New Commander Update Patch June 14th

Difference in base stats:

+10% accuracy on the main gun
1280HP vs Tiger's 1040HP
+100% DPS on the coaxial MG to compensate for the lack of top gunner
Slightly slower (4.7 speed / 1.5 acc vs Tiger's 5.2 and 1.8)

Doesn't it have different vet bonuses aswell?

If you leave your cursor on the vet stars it tells you more range at vet 2 and 3. From what it looks/feels like it also has more range.

I might be wrong though since the tooltips etc. are all wonky right now. (It might just feel like it due to the spearhead self spotting.)

Doesn't it have different vet bonuses aswell?

If you leave your cursor on the vet stars it tells you more range at vet 2 and 3. From what it looks/feels like it also has more range.

I might be wrong though since the tooltips etc. are all wonky right now. (It might just feel like it due to the spearhead self spotting.)

I noticed that too. It definitly does feel like it has more range than the normal Tiger.

PS, Tiger don't need all structures, only all tech and last building.


So, simply change it to: all structures has to be build. Then it is like King.

e.g. at the moment you can scip T2 and T3 for early Tiger.

I noticed that too. It definitely does feel like it has more range than the normal Tiger.

nah both get 5 range with vet and start at 45

Great patch! I dislike only one thing that has a big impact: Don't like it, that heavies get bound to tech structure instead of CPs. With ressource inflation in 3vs3 and 4vs4 Tiger comes so fast (and soon all other heavies will do so too). That shortens the phase where other tanks rule the battlefield. If tech skipping is a problem in 1vs1 you could bind the heavies to CPs and tech structure.

Edit: Made a poll about it. Just vote if you like to.

Doesn't it have different vet bonuses aswell?

If you leave your cursor on the vet stars it tells you more range at vet 2 and 3. From what it looks/feels like it also has more range.

I might be wrong though since the tooltips etc. are all wonky right now. (It might just feel like it due to the spearhead self spotting.)

Doesn't it get 55 range at veterancy 3?

45 base,
+ 5 at veterancy 2 and
+ 5 at veterancy 3?

That would explain the tool tips which state increased range on both levels.

Doesn't it get 55 range at veterancy 3?

45 base,
+ 5 at veterancy 2 and
+ 5 at veterancy 3?

That would explain the tool tips which state increased vet on both levels.

no still 50

Panzerfusilliers

PF miss 2 thing that VG have access to sandbags (imo should be removed from all mainline infatry or have speed decrease)


If the role is mainline infatry one should consider adding this options

In my opinion ALL mainline infantry should have the ability to build sandbags. The advantage of taking ground and digging in is negated when you cannot dig. Cover utilization and using infantry to take and hold ground is fundamental to the way CoH is played.

Not every infantry unit should have it though, just those that are considered “mainline” or “core” infantry.

In COH2 that means Riflemen, Conscripts, Grenadiers, Infantry Sections and Volksgrenadiers. All five of these squads should be able to build simple sandbag walls.

Additionally, Ostruppen should be able to build sandbags because they are essentially just crappier mainline infantry with no real advantages except cost, unlike Panzerfusiliers and Penal Troops who are an alternate to regular infantry, but do have specific strengths.

Lastly, all basic worker units should be able to build sandbags, barbed wire, some form of tank trap (Which shouldn’t provide cover, just halt movement) and some sort of mine. These are basic principles of modern warfare.

In my opinion ALL mainline infantry should have the ability to build sandbags. The advantage of taking ground and digging in is negated when you cannot dig. Cover utilization and using infantry to take and hold ground is fundamental to the way CoH is played.

Not every infantry unit should have it though, just those that are considered “mainline” or “core” infantry.

In COH2 that means Riflemen, Conscripts, Grenadiers, Infantry Sections and Volksgrenadiers. All five of these squads should be able to build simple sandbag walls.

Additionally, Ostruppen should be able to build sandbags because they are essentially just crappier mainline infantry with no real advantages except cost, unlike Panzerfusiliers and Penal Troops who are an alternate to regular infantry, but do have specific strengths.

