Unofficial Revamp mod (EFA & WFA & Brits)

And what? It cannot kite but it can 2 shot a sherman. It has much more range than a M36. M36 and elefant have their own specificities but the same logic you apply to the M36 applies to those big cats.

It cant 2 shot a sherman anymore. They nerfed it.

And I have to agree with Viper. The Jackson shuts Ost T3 down completely. I just tested it ingame and you can wait almost 10 min before you see one miss. The P4 already has a hard time but now USF just needs to build one Jackson and it gets shut down completely. The Vet 2 +30% Accuracy buff just makes things worse. And I think that's the first problem you should tackle. Replacing it with a mobility buff to reinforce the mobile nature of the Jackson would help a lot.

And what? It cannot kite but it can 2 shot a sherman. It has much more range than a M36. M36 and elefant have their own specificities but the same logic you apply to the M36 applies to those big cats.

And 100% chance to snipe outside the enemy range is not the same with 57,4%...but if in your opinion the Elephant in the MOD is OP feel free to argue about.

This is has more do with long range TD being to accurate than allied or Axis issues. Imo JT is also far too accurate and I would even not mind if Elephant's accuracy was slightly lowered.

The effectiveness of allied to TDs to hit PZIV at max ranges make PZIV units not worth investing.

Further more the accuracy vet bonuses that allied TD get offers very little since they can already hit most axis vehicles reliably.

To sum up:

1) The M36 DOES NOT need the accuracy buff it gets in this mode
2) Accuracy buff for allied TDs offer very to them especially to units like the Firefly that has ridiculous high accuracy to begging with.
3) High accuracy of heavy TD vs medium tanks at max ranges is actually bad design.

And I have to agree with Viper. The Jackson shuts Ost T3 down completely

That is already the case in the live automatch.


This fantasy mod just made it more fantastic.

Maybe Kubel isn't the best choice for an early unit. However, I would disagree on the scaling part.

Kubel Vet4 is pretty sweet. It gets suppression that you can use in conjunction with camouflage for nice ambushes. You get to Vet4 a lot faster. At Vet2, the Kubel also gets self-repair, which means you no longer have to allocate engineers to repair it.

yeah, who has no seen vet4 kubels in every game since the mod was released......


good luck keeping alive your kubel or your m-20 until late game while vetting it up, and good luck again to use them without getting oneshooted by tanks, mines, atguns, etc....


Could be great if mod team provide us some replays so we can learn how to get in a so easy way vet4 kubels and get a good use of them in the late game (same for m-20, that as you said in other post, scales really well to late game and is really usefull in that phase of the game).

yeah, who has no seen vet4 kubels in every game since the mod was released......


good luck keeping alive your kubel or your m-20 until late game while vetting it up, and good luck again to use them without getting oneshooted by tanks, mines, atguns, etc....


Could be great if mod team provide us some replays so we can learn how to get in a so easy way vet4 kubels and get a good use of them in the late game (same for m-20, that as you said in other post, scales really well to late game and is really usefull in that phase of the game).

I actually played a few 2v2s against Miragefla and he managed to get a kubel to vet 5 then 4 respectively. It's not that difficult given it shares veterancy now and can function well as a scout with its large LoS and camo ability.

It cant 2 shot a sherman anymore. They nerfed it.

And I have to agree with Viper. The Jackson shuts Ost T3 down completely. I just tested it ingame and you can wait almost 10 min before you see one miss. The P4 already has a hard time but now USF just needs to build one Jackson and it gets shut down completely. The Vet 2 +30% Accuracy buff just makes things worse. And I think that's the first problem you should tackle. Replacing it with a mobility buff to reinforce the mobile nature of the Jackson would help a lot.

Honestly trading accuracy for a mobility buff could be unwise. Too large of a boost then in a hands of good player it would be nigh impossible to chase down. Too little of a change then what's the point of it? Granted almost all Axis medium and above tanks have blitz but if the Jackson did receive a mobility buff then it's HP should be toned down to 560. I wouldn't be opposed to a such idea given USF is meant to be THE mobile faction but testing should be done.

Will this patch be addressing the enbalance between OST,OKW and SOV vs USF and UKF?

As of now if a UKF or brit player gets one of their tier structures destroyed the can get it back by repairing and won't have to spend any resources at all on getting it back.
However when and OKW,OST or SOV player gets their building destoryed the have to pay resources to get it back. This imbalance strongly discurage base rushes or trying to assault the enemy where they are weak and don't expect (aka. avoiding sim cities (okw and ukf))

If this is changed, where to a USF or UKF has to pay resources rather than repairing to getting the tier structure back. This being acompanied by lowering the health on tier structure on all faction, will encourage more base rushes. Also giving people alternative to fighting a war of attrion. Also letting a good player with weak a commander, still being able to defeat a less good player with P2W commanders (calliope, advanced emplacement etc.)
Also, making base rushes more relevant, increases the relevance of tank traps for blocking unguarded entrences to a base that aren't frequently used by allied tanks.

