Feedback for Commander Revamppatch

What?

The M21 Mortar HT is overlapping with the Mortar team and pack howitzer for the USF in both Infantry and Mech Companies.

Literally any infantry with bazookas is good in the M3 Halftrack, especially when using with Combined Arms (the 76mm Sherman comes to mind here).

On the contrary, I would say that Mech Company has more synergy than Armor Company.

What are Assault Engineers exactly? Are they elite infantry? Are they close combat infantry? Are they assault infantry?

What's their synergy with the rest of the commander? Vehicle crews can already repair their own vehicles so their repair ability is pretty useless, REs can already build what they can and even better, so can Rifles along with Riflemen Field Defenses and so forth. Their only real unique ability is that to deploy demo charges and that they're armed with M3 Grease Guns, that's about it.

Elite Crews are useless and I still consider them as such so I see no synergy here.

The M10 is overlapping with the M36 Jackson so there's no other reason to get it right now other than being cheaper and a bit faster.

The 105 Sherman used to overlap with the regular Sherman using HE rounds, not anymore in the preview.

And the 240mm Arty is just the Ost railway arty so nothing to say here.

If we're going by the name alone the only really "armor" themed things here are the Elite Crews and tanks, that's about it.

Mech Company has more "Armor" in it than actual Armor Company.

Mortar HT is a mobile indirect fire unit with powerful abilities ( HE, phosphorous rounds).It doesn't overlap with pack howitzer and t0 mortar for these reasons.

I wouldn't spit on a 5 men flamer squad with good close combat firepower (i might be wrong but they use the same stats of the cav riflemen grease guns). They can repair, they can lay down mines and some defences. You might want them on a map with lots of covers and buildings.

M10 is a much cheaper tank destroyer, with much lower pop cap, you can get out 1 on them much faster than a jackson giving you a nice answer to a P4 rush by OKW or Ostheer. On large maps it excels in fast flanking attacks. I wouldn't understimate this unit.

The off map arty is a very good area denial in the revamped version. And ofc it's always handy an off map call for arty support.

Sherman bulldozer (revamped) is probably even OP, it obliterate enemy infantry with that huge AoE.

Elite crews i agree with you, they are quite disappointing.

Elite Crews are still a fun concept now, since you'd upgrade one of your light vehicles, go around dismounting to finish off a flanked team weapon then hop back in. But the real power is if you can vet them hard then swap them to say your 105 Sherman, so it can get it's vet2 bonus as it becomes online, now that would be fun.

Feedback as of v1.3

US
ARMOUR COMPANY
This commander is a lot better than it was, it's more viable thanks to the improvements made, especially to the M10.
* 105mm Bulldozer is more consistant and useful
* Assault engineers are good, personally I'd like to see them also be able to build sandbags so they can help other infantry
* M10 feels a lot more useful now and thanks to the abilities it's now useful vs tanks and inf

Now that assault engineers have demo charges it would be a good time to change demo charges so that they can destroy decrewed support weapons with a single charge. So that the demo charge actually has a useful role, perhaps lower the price to 45.

MECHANIZED COMPANY
As of version 1.3 this commander is superb!
* WC-51 is a lot of fun to use and is a really interesting unique unit that is fun to have and make full use of
* Cavalry riflemen are a really fantastic addition to this commander and make it so much more viable to use in 1vs1 onwards, especially thanks to their sticky bomb
* The other units and abilities go really well and all together make a really solid commander
Really fantastic job with this commander! If this version makes it into the patch the US will have a really fun solid commander that is always worth having. If people think the commander has too many units I would recommend getting rid of the M3 and mortar half-track. You can easily lose those and it will still be a really excellent commander.


BRITS
Providing the Brits with AT nades is a huge universal improvement and makes them a lot more fun to play as.
BRITISH ARTILLERY
Not many big changes with this one. I don't really think it would be worth using in 1vs1s but now it's more solid for team games.
* The Valentine is a lot better and is a fun unit to use

TACTICAL SUPPORT
This commander feels like it's for team matches, so again, not likely to be used in 1vs1s. But now it's better for team games.
The improvements to the Crocodile help make other commander more viable so that's a really useful bonus.


