What is the weakness from Jackson?

Who needs that when you have maphack truck?

The Truck does not give vision to fire only mini map information.
Actually allies have a variety of option for both mini map and LOS on target information. The list is quite big.

Your comment, is also irrelevant to the fact that specific user based his reply on inaccurate stats.

M36 weakness
First 6.0-6.6 sec Cooldown plus wind up wind down time
second Target size 24 This mean High chance to hit by other tank gun
(Japd 4 17 Su-85 18 Firefly 23)
Third Cost Mp 400 FU 140 Second highest cost lower than Firefly (440/155)

any problem ?

The Jackson's weakness is the same as the Firefly's - infantry. If a US player brings out a Jackson that's a Sherman they didn't build and therefore an increase to infantry-killing power they didn't get. There's very little a Jackson can do against a sidegraded Panzergrenadier squad or an anti-tank gun except retreat.

OKW has a harder time because their non-doctrinal infantry anti-tank options are single panzershreck Sturmpioneers and the raketenwerfer. I'd say the solution to this problem if there is one is to review OKW's infantry anti-tank options rather than the Jackson.

The Jackson's weakness is the same as the Firefly's - infantry.

Not really - the Jackson can run from infantry at will since its acceleration is 3, same as the infantry's. The Firefly can't, it is slow to accelerate to speed (1.6) which means it cannot disengage so easily and can be caught for a fatal Shreck volley.

If a US player brings out a Jackson that's a Sherman they didn't build and therefore an increase to infantry-killing power they didn't get. There's very little a Jackson can do against a sidegraded Panzergrenadier squad or an anti-tank gun except retreat.

The problem with that is that the USF does not really need that Sherman. It already has large Riflemen blobs by that stage of the game which can pretty much crush OST's infantry on their own without any help required from a Sherman.

It's a fundamental design issue with the USF faction. Its one-dimensional - USF is an infantry spammer early in the game, which costs a lot of manpower, but no fuel. Once there is enough fuel, it just needs to spam TDs to protect its infantry while it is steamrolling Axis infantry from any Axis tanks; the same infantry also takes care of any ATGs or Shrecked Pgrens very quickly that could threaten the Jackson. Actually the only

In contrast OST absolutely MUST build something for fuel early in the game because their infantry sucks and their weapon teams are too inflexible; this just delays their tanks and giving USF infantry even more time to operate unmolested; though luck for OST that their early light vehicles are also pretty poor and absolutely incapable of forcing the USF to react to them, i.e. divert in any way from building RM and then Jackson.

M36 weakness
First 6.0-6.6 sec Cooldown plus wind up wind down time
second Target size 24 This mean High chance to hit by other tank gun
(Japd 4 17 Su-85 18 Firefly 23)
Third Cost Mp 400 FU 140 Second highest cost lower than Firefly (440/155)

any problem ?

hey i know they got nerfed but that's no reason to forget elefant and jagdtiger

Not really - the Jackson can run from infantry at will since its acceleration is 3, same as the infantry's.

I'm fairly sure most tanks can run away from infantry if they want to. But if the tank is avoiding the infantry the infantry dictates where the tank can't go.

The problem with that is that the USF does not really need that Sherman. It already has large Riflemen blobs by that stage of the game which can pretty much crush OST's infantry on their own without any help required from a Sherman.

Fair. I'm not a fan of the weapon racks, especially as the UI itself doesn't support the double equipping.

Jackson literally has no Anti-inf functions. Sneak a cloaked reketen or just use a pak40 stun round with snare.

Jackson is expensive AT counter for USF with the price increase as well as sharing a slow reload rate.

I've said this before but building a tank destroyer puts you on the backfoot because you aren't bleeding your opponent wheras the one who built a damage tank is. So I mean that's an advantage already.