This may not be the most important change the game needs right now, in the next patch. It can be used as a template for future revamping of base mechanics and letting annihilation be a viable way to win a game.

And 100% chance to snipe outside the enemy range is not the same with 57,4%...but if in your opinion the Elephant in the MOD is OP feel free to argue about.

This is has more do with long range TD being to accurate than allied or Axis issues. Imo JT is also far too accurate and I would even not mind if Elephant's accuracy was slightly lowered.

The effectiveness of allied to TDs to hit PZIV at max ranges make PZIV units not worth investing.

Further more the accuracy vet bonuses that allied TD get offers very little since they can already hit most axis vehicles reliably.

To sum up:

1) The M36 DOES NOT need the accuracy buff it gets in this mode
2) Accuracy buff for allied TDs offer very to them especially to units like the Firefly that has ridiculous high accuracy to begging with.
3) High accuracy of heavy TD vs medium tanks at max ranges is actually bad design.

Wouldn't making TDs of all types less accurate at max range make them rng monsters though? Like, if there was a 50% chance to hit a jackson at max range with JT then either you could miss like 2-3 shots in a row, which is devastating, or hit both the first two shots, which would probably be equally as frustrating for the Jackson's commander because it was only a 50-50 chance to hit one shot, meaning that there's only a 25% chance of 2 shots connecting. Totally hypothetical situation, but it highlights the problem with decreasing TDs' accuracy, even though I'm on board with what you want the end result to be.

That is already the case in the live automatch.


This fantasy mod just made it more fantastic.

Lol stug spam? Paks?

Wouldn't making TDs of all types less accurate at max range make them rng monsters though? Like, if there was a 50% chance to hit a jackson at max range with JT then either you could miss like 2-3 shots in a row, which is devastating, or hit both the first two shots, which would probably be equally as frustrating for the Jackson's commander because it was only a 50-50 chance to hit one shot, meaning that there's only a 25% chance of 2 shots connecting. Totally hypothetical situation, but it highlights the problem with decreasing TDs' accuracy, even though I'm on board with what you want the end result to be.

Lol stug spam? Paks?

Stug spam isn't really that reliable since it fails vs USF infantry spam. I once made 3 ostwinds and it was more effective vs USF infantry spam than stug spam was.

Wouldn't making TDs of all types less accurate at max range make them rng monsters though? Like, if there was a 50% chance to hit a jackson at max range with JT then either you could miss like 2-3 shots in a row, which is devastating, or hit both the first two shots, which would probably be equally as frustrating for the Jackson's commander because it was only a 50-50 chance to hit one shot, meaning that there's only a 25% chance of 2 shots connecting. Totally hypothetical situation, but it highlights the problem with decreasing TDs' accuracy, even though I'm on board with what you want the end result to be.

First of all we have to clarify that missing the accuracy check does not mean that the shot would miss the target. TDs gun have allot a scatter distance but little angle scatter which translates
to a high chance of collision with the targets that are moving in the same line with the gun.

That would actually improve the game since the TDs would be more effective against target that are trying to attack them frontally and less effective against targets that try to flank them.

As I have pointed out the Elephant has 57.4% chance to hits score a "natural hit" vs a Sherman yet some people complain it OP. I see little reason why JT should be more accurate than than the Elephant or why all the other TD with 55+ range should be so much more accurate than the Elephant.

I actually played a few 2v2s against Miragefla and he managed to get a kubel to vet 5 then 4 respectively. It's not that difficult given it shares veterancy now and can function well as a scout with its large LoS and camo ability.

Would love to see those replays. Do you have them? could you upload to this site? really interesting in those vet4-vet5 kubels.....

Anybody else feel that after this patch, the OKW seem to be incredibly vulnerable to 120mm Mortars since the ISG got nerfed? Granted, the match I was playing was in Gilroy's Harbour but nonetheless...

Would love to see those replays. Do you have them? could you upload to this site? really interesting in those vet4-vet5 kubels.....

yea i watched it, miragefla was streaming, it did pretty good tbh. and flamehetzer is way to strong imo when i seen it 1 burst a atgun.

Rear Echelon
We are normalising Rear Echelon performance, to make them somewhat viable as a unit, while normalising their utility with respect to other engineers.

- Cost from 200 to 180
- Reinforce from 25 to 23
- Repair Rate from 2 to 1.6 (to match other engineer squads)
- Vet2 repair rate speed from 1 to 0.5 (since it can vet reliably)
- Volley-Fire received accuracy penalty from 1.4 to 1.15
- Minesweeper now takes up 1 slot item
- Can upgrade (doctrinal) Flamers and Minesweepers at the same time

I don't really see why RE receive these buffs as fighting unit. They might be weak at vet 0 but at vet 1 they get a massive buff with x120% accuracy.

