that is simple not true, by your own logic grens are better than constrips.Wich there aren't.
I never said grens are better than conscripts,but the difference is much less marked and largely works compared to disparity with IS and rifles. |
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I don't really know how to solve this grenadier mess.
One option is nerfing us and ukf infantry.This would leave wehr-soviet balance untouched.
Second option is buff wehr infantry,but then conscripts will have trouble.
whatever happens lategame grenadiers and pzgrens need much better survivability.And the vet bonuses on ukf/allied dodging bullets is too much.Not even going into reinforce costs.
Big mistake of relic was to try to fix rifle MP bleed with vet bonuses,they should have made a upkeep/reinforce cost reduction upgrade avilable lategame than this.
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So for the same reason commandos lost to grens at long range.
Commandos don't have armor.
And if you still want to play idiot(ok, I know, you don't play, its natural),
for the same reason assault guards lose to grens at long range.
Commandoes can still run up to grens and mow them down due to poor dps,so the basic point stands.Strums can't do that to rifles .
As for assault guards i haven't faced this unit for a long time so can't say. |
For the same reason why shocks don't beat grens at all ranges.
Happy now?
Nope.Critical difference -shocks have armor and can run up and kill the grens easily.
Sturmpios don't,so if they run across without cover rifles will shred them.
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I see the thread kinda turned to Panther's intended role in the meantime, but first we need to be clear on whether or not the cost thing was satisfactorily resolved.
Things Panther has:
- Speed,
- Accelleration
- Range
- Frontal armour higher than the Tiger.
- Fantastic veterancy bonuses, starting at level 1
- Tolerable DPS versus infantry (MGs)
Things Panther doesn't have:
- Good Rate of fire
And of course people complain about what? Its rate of fire.
My question is : what else do people want for 175 fuel, exactly?
Oh and OP, I see you are active in this thread. So, can you give me a reply to this?
I want su-76 not to penetrate my frontal armour regularly at long range,since u make armor such a big issue.A little buff in dps would be necessary.Otherwise you know nobody even bothers with it these days,just jp4/pz4 or command panther.I've used both and in terms of effectiveness panther can't hold a candy to JP4.
JP4 is the last OKW unit standing.Rest of the faction nerfed into the ground and wiped out. |
to be fair vanilla rifles DO win against grens on all ranges, but unless they are equipped with two bars and/or have a vet advantage its not going to be very onesided, the rifle squad is usually losing a couple of models. sturmpioniere on the other hand completely wipe the floor with rifles squads on close range, thus they should win as easily or at all on longer ranges.
Their short range is a pathetic 5.Everyone knows long range> short range unless u have armor like shocks. |
Since sturmpios are assoult troops, so they are efficent on short/mid range.
Thats not the point...point is why does the same price difference justify 2 different performances?
Either sturmpios are overpriced or grenadiers underperforming or rifles overperforming. |
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As long as OKW has penalties it requires some OP units as crutch by design,if it doesn't have them..faction collapses by natural law of economics.
Some OKW units are just too fuel intensive,this is why u rarely see their light vehicles used..their MP cost should be increased and fuel cost decreased.
OKW panther fo its premium cost is just not worth it,it doesn't have DPS to kill stuff and raketen can't support you like wehr pak.
Jagdpanzer is much more reliable as it can answer allied TDs in kind -fire with fire. |
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Every allied fanboy saying rifles should beat grenadiers at all ranges,never answer why sturmpios don't beat rifles at all ranges for same cost difference? |
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Rifles as a unit itself beat grenadiers at all ranges for 40 mp.Curiously for same MP difference one can't say the same abt sturmpios and rifles.
Rifles can also equip 2 LMGs.
On top of this 5 men ,less chance fo wipe.
And on top of all this you STILL made an immense disparity in vet bonuses with grenadiers?Which with 4 men wipe oftena s it is.
After this terrible lategame disparity,why should i in my right mind even bother with pottygrenadiers,seeing as they would stand absolutely zero chance against rifles in scaling?Mgs can only save u on the defense,not offense and early/midgame ,not once they start dodging bullets.
Grenadiers are simply not needed as support units.Pzgrens and osttruppen can do it better.This muni and MP sink will just drag you down.Every game you use them u'll get grenadier squadwipes along the line.Everygame -one way or other. |
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