Do you think ScoutCar is OP now?

I don't get it. The scout car's AI ability remains the same if upgraded or not, why would it suddenly become op? Just because I now only need one instead of two scout cars to deal with m3's n cons?

I don't get it. The scout car's AI ability remains the same if upgraded or not, why would it suddenly become op? Just because I now only need one instead of two scout cars to deal with m3's n cons?

Before the coaxial LMG was disabled after upgrading the 20mm Autocannon.

Now it stays active, and it's too effective at killing infantry for its cost, it completely denies M3 play (which is should) but it also now dicks on conscripts and other infantry.

EDIT: As it has been mentioned elsewhere - now its the early equivalent of SU-85 kiting. It just reverses out of conscript range while peppering away and killing models rapidly.

Well a 222 with vet scales effectively into late game since I've had vet 2-3 222s kill vetless T70s and SU-76s by themselves last patch. I've also seen T34s have trouble against them though that might have changed with the recent T34 buffs.

Point is that scout car is way too cheap for what it does and what it can do. When it hits vet 2 it is way too easy to micro and doesn't punish a player who misuses it enough.

I think if it gets to vet 2 you're usually microing it reasonably well. It's still much harder to micro than a veteran scout car (no overdrive, oorah on the enemy, squad inside for extra damage output and access to repair). Still one shotted by mines and very vulnerable to AT nades if you actually outmanoeuvre it or if the German player's micro lapses for a second.

Personally I like that you don't need two of them in different states of upgradedness to counter the sniper/scout car combo.

Before the coaxial LMG was disabled after upgrading the 20mm Autocannon.

Now it stays active, and it's too effective at killing infantry for its cost, it completely denies M3 play (which is should) but it also now dicks on conscripts and other infantry.

EDIT: As it has been mentioned elsewhere - now its the early equivalent of SU-85 kiting. It just reverses out of conscript range while peppering away and killing models rapidly.

Ok. But they did not buff the coaxial mg or something right? So the only thing that's different now is, that you have the AT and the AI ability of the 222 unified in one unit or am I mistaken? So people managed to deal with one upgraded and one non upgraded scout car but they struggle to take out the "new" scout car? really?

I think I like it the way it is now because it felt so weird last patch with the up gun just kinda did nothing to infantry. I like the new scout car although believe it should be more expensive maybe an increase in manpower by 30-50. It is vulnerable to mines, AT grenades and guards. The scout car wouldn't be much of a problem if the other aspects were more balanced. (Flanking)

The 221/222 is (now) good to harrass Cons, Engineers and Weapon teams, and with vet 2 it survives a zis hit. I like this unit very much.

Just played a 3vs3 as Ostheer, had the most amazing stroke of luck. I went for a Scout Car + upgrade as soon as possible and sent it into the field, only to run into 2 Soviet Scout Cars. Those Scout Cars were destroyed and mine gained a Vet 2 status in seconds! Changed the early game completely, since I was now able to micro my Scout Car all over the field, knowing they wouldn't be able to counter it for a while. Teared a whole lot of conscripts and mortar teams a new one this way, never saw a game being decided this early in the match.

Still don't think this unit is OP'd though, but the Soviet has to take it into account from step one, which kind of gridlocks the Soviet opening game... Although I haven't played a lot of games with the new patch (about 8), I have the feeling that Soviet snipers, a great unit if used correctly, aren't as popular as they used to be.

Hardly OP. It's too fragile. Decent soviets can use AT guns and mines to 1 shot SC to death. When it reaches vet 2 it becomes good.

So it needs a big manpower price increase and slight health buff.

Well, I thought they were fine the way they were. I don't understand why they got a buff, but I think they are still AT nade food. Keeping a scout car back far enough so that it becomes useless is good enough for me until I can get something to deal with it.

Infantry in cover also damage it pretty decently.

@MoonHoplite yes mines too!

@Blovski Oh that's why I think they got the buff, to deal with soviet snipers which are sort of OP right now anyways.

They didn't buff it, they just fix the 222 bug

Agreed. Even felt that way last patch with how well they do against Conscripts and Shocks. Once they hit Vet2 they are extremely useable and that does come relatively quickly for them aswell I believe.

yeah, that's the overall problem with them, once they hit vet 2 which is pretty dam easy they become very hard to deal with making their small cost seem too cheap.

Actually an MP cost increase seems reasonable. Before the patch you had to build 2 222's one upgunned and one unupgunned to deal with M3's and Inf now you only need one to achieve the same effect.

Hardly OP. It's too fragile. Decent soviets can use AT guns and mines to 1 shot SC to death. When it reaches vet 2 it becomes good.

So it needs a big manpower price increase and slight health buff.

By the time the enemy rolls out an AT gun, the Scout Car will have already inflicted a lot of damage, perhaps enough to get to Vet 2 (which isn't that hard if you ask me). If the enemy rushed the AT gun, planning ahead for a Scout Car, he will have to make sacrifices in early game map control.

Mines can handle Scout Cars with ease, but I wouldn't want to rely on those alone to deal with it, since luck is a bit of a factor here, especially on bigger maps.

Once again, they're not OP'd, just hard to handle and a bit too cheap for the damage they are able to inflict. They come out very early and have the ability to dominate early game! Just read the post I made here yesterday, about the 3vs3 which was decided by a Scout Car on my part. Rolled it out, upgraded it and ran into 2 Soviet Scout Cars, making mine achieve vet 2 in seconds, allowing me to drive around behind enemy lines, killing enemy infantry by the bunch. We were already pushing towards their base without a single T3 unit on the field... Sure it was a stroke of luck to run into those Soviet Scout Cars, but still. I play mainly Ostheer, but I must say, it needs an increased price in order to balance things out.

Like I said before, in order to deal with it properly, Soviet has to adapt his early game, making Special Rifle Command a tricky choice as starter building...

I love the 222 as it is now. It was irritating that the 20mm upgrade made it totally useless vs infantry. They can maybe increase its manpower cost slightly, increase from 80mp to 90-100mp, not more.

I am a bit surprised how quickly the complaints about the buffed/fixed scout car subsided so I guess this is a good sign.

It really is very fragile but can also keep M3s at bay and now does good damage.
It is fun to use but you also have to be careful with it, so I think it is in a good place right now.

it's not OP at all but the fact that now any soviet incorporates some form of AT in the early game shows how much of an impact the change has made.
It's a very strong unit when it comes out (the sooner the better), but its effectiveness drops quickly

I am a bit surprised how quickly the complaints about the buffed/fixed scout car subsided so I guess this is a good sign.

It really is very fragile but can also keep M3s at bay and now does good damage.
It is fun to use but you also have to be careful with it, so I think it is in a good place right now.

I agree. From a soviet player's perspective they are very quick to kill if they get themselves in the wrong situation. Getting a single AT grenade, which has been buffed, on a scout car ends them fairly quickly. Their acceleration prevents them from roaming without risk. Many times I see a scout car run past my conscripts and catch an easy AT grenade.

Scout cars also suffer from the same fate as M3s in that they become obsolete when armor starts coming on the field. Getting them seems to be a short term strategy.

its Op once it gets a vet star or two it turns into a fucking p4 pretty much, 2-3 vet stars on ur armored car which for some reason gets veterency VERY VERY quickly, and u have a strong ass tank that can take 2-3 AT shells and a shit ton of AT nades/small arms.

the answer is to make it stop gaining veterency so quickly or making it weaker when it has vet stars. Its rediculous when it has a couple.

yes