Why USF so bad in tournaments?

they have same long range dps as volks but comes with much better mid and close range dps, better vet and better stating target size all for 30 more mp, i think they are effective as they are

Here's one of the few replays involving good players in an OKW vs USF matchup:

•  
  

  0

  VS

  El Profesor 17.09

  VonIvan

  21

  Prodi Smurf | Intense game

  by: VonIvan map: Unknown

  2

  -

At the six minute mark, the Damage/kills/deaths are:
OKW 3233 23 11
USF 1950 11 23

So somehow the units with better DPS manage to do about 60% of the damage and less than half the kills. Maybe you should give this player some tips because you clearly know more than he does. Also, this wasn't one of his test/troll builds.

At the 12 minute mark, the numbers are:
OKW 9350 52 39
USF 7970 39 56
USF is trading okay as mid game units come out.

The final stats were:
OKW 61717 175 189
USF 66036 189 182
Once the Jackson came out, USF started trading well. The pack howie was helpful for awhile but eventually wiped and not recrewed, but VonIvan got a Scott so the pack howie wasn't needed. Also, the other player built five MG34's, only one Raketen, and no JPIV's, which seem like strange choices. He also didn't cap the bottom VP until around 8 minutes which probably affected the outcome of the game.

VonIvan was down to 27 VP's when he won. Had the other player maintained his early game dominance for just another minute (or capped the bottom VP earlier) then he would not have won. That's a razor-thin margin, even for a good player.

This was on a wide map. Narrow ones like Alliance are worse.

Maybe "glass" isn't the right term for rifles and RA isn't what is important, but they're not good early game against OKW and get wiped too easily in team games once rocket arty comes out.

It was interesting to see VonIvan get a Stuart and use it.

1 don't trust the damage meter of the game is all fucked up
2 math is math

1 don't trust the damage meter of the game is all fucked up
2 math is math

If you ignore the damage meter and look at kills, the disparity is worse in the first six minutes, 23 to 11.

Not being cost effective is not something you can show JUST with unit stats. You can't just post a target size and say "see their cost effective!" In game KDR would be more helpful, but we don't have things like that

Wrong. Cost efficiency can be proved and shown using a mixture of stats and variables. It's a relative aspect of a unit, related to efficiency. If it can't be showed using logic and stats then it's all made up and hysterical.

Riflemen can not be cost effective but they get the job done on the shorter run, I wonder why no one mentioned that before?

I even agree partially with shadowlink about USF being bland, but having good units.

Wow are we really taking the stats of six minutes of one game to justify balance claims now? That´s insane.

1 don't trust the damage meter of the game is all fucked up
2 math is math

Riflemen are not the problem. The problem is Riflemen facing Volks + Sturms while RE are horrible in the first minutes. If it was only Riflemen vs Volks then USF would have an easy time.

Wrong. Cost efficiency can be proved and shown using a mixture of stats and variables. It's a relative aspect of a unit, related to efficiency. If it can't be showed using logic and stats then it's all made up and hysterical.

Riflemen can not be cost effective but they get the job done on the shorter run, I wonder why no one mentioned that before?

I even agree partially with shadowlink about USF being bland, but having good units.

Usf is more exciting to watch than okw, Brits, and Soviets. It is the early game doctrines which makes them a pleasure to watch. Pros are using cav riflemen, assault engineers, rangers, or paratroopers instead of riflemen spam.

Okw and Brits spam mainline infantry every fuking game.

Riflemen are not the problem. The problem is Riflemen facing Volks + Sturms while RE are horrible in the first minutes. If it was only Riflemen vs Volks then USF would have an easy time.

This.
And if you also conside the Riflemen to IS or Penals it becomes even more obvious.

1 don't trust the damage meter of the game is all fucked up
2 math is math

Math doesn't includes sturm, sandbag and molotov available way before BARs to support your volks.

Is that general dps? Ra modifiers are different between volks and grens.

Is that general dps? Ra modifiers are different between volks and grens.

Only until vet1, which can be achieved during first engagement.

Wrong. Cost efficiency can be proved and shown using a mixture of stats and variables. It's a relative aspect of a unit, related to efficiency. If it can't be showed using logic and stats then it's all made up and hysterical.

The part you just quoted:

Not being cost effective is not something you can show JUST with unit stats. You can't just post a target size and say "see their cost effective!" In game KDR would be more helpful, but we don't have things like that

KDR (kill death ratio) is a statistic genius, we just don't have it except at the end of single games. Idk wtf you're ranting about

like ? bar are much better than stgs and u even get zook if u want

I have to pay to unlock my bars and grenades, you get them with tech. That's a full squad of MP and 30 fuel I need in order to get stuff that comes with your regular tech costs

Again Rifleman are good. Not as cost effective as Volks, which are OP. You think volks are OP too don't you? Do you think rifleman are also OP? If you don't then i don't see how you can disagree with the statement that volks are more cost effective

I would just buff rifleman and tatical support commanders. I think usf is viable in 1v1. I guess will have to wait for a 1v1 tournament.

Here's one of the few replays involving good players in an OKW vs USF matchup:

•  
  

  0

  VS

  El Profesor 17.09

  VonIvan

  21

  Prodi Smurf | Intense game

  by: VonIvan map: Unknown

  2

  -

At the six minute mark, the Damage/kills/deaths are:
OKW 3233 23 11
USF 1950 11 23

So somehow the units with better DPS manage to do about 60% of the damage and less than half the kills. Maybe you should give this player some tips because you clearly know more than he does. Also, this wasn't one of his test/troll builds.

At the 12 minute mark, the numbers are:
OKW 9350 52 39
USF 7970 39 56
USF is trading okay as mid game units come out.

The final stats were:
OKW 61717 175 189
USF 66036 189 182
Once the Jackson came out, USF started trading well. The pack howie was helpful for awhile but eventually wiped and not recrewed, but VonIvan got a Scott so the pack howie wasn't needed. Also, the other player built five MG34's, only one Raketen, and no JPIV's, which seem like strange choices. He also didn't cap the bottom VP until around 8 minutes which probably affected the outcome of the game.

VonIvan was down to 27 VP's when he won. Had the other player maintained his early game dominance for just another minute (or capped the bottom VP earlier) then he would not have won. That's a razor-thin margin, even for a good player.

This was on a wide map. Narrow ones like Alliance are worse.

Maybe "glass" isn't the right term for rifles and RA isn't what is important, but they're not good early game against OKW and get wiped too easily in team games once rocket arty comes out.

It was interesting to see VonIvan get a Stuart and use it.

I love numbers) They give clarity and allow you to see real problems.

I love numbers) They give clarity and allow you to see real problems.

The stats might be useful to el professor but useless for balance discussion.

The stats might be useful to el professor but useless for balance discussion.

When it’s not in favor of your favorite faction, then yes - useless

Riflemen are not the problem. The problem is Riflemen facing Volks + Sturms while RE are horrible in the first minutes. If it was only Riflemen vs Volks then USF would have an easy time.

i think they are nerfing starting mp of okw so it will be sturm vs re and rifle and then volks come later

When it’s not in favor of your favorite faction, then yes - useless

That is one game. I don't even know if you pick sides. The stats from that game could say usf up or op? Von's early game was worse than his late game, idk?