Scott in LT or CP as the OKW Walking stuka.

I know your answer: but why do i need, vonivan in masters cup bla bla...
one game isn't enough bro, we need more evidence

This is not one game, this is a whole tournament, in almost every match it was.

Don't ask others for their player card if you're not prepared to show yours. If you want to look at mine, you can use the ladder thumbnail on the right and sort for 3v3 and you'll find me in the top 10 of most factions there.

Furthermore I don't know why you'd base your argument solely on the results of a 2v2 tournament

1. Because Relic does it. This tournament and other tournaments were held to improve the game balance. The developers took a more global view of the USF problem after the terrible game of the USF in the 2х2 anniversary classiс and in December 2018 we got good changes.

The tournament shows the best state of balance, because the best players play there, and you can’t say - L2P.

1. Because Relic does it. This tournament and other tournaments were held to improve the game balance. The developers took a more global view of the USF problem after the terrible game of the USF in the 2х2 anniversary classiс and in December 2018 we got good changes

Lol you do realize that I am on the community balance team working with Relic? And that I can definitely assure you that we do not take any tournament's results as an absolute measure for balance? As I said - tournament results are indicative at best.

The tournament shows the best state of balance, because the best players play there, and you can’t say - L2P.

The performance in the tourney is not based on your skill, but your analysis of the results is.

So l2p.

Furthermore balance should not occur with the top 1% of players, thats shitty ludology.

Lol you do realize that I am on the community balance team working with Relic? And that I can definitely assure you that we do not take any tournament's results as an absolute measure for balance? As I said - tournament results are indicative at best.

@Riley: apply some water on the burned area

Here is a contradiction, your friend claims that early stukas is a risk and a bad idea. Then I said transfer it to T3. You say now that this is a nerf. So can you give a definite answer? This is an advantage, and transfer to T3 will be considered a nerf, or it is not an advantage, and is a risk and not a working meta.

Normally people get Stukas after a Luchs and Puma. Early is anything before that and puts your Stuka at risk to a diving AEC or something similar. Transferring it to T3 is a big nerf in terms of timing. Even getting one before T3 has some risk because the 100 fuel means your first tank comes out about 3 minutes later.

I've ran into a few good that used double Scotts. It's really difficult to deal with as OST. They outrange your Stugs, can force your AT gun to retreat or be wiped, force a lot of retreats on infantry. Putting it in LT or CP would badly unbalance the game. If they were to change it, I'd like to see them turn it into a real howitzer, buffing the barrage considerably and further nerfing direct fire.

Furthermore balance should not occur with the top 1% of players, thats shitty ludology.

I do not want to contradict you, but add on top of what you said.
If the Top 1% of players finds a major flaw, cheese, exploit it should be addressed. But if the topmost 1% of players pulls good plays and great strategies, that is perfectly fine, they become best players by improving.

Imagine newbies playing equally as hardcore players, that would be absurd.

Lol you do realize that I am on the community balance team working with Relic? And that I can definitely assure you that we do not take any tournament's results as an absolute measure for balance? As I said - tournament results are indicative at best.

You are there the most mediocre role. I'm sure. Because your words diverge from official announcements. Moreover, a member of the balance team should be impartial, and you are a fan of OKW, who never covers the USF problem. What kind of developer are you?

And that I can definitely assure you that we do not take

Wow I'm talking to relic
This is immediately visible on your gray account.

You are there the most mediocre role. I'm sure. Because your words diverge from official announcements. Moreover, a member of the balance team should be impartial, and you are a fan of OKW, who never covers the USF problem. What kind of developer are you?

Sanders: States opinion contrary to you.

You: Sanders must be an axis fanboi.

Lol, get a grip dude.

Whether or not the stuka is t1 or t2 or t3, watching this guy troll a balance member is kind of upsetting

You are there the most mediocre role. I'm sure. Because your words diverge from official announcements. Moreover, a member of the balance team should be impartial, and you are a fan of OKW, who never covers the USF problem. What kind of developer are you?

