Apr 2022, 13:00 PMHannibal That's exactly the point. There's advantages and disadvantages for both. I've seen players in game and in tournaments throwing because they got a heavy. Sometimes because they stalled too long for it, sometimes because it just wasn't a good choice. It's an inherent issue of CoH2. Light and fast vehicles perform very well in small modes, but scale worse in larger modes. That's why you see more heavies in large modes, because you get the benefits while the drawbacks are not as severe. Similarly, medium spam works well in small modes. If there is no common ground that makes a unit perform decently in all modes, we have to decide which mode works best for it. E.g. the Elefant does not work well in 1v1. Does it need a buff? Only if you think it should be used in 1v1. The community has mostly accepted that the unit will always be useless in 1v1 and only viable in larger modes. At this point, it just got balanced for larger modes. Is that good design? Definitely not. But it sometimes is the only thing that is possible. Considering that heavies really don't need a nerf. They're not used in 1v1, perform decent in 2v2 and 3v3 (depending on the map obviously), and are always a good choice in 4v4. We can of course discuss buffs and nerfs, but bear in mind that it might break other modes. But I never say anything about nerf, I always talked about economy. You're not primarily nerfing the unit by adding a cost to its repair you're nerfing the economy around heavy tank gameplay, the tank is there with the same value but you may have less around in return if you use it badly or if you opponent counter you wisely. The exemples you're presenting are already not about the unit but player's failure in assessing correctly the game and yes it exists but scarcely, honestly unless your opponent already has 2 TDs there isn't a valid reason to not call a heavy tank, now hopefully it's not a 100% win button like before but still you can't counter heavy tank by attrition while the heavy tank will itself wreck infantry and tank alike. What I mean here is the only real counter is to kill it, damaging it is never enough because repair time have been buffed, because the Tiger Ace can auto-repair and simply because once they're fielded they cost nothing more to maintain, while from the player less input required to perform and keep it alive. At the moment heavy tanks are seen in every game modes, so maybe not the elefant but tigers, kt, IS2, ISU etc... they all are suitable from 1vs1 to 4vs4. In: COH2 Balance
Thread: USF Pathfinder spam is too efficient (2v2)8 Apr 2022, 13:01 PM Jump back to quoted post8 Apr 2022, 11:26 AMInfi.ESA WRONG ! the big difference is, paths are already superior from stock. jgl, pfuss, falls, obers all need upgrades to be good and some tec. and thats the problem here, usa gets a superior unit instant. Except Paths aren't superior to riflemen when they hit the field and funny enough but except pfuss jli, falls and obers are superior to volks anytime that's why we call them elite. Path are only good when blobbed that's why top players call 4 of them and not 2 or 3 + riflemen. From experience Path begin to be a serious threat once you have 3 of them, below their firepower is usually not enough. In: COH2 Balance
Thread: The main problem with balance8 Apr 2022, 12:45 PM Jump back to quoted post8 Apr 2022, 11:43 AMHannibal Comparing two mediums to one heavy does not really make sense. Yes, losing one medium compared to half health of a heavy tank is obviously more expensive. It is meant to be like that. Two mediums still offer the huge advantage that you usually have at least one operable, that you have higher mobility and flanking opportunities and (potentially, not sure about this one) higher AI firepower. But they require twice the micro, their armor values don't stack and their penetration either. If you look at any tournament the majority of games have heavy tanks engagement because the moment they hit the field is also the moment players start losing concentration and APM, heavy tank unless really bad RNG let you absorb this reduction with high outcomes for a rather low level of input. If i'd make a suggestion it would be to make heavy tank reparation have a cost, like 100% repair costing something like 1/3 of the tank initial price. In: COH2 Balance
Thread: The main problem with balance8 Apr 2022, 11:05 AM Jump back to quoted post8 Apr 2022, 10:26 AMBasedSecretary I think the point you are alluding to (not even taking vipper seriously) is that tanks have become way too fragile and paperish for their cost in 2022 COH2. That's not only historically untrue but also ruins the gameplay. For example, T34/76's sloped armor could not be penetrated by any handheld infantry weapon of the war (not even Pansershrecks, read up on that) and it was truly a beast against the first generation of Pak ATGs (read for example Zaloga's account of T34s taking 25 hits of 37mm PAK only to lose their sight). Also, the 50mm PAK gun (the one portrayed in the game) could frontally penetrate the T34 only from maybe 200m. The only gun that could reliably penetrate all the Soviet tanks is the P4J's 5cm KwK 39. My point being: why make the in game T34 lose to 2 fausts + 2 shreck hits? Same goes for Axis and the rest of the tanks. I am not even going to mention the fact that heavier tanks like Panther, Tiger, Comet, etc. could not be penned frontally by even the best ATGs of the time from a distance less than 500m. People play WW2 games to see Panzers battling it out with T34s, not see a deathblob of Shrecks making tanks run behind. Hell, last game I had Jagdtiger plus Panther and I STILL LOST to 2 Zis Guns because the enemy snared the fuck out of 100mm SLOPED PLATED ARMOR. In no combat situation could this happen and I really think COH development and balance should focus more on tank battles and more fragile infantry rather than the opposite. Reality != gameplay, to me mediums are balanced but heavies aren´t to please a certain portion of playerbase adept of big tank boom boom gamplay. In: COH2 Balance