SOVIETS
NKVD RIFLE DISRUPTION TACTICS
This commander feels really good as of 1.3
* Commissar is really good it's a fun unit to use and the abilities make it a really interesting commander
* Scorched Earth is great and another fun ability to use
* If the KV8 could be swapped for a KV1 this would instantly become a really solid and fun 1vs1 and up commander. I can't stress enough how much I think the should be swapped! *crosses fingers*

URBAN DEFENSE TACTICS
I really like the improvements made to this commander, and the attempts to make the M42 useful (please increase the cloaked movement speed).
At the moment it's still only going to be useful for team games, perhaps swap the incendiary call-in for the KV8, which would fit with the idea of making and holding forward HQs and would help with late game armour.


OKW
ELITE ARMOUR
Again, no big changes but the improvements made to the abilities have really helped this commander.
* The Sturmtiger feels better and more useful
I'm looking forward to seeing what you replace Signal Relay with.

OVERWATCH
I really love the changes to this commander, this is another commander who, as of 1.3, is really solid and if this version makes it into the patch it would always be one of my picks.
* Being able to booby trap points with Jaegers feels perfect for the commander style
Really great job!


WEHR
DEFENSIVE DOCTRINE
This is a really fun interesting commander. They don't really have much for the late game, but the early stuff and sector artillery make them a really fun commander to use and one I'd certainly try and use regularly in 1vs1s.

GERMAN INFANTRY
This commander feels more like a gimic than anything. I can't really see it ever being used in 1vs1 or even team games.


Overall I'm hugely impressed by the patch mod so far, there are so many really excellent improvements and additions. Great work and really well done to everyone working on it so far!

ACHTUNG!

I just realized that the notes say nothing about changing veterancy bonuses.

If Stormtroopers are changed to MP40s but this remains the same...



...they're going to be completely worthless and suicidal, so need to give them Panzergrenadier veterancy bonuses with this change.

ACHTUNG!

I just realized that the notes say nothing about changing veterancy bonuses.

If Stormtroopers are changed to MP40s but this remains the same...



...they're going to be completely worthless and suicidal, so need to give them Panzergrenadier veterancy bonuses with this change.

Yeah 40% accuracy boost at vet2 is completely worthless and suicidal. Keep in mind that they have a 0.75 target size and camouflage.

Yeah 40% accuracy boost at vet2 is completely worthless and suicidal. Keep in mind that they have a 0.75 target size and camouflage.

The ONLY reason Panzergrenadiers have ANY chance of accomplishing anything is because of their continuous received accuracy reduction.

If Stormtroopers start out with lower received accuracy than Panzergrenadiers, then that's something I wasn't aware of, but if they start out the same (presumably, they use the same models), then lack of stacking RA reduction with every rank is going to make them suicidal.

Also, MP40s are still absurdly weak, but that issue is secondary to the extreme necessity of a four-man SMG squad being able to survive longer than three seconds in combat.

The ONLY reason Panzergrenadiers have ANY chance of accomplishing anything is because of their continuous received accuracy reduction.

If Stormtroopers start out with lower received accuracy than Panzergrenadiers, then that's something I wasn't aware of, but if they start out the same (presumably, they use the same models), then lack of stacking RA reduction with every rank is going to make them suicidal.

Also, MP40s are still absurdly weak, but that issue is secondary to the extreme necessity of a four-man SMG squad being able to survive longer than three seconds in combat.

I think I remember a reliable source on here saying their RA is 0.75. That's very small for a vet0 unit, smaller man for man than commandos (obviously commandos have 1 more man).

Also, the mp40s on stormtroopers are for sure a lot better than all the other types. They supposedly are a bit better than commando stens 1 for one, which is very good. And again, they have camo.

I used them the other day and spawned them out of a building, hopped back in the building, and beat 2 rifle squads without BARs from about 10 meters with no grenades and no movement on either side. They aren't pio mp40s XD

Can someone just post me the details for the WC51 mark target? Can't seem to find the entire info on it. How much bonus damage does it do? Cost? (Hopefully) doesn't callin a plane like the soviet one?

Also, the mp40s on stormtroopers are for sure a lot better than all the other types. They supposedly are a bit better than commando stens 1 for one, which is very good. And again, they have camo.

I used them the other day and spawned them out of a building, hopped back in the building, and beat 2 rifle squads without BARs from about 10 meters with no grenades and no movement on either side. They aren't pio mp40s XD

Now if only Assault Grenadiers could trade in their MP40s for the better variety...

As for Stormtroopers, won't there also be a different "downside" to +40% accuracy? Isn't that degree of accuracy buff usually reserved only for rifles due to their low rate of fire? Won't +40% accuracy on SMGs make them literally instawipe a unit up close?