Lol you do realize that I am on the community balance team working with Relic? And that I can definitely assure you that we do not take any tournament's results as an absolute measure for balance? As I said - tournament results are indicative at best.

Sander you on the ropes now

Not going to get too involved in this, but a couple of things.

1. Because Relic does it. This tournament and other tournaments were held to improve the game balance. The developers took a more global view of the USF problem after the terrible game of the USF in the 2х2 anniversary classiс and in December 2018 we got good changes.

The tournament shows the best state of balance, because the best players play there, and you can’t say - L2P.

Ultimately we don't just rely on tournament results or top player opinions. While important, they are just some of the indicators that inform balance.

Currently, I have four undisputable top ten players all telling me that USF is going to be OP in the upcoming patch, after playing numerous competitive mod preview games against each other.

Conversely, I currently have zero top players telling me that the Stuka is OP or unfair in its current tier, and don't recall any directly asking me for Stuka nerfs post the last 2v2 tourney.

As a tangential point, the balance team probably won't act on this pro player feedback right now, but suspects it to be correct. If/ when USF has to receive some small adjustments post-patch, you can bet your bottom dollar many vocal USF players will protest loudly, pro player consensus for the changes or not.

Additionally, comparing tool timing/ availability across factions is reductive and borderline disingenuous. In the indirect fire department alone, you can point to areas where USF has an advantage over both Axis factions.

You are there the most mediocre role. I'm sure. Because your words diverge from official announcements. Moreover, a member of the balance team should be impartial, and you are a fan of OKW, who never covers the USF problem. What kind of developer are you?

Not true. Sander has been an essential member of the balance team since he joined, and is comfortably one of the most dedicated and invovled.

Dirty OKW stan granted, but top fella.

jk, not really an okw stan

Kinda sad that both Sander and Andy had to reply to this epic rant thread. Just lock it already, there is no useful discussion here.

On topic: problem was not stuka, it was command panther and it's been dealt with.

Kinda sad that both Sander and Andy had to reply to this epic rant thread. Just lock it already, there is no useful discussion here.

On topic: problem was not stuka, it was command panther and it's been dealt with.

I agree that it could be locked, but I have this sliver of hope that maybe OP is serious and will be shown by a ray of hope that USF is not gods chosen faction (for this game) and that maybe balance is the best course of action.

As far as sander and Andy go though, I'm sure both of them have seen and heard from enough shit they know who to listen too and who to not

Yes, if the developers entered into the discussion, this should be blocked as soon as possible. You can not worry, I'm not going to continue this anymore.

Sander, I'm sorry, I was wrong, you are a good member of the balance team. But. But you hate the USF.

My English is bad. So I understood little from Andy's text, but I have a friend who can translate and explain this to me.

What the hell is this thread. It’s so bad that Relic had to yell at us

Whether or not the stuka is t1 or t2 or t3, watching this guy troll a balance member is kind of upsetting

I'm sure you could always apply to be part of the balance team. The interview probably goes like this:

You: Hey, I'm a top 10 player and would like to be part of the balance team!

Balance Team: Great! We have one opening currently. It's a very important position and includes being the spokesperson for the balance team. Have you heard of COH2.ORG?

I do wonder, based on Andy's comments, if we're going to return to the days when USF was OP in 1v1's but probably the worst in 4v4's.

I'm sure you could always apply to be part of the balance team. The interview probably goes like this:

You: Hey, I'm a top 10 player and would like to be part of the balance team!

Balance Team: Great! We have one opening currently. It's a very important position and includes being the spokesperson for the balance team. Have you heard of COH2.ORG?

I do wonder, based on Andy's comments, if we're going to return to the days when USF was OP in 1v1's but probably the worst in 4v4's.

Unfortunately I'm barely top 100 on the best of my days, so I'll continue my role as a cheerleader of sorts. I think they need those too

Kinda sad that both Sander and Andy had to reply to this epic rant thread. Just lock it already, there is no useful discussion here.

I cant agree anymore with you, but thankfully the thread its not closed yet so i can say this:

@Riley: Rest in Pepperoni...