Still I find the Jackson to be a great tank destroyer now adays that actually does it's damn job. Seems to me the problem is the Panther doesn't seem to have a job now (Not that it ever did). Any other tank is infinitely more useful against jacksons. I thought they nerfed Jacksons moving/shooting accuracy now a long with that price increase (Which is pretty noticeable)?

as far as weaknesses of the new Jackson(Compared to other TD's)
1. High Cost(Especially since USF has things to spend fuel on)
2. High reload times, can't reliably deal with medium tanks and has a hard time fighting other TD's.
3. Paper armor

Thing is it actually has positives now.

Jackson has 35 vision range >>>>> do you read the vet infos? what do you see there?
need spotter to use its 60 range >>>> false...it can spot for its own to 55 i thinkwith vet 3
Jackson has no armor. Has slow turrent rotation, flankable. >>> false/ right it is really bouncy for its low armor... p4 bounced 3 days ago two times...really strange.
Less HP...wuut? do you know it has 640 hp???
Jackson has low rate of fire.>>>>>>WUUUUT???? PATCH: Reload from 5.2/5.8 to 4.375/4.975
Any rush to it with P4 kills Jackson. >>>>>>> your p4 will die

dude you're so axis biased i don't think you notice it yourself. every post is AXIS UP and allies OP. you're so annoying forreal. to make it worse you're around 4000placed on rankings, and you talk about balance?
pls stop posting things like this.

so back to topic.
rushing a p4 into a jackson will normally win you the fight.(okw p4)
the reason a p4 could bounce agianst any tank (in this case the jackson) is cause the penetration was or is set to low.

OP must have gotten to be top 100 USF player with Jackson-spam post patch and felt guilty about the abuse so made this thread. Oh well, secret's out I guess...

I'm still amused anyone besides TheMachine is sad about the Jackson stopping being a Meme, it really needed the changes it got.
It's a Tank Destroyed and the premium USF AT unit, it sits where it should be, actually doing it's job.

I thought they nerfed Jacksons moving/shooting accuracy now a long with that price increase (Which is pretty noticeable)?

No only damage, but buffed penetration.(40/15!)

...
as far as weaknesses of the new Jackson(Compared to other TD's)
1. High Cost(Especially since USF has things to spend fuel on)
2. High reload times, can't reliably deal with medium tanks and has a hard time fighting other TD's.
3. Paper armor

Thing is it actually has positives now.

1) Costs:
OKW Panther 490/185
Wer Panther 490/175
FF 440/155
M36 400/140
JP 400/135 (which is more like medium TD, due to low penetration)
Su-85 350/130

For a heavy TD (as a counter to heavy vehicles) is about medium price.

2) Reload
The reload time is 4.375/4.975 which is pretty high and it faster than its more expensive brothers.

3) The armor difference between Jackson, FF, Su-85 is not really that much and hardly makes a difference, so I would it about average. Only Panthers and JPs have significantly more armor.

Kinda hard to believe that a p4 would beat a Jackson in a 1 on 1 fight. Are we assuming that the Jackson is just going to stand still and not move?

Yeah, honestly the changes were a buff and a nerf.

Jackson went from 480 to 640 hp which is honestly needed because this is USF main way to deal w/ Tigers, Kings, Jagtigers, Panthers... at 480 hp it was just hilariously underpowered.

The more curious change was the damage and pen, while it lost 40 damage, to drop to 160 (from 200) it gained penetration to be able to fight heavies more reliably.

So what has this caused? Well dueling mediums is dicey as fuck, as the jacksons increased penetration doesn't matter vs mediums, it never had a problem penetrating them. But losing 40 damage is a big deal, as it used to put some serious hurt on STUG's and other mediums..

Just think about all the times those pesky germans tanks slipped away?! That was the 40 damage you no longer have.

Thx bro, nice explanation as well. I'didnt know any of this

Jackson literally has no Anti-inf functions. Sneak a cloaked reketen or just use a pak40 stun round with snare.

Jackson is expensive AT counter for USF with the price increase as well as sharing a slow reload rate.