Or am I talking out of my arse? I don't remember the exact accuracy stats on SMGs vs rifles, just going off generic knowledge.

Can someone just post me the details for the WC51 mark target? Can't seem to find the entire info on it. How much bonus damage does it do? Cost? (Hopefully) doesn't callin a plane like the soviet one?

It reduces armor, doesn't increase damage received, not sure how much.
I think it costed between 30 to 40 munitions.
It does summon a plane like the Soviet Mark.

1) Is it a bug or brit repair station just cannot give emergency war speed and have to do it manually with sapper .. nvm only nub try comet line these day everyone goes for churchill

2) should the brit snare given to infantry faction instead like other faction (ost.okw.usf.sov) 's snare on mainline infantry.. will it be too op if sapper with 2 piat combine with snare.

3) any thought on hammer line adjustment?

I am moderate brit player (lv18) and might be biased but brit in 1v1 is easily countered by ost sniper and 1 click puma hard country aec. Its quite painful for me to see ukf only have 30% win ratio at 1v1 gcs https://www.coh2.org/news/81260/gcs2-game-stats-with-siphon-x. perhaps brit sniper can be put at t1 and unlockable after IS/MG/UC is build .. dont know .. Its good to see new patch anyway . lets see what u guys will do

Can someone just post me the details for the WC51 mark target? Can't seem to find the entire info on it. How much bonus damage does it do? Cost? (Hopefully) doesn't callin a plane like the soviet one?

Mark Target

Deploys a recon plane while the target vehicle received 25% reduced armour and is 25% easier to hit. This ability is on a global cooldown

...
And I honestly wouldn't mind giving all viable commanders only good abilities and not a balanced loadout, so choosing a commander actually feels like a game-changing specialization (like it was in CoH1) instead of being a minor supplement to your base army. As long as all commanders are like this, it would be fairly balanced.
...

That would only lead in having to nerf the faction and further increase the gap from "op commanders" wit the rest of them.

One has to decide how powerful commanders need to be for each faction and bring as many as he can at that level.

NKVD doctrine has no scaling into late game, and Commisar alone isnt going to carry it.
It needs either PPSh upgrade for conscripts or KV-1 as suggested above

Also vet1 increasing squad size is bit silly, its not a real ability.
It would be better off to just increase squad size to 6 from beginning and give squad more fitting Penal vet (To the last man!), then you could drop RA from 0.87 back to 0.97

You could also give grenade to Commisar, it's only elite infantry squad doctrine has after all, nothing else could threaten wipes on the field otherwise

Ppsh cons.

Also, rangers and thompsons paras are better then cav rifles, you survived that, you'll survive cav rifles.

Rangers and thompsons can be pushed away with vehicles WITHOUT worrying about being snared.

Allot of unit are being changed and introduced with revamp but it seem that only their primary stat are being touched. It is my opinion that all stats of the units should be looked at.

For instance Dozer, assault engineers, Sexton... are all getting major buffs yet their XP values are not being increased (or their prices, Dozer available at the cost of Sherman+70mu...).

The cavalry riflemen come with a rather long reinforcement time (it is my opinion that reinforcement and build time should be standardized across squad types even if it being done gradually).

CP for abilities need to be checked.

Vet abilities (and bonuses) like the one KV-8/stug-E has can be replaced, for instance the damage reduction is very powerful and could be move to vet 1 active ability (or passive), or stug get another ability like direct fire mode. Vet bonuses for these unit like mobility for KV-8 and Armor for stug-E should replaced (in the case of the Stug-E instead of buffing HP/target size that could replace the armor bonus).

Generally the changes should focus in than just DPS.

Rangers and thompsons can be pushed away with vehicles WITHOUT worrying about being snared.

Terrifying. This commander will be op for sure. But its ok when half axis units have panzerfaust lol

Rangers and thompsons can be pushed away with vehicles WITHOUT worrying about being snared.

If there is additional AT around, you're not going to be pushing anything regardless of AT nades.

If there is no additional AT around, unless for whatever reason you're trying to push them with light vehicle, meds will not be snared.

shock troops have smoke and grenades and better armor and every elite infrnatry from axis side has AT option cavalry riflemen is fine as it is

It might be worth giving the cav riflemen the assault engineer models, or maybe half and half. Something to make them a bit more distinctive.