Lastly, all basic worker units should be able to build sandbags, barbed wire, some form of tank trap (Which shouldn’t provide cover, just halt movement) and some sort of mine. These are basic principles of modern warfare.

I disagree:
1) it mess with map design
2) it creates the need for rush the cutoff strategies
3) it creates snowball affects
4) it reduces diversity since there is less reason to built anything else than mainlines infatry.

From my percpective - all mainline should build but there should be munitions cost. I just dont like spamming these things. A cost of say 10 munitions would make sense and stop sth I find strange especially at the beginning of the match - company pf wiring and sandbaging and tanktraping as quckly as you can shift click.

I disagree:
1) it mess with map design
2) it creates the need for rush the cutoff strategies
3) it creates snowball affects
4) it reduces diversity since there is less reason to built anything else than mainlines infatry.

I disagree with your disagreement, and I shall counter with:

1. Good maps don’t have that problem.
2. No, it just means dislodging infantry from a dug in location is more likely to be a problem if you lose the initial fight which means....
3. Yes, snowball effects, but in a good way because....
4. It increases diversity because now you are forced to build cover counters like flamethrowers or mortars or tech grenades/Molotovs instead of just building a blob of LMG Grenadiers or BAR Riflemen to out muscle the enemy blob.

If you made all infantry able to dig in with “free” sandbags then you are allowing players to spend their fourth resource in different ways.

The fourth resource being Time.

If you cannot dig in, there is less reason to defend a position while waiting for a counter attack. Therefore your Time is better Spent advancing and attempting to take another point or just moving up the map farther in order to have more room to fall back from when the inevitable meeting engagement happens out in the open. That encourages blobbing because in the open numbers matter more. BUT! If you CAN build sandbags then you can Spend that Time digging in on the current position.

Sandbags on all mainline infantry improves the overall diversity of play styles by giving players a different way to spend Time, the fourth resource.

I disagree with your disagreement, and I shall counter with:

1. Good maps don’t have that problem.
2. No, it just means dislodging infantry from a dug in location is more likely to be a problem if you lose the initial fight which means....
3. Yes, snowball effects, but in a good way because....
4. It increases diversity because now you are forced to build cover counters like flamethrowers or mortars or tech grenades/Molotovs instead of just building a blob of LMG Grenadiers or BAR Riflemen to out muscle the enemy blob.

If you made all infantry able to dig in with “free” sandbags then you are allowing players to spend their fourth resource in different ways.

The fourth resource being Time.

If you cannot dig in, there is less reason to defend a position while waiting for a counter attack. Therefore your Time is better Spent advancing and attempting to take another point or just moving up the map farther in order to have more room to fall back from when the inevitable meeting engagement happens out in the open. That encourages blobbing because in the open numbers matter more. BUT! If you CAN build sandbags then you can Spend that Time digging in on the current position.

Sandbags on all mainline infantry improves the overall diversity of play styles by giving players a different way to spend Time, the fourth resource.

Agree with all the logics here and support it, especially the diversity part it could give. I see one problem though. I wouldn't like the game to become company od 'clickers'. The constant need to be building sth seems like totally wrong to me from the gameplay perspective. One or two sandbags in a new place sometimes is just enogh to make the engagement a bit more interesting and less predicatble. That's why I'd suggest some cost to building those structures. It should be small but should not allow to spam them. 5 munitions for example should be fine.

...

We are getting a bit off topic now.

If engineer have the ability to built cover you simply need more time to set up your defenses while using more units types. Both are good things.

Anyways, back more on topic, it seems like PanzerGrenadiers got over buffed.

Been watching some casts and damn if they aren’t performing really strongly.

My fix/ slight nerf would be to return them to the WM tier 2. (I’ve never liked the idea of building multiple tiers of units from the HQ building anyways.)

I don’t have a problem with them being powerful, but separating them from a tier structure allows for more tech skipping strategies that I thought we all agreed is bad for balance.

Stalling for late game tanks with early game call ins is just as bad if not worse than stalling for late game call ins with a heavy tier 1 and 2.