I always screen it with a infantry shield, preferably a blob. Rakettens won't come near it.

1) Press Start COH2 button.
2) Press custom game with cheat mod
3) chose jackson and p4 rush to Jackson
4) Make some 4-5 tests in cheat mode
5) return here to discuss

until u post videos where Jackson wins 1 vs 1 vs Jp4, Stug, P4s, Panther . 5 time in a row with Fog of War - there is nothing to discuss.

I always screen it with a infantry shield, preferably a blob. Rakettens won't come near it.

Not sure if you are making a premises for your argument or just giving me how you go about it. Even still, If this is an issue of being able to screen the Jackson it received a range nerf to compensate for its increased health this patch and should get out ranged by units like the jagpznr (if you spot for it) or the reketen at vet2. Pak 40 should have no problem just have to see it and if thats the issue utilize the Pio increased Line of sight.

The more curious change was the damage and pen, while it lost 40 damage, to drop to 160 (from 200) it gained penetration to be able to fight heavies more reliably.

The original intention was that the Jackson get the health buff and retain the damage.

The result was incredibly powerful. Like, they could defeat panthers. You could drive 2 jacksons directly at a position covered by an elefant and a panther and win with overwhelming consistency. Only if the jacksons got hung up on each other and started pivoting would they be in danger.

So what has this caused? Well dueling mediums is dicey as fuck, as the jacksons increased penetration doesn't matter vs mediums, it never had a problem penetrating them. But losing 40 damage is a big deal, as it used to put some serious hurt on STUG's and other mediums..

They wanted jacksons (and all standard mediums) two survive 2 shots from elefants or JTs. Consequences of that change werent really explored, much less tested, and alternatives (Like 560 health to match the m10, retaining 200 damage) were unacceptable unless they accomplished that goal.

Just think about all the times those pesky germans tanks slipped away?! That was the 40 damage you no longer have.

Just like heavy tank destroyers deal with now too.

Mind you Jacksons still have HEAT rounds for extra damage when they need it.

No only damage, but buffed penetration.(40/15!)


1) Costs:
OKW Panther 490/185
Wer Panther 490/175
FF 440/155
M36 400/140
JP 400/135 (which is more like medium TD, due to low penetration)
Su-85 350/130

For a heavy TD (as a counter to heavy vehicles) is about medium price.

2) Reload
The reload time is 4.375/4.975 which is pretty high and it faster than its more expensive brothers.

3) The armor difference between Jackson, FF, Su-85 is not really that much and hardly makes a difference, so I would it about average. Only Panthers and JPs have significantly more armor.

You do make a good point about lower armor considering that AT guns do far surpass all TD armor anyways. Do fausts ever have a chance to plink based on armor?

With costs, I think it's important to factor the factions design as well. USF can't go any heavier then a jackson, so that's the position they find themselves in. Yet they have to fight Tigers, Panthers, King Tigers, ect. I can agree that means the Panther needs to be looked at and the P4 could use some minor tweaks. Problem is USF and other factions need those TD's to be that strong or else they literally couldn't win against those bigger tanks once they hit the field.

What I think is hidden "power creep" is mixing a jackson with a scott. See at that point the USF ended up covering both Anti Infantry and Anti-tank roles with vehicles at a really affordable price.

2) Reload
The reload time is 4.375/4.975 which is pretty high and it faster than its more expensive brothers.

Mind you that the Panther and Jackson also have wind up/down which reduces the RoF and IIRC all tanks have the same ready/aim times (0.125). The sum goes on average:

FF: 8.25s
OKW PV: 7.5s (wind)
OH PV: 6.65 (wind)
Jackson: 6.55 (wind)
Su85: 5.65
JPIV: 5
Su76: 4.275 (wind)
Stug: 4.25

For completion sake someone could if they want add M10, AP Jackson, Ele, JT, etc.

I post this before people go OMG reload time so good. It's basically same RoF as OH PV now.