Thread: USF Pathfinder spam is too efficient (2v2)8 Apr 2022, 10:14 AM Jump back to quoted post8 Apr 2022, 10:00 AMInfi.ESA lol, then remove the upgrade but put them back at 1 cp or live we current meta The same should be done to all specialist/elite units that have seen their CP and cost reduced. The modding team literally made sure that all of them where more available and affordable and now people complains that the least powerful of them is a problem. Path/pfuss/JLI/obers/Falls/guards etc... have all been made more accessible and cheaper while also being superior in many if not every aspects of their responding mainline infantry. The way people play OKW on 2vs2 could be titled How to depend the minimum on my volks to ensure winning, and same goes for for USF and UKF. And if you don't do that with Ostheer it's solely because they don't have elite callin units and grens are already the best mainline on purpose. In: COH2 Balance
Thread: The main problem with balance8 Apr 2022, 09:32 AM Jump back to quoted post8 Apr 2022, 09:04 AMVipper A player has a choice to build a medium tank first and benefit from it for half the game or to save up his resources to get a heavy tank. Each choice comes with its benefits and drawback. If building 2 mediums was always a better choice no one would bother to use a commander to get a heavy tank. It is a simply as that. Stop with the strawman, do something with your comprehension. I never said 2 mediums should be superior to 1 heavy tank. I literally said it: So nope, even if you get to lose something from having your heavy tank taken to half life you'll still get advantage from it. In: COH2 Balance
Thread: The main problem with balance8 Apr 2022, 08:41 AM Jump back to quoted post8 Apr 2022, 08:00 AMVipper Because there would no reason to wait for the CP and invest on tech to get heavy tank otherwise. When you lose a tank, you lose/engage 1- the initial investment cost. 2- the potential replacement cost. 3- the value you get from it (firepower etc...). 4- the veterancy. So if 2 mediums = 1 heavy then if you lose 1 of your two medium tanks you lose/engage half each of those 4 points. But if you get your heavy tank to half life you lose nothing from them. 1- You still have your investment available. 2- You don't need to replace it. 3- The value you get from it is still fully available. 4- The veterancy isn't lost and rise. So nope, even if you get to lose something from having your heavy tank taken to half life you'll still get advantage from it. ----- The more economy you inject into the game the more it beneficiates to durable units like heavy tanks because their only CONS are their initial investment unless you lose them which is quite difficult and requires a lot of investment from your opponent, this is why cooldown were added to their replacement cost. At the beginning heavy tanks durability was offset by heavy infantry management cost, but with all the cost reduction applied to many infantry units over the patches they became just predominant and over shadowing everything else because of the amount of resources available. That's why I think that instead of reducing the player income, there is a huge need into increasing the infantry management cost. That would be beneficial for the balance because it would reward good play and preservation, be a nature CONS to infantry blob and spam, make light, medium tanks and doctrines without heavy tanks more appealing for their timing. In: COH2 Balance
Thread: The main problem with balance8 Apr 2022, 07:39 AM Jump back to quoted post7 Apr 2022, 17:19 PMLatch Its not separated into game modes, something that is near useless in a 1v1 (elefant) can dominate 3v3 and up and then something that can dominate a 1v1 (Tiger, Crocodile) is near useless in 3v3+ and this leads to half of the battles with arguments on balance threads. Someone that only plays 1v1 might not fully understand how batshit OP an artillery piece(/s) can be, more so if you have to off map counter. A land mattress might be the "worst" rocket arty in 1v1 but in a team game the spread, amount and damage of the rockets means it can hit a wider area and as there are more units, do more damage. Certain things need revising for COH3 such as build times being increased in team game modes/resource income being reduced by the amount of players, that way, losing a heavy tank doesn't just mean you're literally waiting for the cool down because you have 400 fuel and 1k man power in the bank, but that you actually have a punishment to losing such a powerful unit. The problem is the continual cost reduction of unit and reinforcement applied over the years making faction floating in manpower. If two medium tanks = 1 heavy tank then why when you lose a medium tank you lose your investment but when you get the heavy tank 1/2 life you lose nothing. In: COH2 Balance