Just put PGs back in tier 2. The Allied equivalent would be if Soviets unlocked Penal Troops at the HQ they unlocked molotovs or something.

Gives Infantry Sections the Assault Section Upgrade
Requires Platoon Command Post.
Costs 70 munitions.
Gives the squad 2 Thompson SMGs and arms the rest with Sten Guns and No.77 White Phosphorous Grenades, and removes their Out-of-Cover penalties; Sten Guns use Assault Engineer Grease Gun stats.
Grants -5% Receieved Accuracy to the squad.
Locks out other Infantry Section upgrades; takes up 1 weapon slot.
Unit is still affected by Bolster Squads when upgraded with this item


STUPIDITY! glad I dont waste my time on this game anymore



To improve the performance of Conscripts, while retaining their role as utility infantry that excel at defense and supporting other units, we have added an upgrade to help them scale into the late game. The extra man and reduced reinforce cost will allow them to more effectively trade against opposing infantry while the veterancy bonus will allow fresh Conscript squads to gain veterancy.
New squad upgrade available after the Mechanized Armor Kampaneya is deployed.
Mobilized Reserves: Increases squad size by 1, reduces model reinforce cost to 17 and increases veterancy gain by 20%. Takes up 1 weapon slot. Costs 50 munitions.
When upgraded with Mobilize Reserves, weapon cooldown and reload on Mosin Nagant rifles is reduced by 30% when in cover.
Improved Damage Per Second (DPS) with upgrade:
Conscript Rifle: 3.61/2.6/1.98/1.346/1.0
Conscript Rifle in Cover: 3.91/2.87/2.21/1.54/1.22
At range: 0/10/20/30/35

Even More Blatant and Rediculous stupidity dunno how you could top the first change but here it is! LOL Allied Infantry Spam ridiculousness will never be fixed sadly

PS, Tiger don't need all structures, only all tech and last building.


So, simply change it to: all structures has to be build. Then it is like King.

e.g. at the moment you can scip T2 and T3 for early Tiger.

+1

Anyways, back more on topic, it seems like PanzerGrenadiers got over buffed.

Been watching some casts and damn if they aren’t performing really strongly.

My fix/ slight nerf would be to return them to the WM tier 2. (I’ve never liked the idea of building multiple tiers of units from the HQ building anyways.)

I don’t have a problem with them being powerful, but separating them from a tier structure allows for more tech skipping strategies that I thought we all agreed is bad for balance.

Stalling for late game tanks with early game call ins is just as bad if not worse than stalling for late game call ins with a heavy tier 1 and 2.

Just put PGs back in tier 2. The Allied equivalent would be if Soviets unlocked Penal Troops at the HQ they unlocked molotovs or something.

Actually I think maybe the Grens should be put in the HQ and the PGs should replace them in T1, just a random thought I had.

+1

Yeah. Skipping all tier structures then going straight to Tiger is quite potent when you factor in the buffed Assault Grenadiers (early anti infantry call in squad) and Panzer Grenadiers (good all around infantry that can get panzershrecks as AT with no building) and MG42 teams are already built from the HQ building.

The problem isn’t that any squad is OP. The problem is that the new commander allows Wehrmacht to skip all tech building while retaining a strong force with glaring weaknesses. You can skip the PaK40 and T2 because of newly buffed PanzerGrenadiers being moved to HQ and skip T1 because you can get newly buffed Assault Grenadiers as call ins backed up by an MG42 or two because they are also in the HQ!

Counter with infantry? Nope. PanzerGrenadiers are good at all ranges now, plus they don’t have to build tech for them so you save investment manpower which negates their main weakness (high cost/investment). Plus early rush of Assault Grenadiers are also a tough but now.

Counter with light vehicles? Nope, PanzerGrenadiers again, this time with panzershrecks.

