Making combined arms viable

Right now there is almost no reason to use team weapon with infantry and you are better off spamming maxim or/and mortar, or simply spamming penal/green/volks/rifle cause generally just 1 support weapon is not gonna make that much difference, I think to actually make mixed units viable we should give infantry a very low suppression bonus that will never be enough to suppress squad even when blobbed but it could be added to mg suppression when they fire together and keep them suppressed a bit more when they go out of the mg fire arc if the inf is still firing, and we need to penalize more the auto fire scatter of mortar in the fog of war and making the manual barrage more appealing by buffing fire rate/scatter/n° of shells.
All this changes would allow mg to suppress blob, and unit in general, faster if supported and make mortar not auto wipe machine if not given line of sight (barrage is not nerfed just the AA), making cheesy tactics (penal/green spam) easier to counter with mg and inf. and making mortar more capable of dislodging support weapon but not being a wipe machine if spammed


edit:ty mod

I'd rather make English viable first.

Edit: Agreed with OP.

I'd rather make English viable first.

Edit: Agreed with OP.

can u kindly point out my mistakes eng is not my mother language

can u kindly point out my mistakes eng is not my mother language

It's mostly the title as you already pointed out in your edit and a few small things in the body of the text like using plural for words. Anyhow at least you're not as bad as Hector (lol). No hard feelings pal, it's just friendly banter like always.

Giving normal infantry squads suppression passively is a no-no go. There was a patch on which Grenadiers had it and it was stupid (i think it was during Pio march spam).
What you could use/adjust is the "in combat" status and "suppression recovery". You could extend the first one, and reduce the second one.

To incentivize barrage over AA fire is always good in my book.

well from my experience combined arms work pretty good this patch. :-)

OP, are you talking 1v1? In 2v2 and higher I think combined arms is great.

I've found my success to be far more likely when using combined arms and not exceeding 3 of any one infantry/team weapons unit type (not counting "stolen" team weapons).

I suppose a "balanced build" may find itself sucker punched by someone mass blobbing (or an arranged team double blobbing), but you can usually counter that if you are going combined arms.

Side question: has CoH1 or CoH2 ever had a game mechanic where a global debuff is applied to an army when it has "too many" of a unit type?

Something like -10% efficacy per squad over 2? So someone with 5 con squads would ahve -30% to all cons.

I can win games with spam and combined arms, i dont see problem with it. Combined arms work, but spam is more effective and reliable.
Also in some situations you dont need combine arms, specially its hard to do with OKW and brits.

Side question: has CoH1 or CoH2 ever had a game mechanic where a global debuff is applied to an army when it has "too many" of a unit type?

Something like -10% efficacy per squad over 2? So someone with 5 con squads would ahve -30% to all cons.

If I remember correctly in Coh 1 wer pio suffered a damage or received accuracy penalty when they where spammed.

OP, are you talking 1v1? In 2v2 and higher I think combined arms is great.

I've found my success to be far more likely when using combined arms and not exceeding 3 of any one infantry/team weapons unit type (not counting "stolen" team weapons).

I suppose a "balanced build" may find itself sucker punched by someone mass blobbing (or an arranged team double blobbing), but you can usually counter that if you are going combined arms.

Side question: has CoH1 or CoH2 ever had a game mechanic where a global debuff is applied to an army when it has "too many" of a unit type?

Something like -10% efficacy per squad over 2? So someone with 5 con squads would ahve -30% to all cons.

i think this is a more elegant way to buff mg without making the old maxim meta

Which begs the question: why wasn't this accuracy debuff carried over into CoH2 to prevent blobbing from happening?

Blobing should be a viable strat, the main problem is the counters to blobing aren't effective. I would like to see a modifier to hmgs to increase suppression effects the more squads are caught by the hmg, this way hmgs would effectively be able to counter things like gren with mg42 blobs and infantry sections with bolster squad and double vickers blobs.

If I remember correctly in Coh 1 wer pio suffered a damage or received accuracy penalty when they where spammed.

Not spammed, but blobbed and it was introduced very late into the game life span.
It also completely failed to deliver its purpose, which was allowing brits some breathing room in early game.

Which begs the question: why wasn't this accuracy debuff carried over into CoH2 to prevent blobbing from happening?

Boy oh boy, do I wonder why.
You know what red army was famous for?

Blobing should be a viable strat, the main problem is the counters to blobing aren't effective. I would like to see a modifier to hmgs to increase suppression effects the more squads are caught by the hmg, this way hmgs would effectively be able to counter things like gren with mg42 blobs and infantry sections with bolster squad and double vickers blobs.

Something like this actually does exist in coh2.
The more models are around, the higher suppression will be.
Its called incremental suppression.

But tinkering with suppression proved extremely dangerous in the past.
Make it too low, HMG will be useless.
Make it too high, HMG spam meta.
Adjust incremental one, single squads aren't suppressed.
Adjust it other way, everything is instantly pinned.

Whatever can be done to HMG, its a loss for balance team.

But tinkering with suppression proved extremely dangerous in the past.
Make it too low, HMG will be useless.
Make it too high, HMG spam meta.
Adjust incremental one, single squads aren't suppressed.
Adjust it other way, everything is instantly pinned.

Whatever can be done to HMG, its a loss for balance team.

dont like my idea ?

Giving normal infantry squads suppression passively is a no-no go. There was a patch on which Grenadiers had it and it was stupid (i think it was during Pio march spam).
What you could use/adjust is the "in combat" status and "suppression recovery". You could extend the first one, and reduce the second one.

To incentivize barrage over AA fire is always good in my book.

that's why i said it should not be enough even when blobbed but if 6 squad are fring on 1 squad they shold die before they get suppressed

It's not that regular infantry needs suppression. It's that machine guns need ACTUAL suppression for their ENTIRE cone INSTANTLY, the way they do in Dawn of War II.

As long as you can send three squads directly into an MG's cone of fire and only have one get suppressed while the machine gunner fidgets and the player has to manually right-click all three, machine gun teams will remain a liability.

As for combined arms in general, it's perfectly viable for Allies because of their powerful per-squad infantry. Ostheer squads have no survivability and thus get chased away even when employing combined arms, while OKW have no damage output and thus get outlasted.

This all stems from the idiotic math employed in regards to unit costs, even though that shouldn't be at all how it's done because at any given moment, in any given engagement, any one unit only deals damage to a single enemy unit, so on a granular level any faction that has more powerful forces on a per-squad basis is going to be more powerful regardless of manpower or any other costs.

If all infantry was insta-suppressed upon entering any part of the firing cone, I'd uninstall this game or only agree to custom games where HMGs/bunkers are banned.

I want incremental accuracy thats only active in green cover. Any unit in a fortified position should be more effevtive vs hordes of enemies charging at them. Obviously 3 con squads charging at a gren should win, but the gren should be able to nail a few models on their way in.
Green cover IMO is underpowered when compared to lots of infantry and attack move....

I want incremental accuracy thats only active in green cover. Any unit in a fortified position should be more effevtive vs hordes of enemies charging at them. Obviously 3 con squads charging at a gren should win, but the gren should be able to nail a few models on their way in.
Green cover IMO is underpowered when compared to lots of infantry and attack move....

People who use cover almost always win vs people who do not. Accuracy in cover would benefit long range squads the most.