Counter with HMG teams? Nope, damn PanzerGrenadiers at it again with smoke grenades to punch straight through (like old days Riflemen with smoke grenades which was deemed too OP I might add. Lol )

Counter with medium tanks? Nope, PanzerGrenadiers still got you covered with the panzershrecks. Not as bad as before but now they’re just stalling until the Tiger hits and thumbs down your medium tanks.

Counter with snipers? This might work except that USF does not have one. Bummer. Maybe urban assault could add one maybe? Or a reworked rifle company maybe? I’m just throwing out ideas guys.

I’d like to see your ideas on a good counter to this. Doesn’t have to be a change to the game, just a strategy that y’all find that works.

Actually I think maybe the Grens should be put in the HQ and the PGs should replace them in T1, just a random thought I had.

And have them absolutely roflstomp vet0 allied infantry in the first engagement of the game? And then continue to roflstomp them until they get weapon upgrades and elite infantry/light vehicle support? Plz no.

Are sections not supposed to be able to make trenches anymore? Because I didn't see anything in the patchnotes about it but they aren't able to anymore. Also, the thompson upgrade hotkey conflicts with build hotkey btw (both are B on classic hotkeys).

USF rifles throw their molotovs too quickly. Maybe it is just an effect of new, unexpected thing, so I am thinking like this, but imo they should have the same timer for lava nades than volks have atm.
Same thing appears to shermans new phosphorous shot: it seems that now they can fire a regular shot and then fire a phosphorous one like ostheer sniper fires multiple times without cooldown. This combination gives you a possibility to instakill a pak40 gun crew, it should be fixed.
Calliope is simply overbuffed imo and I don't really get why modder team decided that this unit underperforms, but now it is way too creepy even for a so expensive rocket arty. Maybe, again, it seems to overperform since literally everybody now plays new commanders and their abilities seems to be to strong, but rocket artyllery, which can fire on closest possible distance without risk of insta wipe from players quick rush with a panzer while unit is throwings rounds out... Looks like logically overperforming imo.

Cons SVTs are OK, havent really seen any point in penal PPSH, even as answer to assgren spam. AT call-in is cheap, but noncencly weak. I understand, that powerful AI-based commander, which has powerful AT abilities is bad idea, but can we get any kind of debuff to targeted vehicle when ability is activated? Stun or something like that could be nice to deal with unsupported tiger/ele/jagd engagements.
It is very, very sad, that soviet paras cannot use a parachute, I was glad to see a second RTS in my life which opened a theme of soviet paratroopers, but nah. This squad is ok in everything except it's arrival. This is annoying 6-model long/middle range on stock based infantry, which can, for example, occupy a strong garrison securing enemy's cutoff and troll opponent quiet strongly. It has a simple fix: make them appear as 4 model from the building, like land matress commandos. Those guys have a possibility to build itself a hidden FRP (which really needs a cost increase, FRP for 100 mp and 15 fuel is too cheesy, and, btw, I guess all FRPs should have a penalties like slower teinforcing when FRP is active, am I right?) in enemy's rears, if needed, so there is some performance for them until first reinforcement. Anyway, even 4 PPSH coming like OUT OF FUCKING NOWHERE can quickly wipe MG-42 weapon team since they are so fat with their 1,25 target size, eeh.
Also, stock or vet camo for soviet paras could be nice imo.

OKW new commander is alright, I just don't get why if schwere is destroyed u need to restore it for getting a tiger. Really, this commander already got a lot of people out from rushing t2 and increased unit diversity, why penalty for using a schwere out from the base sector is that high?

Ostheer new commander got unexpected FRP, which is cool, and imo is should not be taken out, just adding a reinforce penalty will fix the deal. Assgrens still be weak. Good tool for flanking, but that is all what they are atm, especially when every faction players are playing now with those new commanders with close-combat infantry included.
This 6-men upgrade should bring a better buff for assgrens since they are definitely can face shocks and rangers after player picked assgren commander. It is bad, when one ability counters by 1 click, and that is what happened with assgrens all the time since they were added, I guess.

In the end of this chaotic feedback just want to thank a modder team for doing a good job. Cons and Ostwind are smiling while killing eachother, it is nice to be again a relevant unit.