Currently they are better with with lmg than riflemen are.

Actually they should received the same penalties Ostturppen and conscripts have received in the weapon they pick up.

I also do not see why they should be able to equip both weapons and minesweepers. Imo minesweepers should take all weapon slot for R.E. and Royal Eng. so that one can use easier mines against these blobs.

Flak Emplacement
- Weapon is now a copy-paste of FlakHT
- Projectile no longer collides with terrain
- Popcap from 4 to 2
- Hitpoints from 470 to 520
- Crew have a received accuracy modifier of 0.1

To quote the bible here:

And God saw everything that he had made, and behold, it was very good. And there was evening and there was morning, the sixth day.

I don't really see why RE receive these buffs as fighting unit. They might be weak at vet 0 but at vet 1 they get a massive buff with x120% accuracy.

Currently they are better with with lmg than riflemen are.

Actually they should received the same penalties Ostturppen and conscripts have received in the weapon they pick up.

I also do not see why they should be able to equip both weapons and minesweepers. Imo minesweepers should take all weapon slot for R.E. and Royal Eng. so that one can use easier mines against these blobs.

20% is fine early game, but you have to consider RE only deal damage through their gun upgrades. They also have worse survivability than Rifles and lack grenades along with snare. Rifles also have 30% weapon accuracy when they get to level 3 on top of another hit of RA.

They only can get 1 weapon and a sweeper now from the 2 weapons with a sweeper. Unlike the other engineers, RE generally don't do as much building or support due to vehicle crews so they'll be fighting more.

Do note RE were never worth 200 and Volley-Fire only had one use and that was against Ostheer pioneers who decided to close the gap at max range rather than backing away when the ability activates.

Besides, I think people would prefer not having to go Rifle, Rifle, Rifle every game to hold ground outside of certain strategies which intentionally avoid fighting until an officer arrives.

20% is fine early game, but you have to consider RE only deal damage through their gun upgrades. They also have worse survivability than Rifles and lack grenades along with snare. Rifles also have 30% weapon accuracy when they get to level 3 on top of another hit of RA.

They only can get 1 weapon and a sweeper now from the 2 weapons with a sweeper. Unlike the other engineers, RE generally don't do as much building or support due to vehicle crews so they'll be fighting more.

Do note RE were never worth 200 and Volley-Fire only had one use and that was against Ostheer pioneers who decided to close the gap at max range rather than backing away when the ability activates.

Besides, I think people would prefer not having to go Rifle, Rifle, Rifle every game to hold ground outside of certain strategies which intentionally avoid fighting until an officer arrives.

If the base line is EFA, R.E. are far more cost efficient than Pios (cost 200) and CE (cost 170).

In addition currently a bar or LMG is better in the hands of RE since they get 20% accuracy from vet 1 something already fixed in Conscripts and Ostruppen with accuracy penalties (even thou these units have limited access to weapons).

If you do not want to use the same penalties at least replace x120% accuracy bonus with "volley fire" as a vet 1 ability.

Making a unit OP to diversify built have proven disastrous (like the Penal buff), each units should have a role, bring utility to table and not simply be OP. So instead of turning them into riflemen baby brother give the a role or move some of doctrinal abilities to them instead of riflemen (field defenses, Forward observes, smoke grenades...)

Cheap Rear echelon where tested and found OP so they had to be changed:

DECEMBER 3 UPDATE
"Rear Echelons
We have scaled up Rear echelons up slightly to reduce spam.

Rear echelons cost up from 160 to 200

Rear echelon rifle damage up from 8 to 10"

If one want to further avoid the riflemen, riflemen, riflemen built one should consider a promote system where USF units can be promoted to officers and elite units.

Current RE have 200MP cost and 25MP reinforcement, while being inferior to pioneers in both combat and utility.

Original RE squads had 160MP cost, 20MP reinforcement, while their 5th men came at Vet2.

Mod version REs are somewhere in the middle between the two extremes.

+ You cannot blitz to Vet3 with bazooka vet anymore

Current RE have 200MP cost and 25MP reinforcement, while being inferior to pioneers in both combat and utility.

Original RE squads had 160MP cost, 20MP reinforcement, while their 5th men came at Vet2.

Mod version REs are somewhere in the middle between the two extremes.

+ You cannot blitz to Vet3 with bazooka vet anymore

If RE at 160 where problematic there will be even more problematic since they now cost 180 but have +25% damage and better volley fire.

I actually find RE better both in combat and in utility.

If RE at 160 where problematic there will be even more problematic since they now cost 180 but have +25% damage and better volley fire.

I actually find RE better both in combat and in utility.

+25% damage means little considering RE have horrible accuracy, even with veterancy unless the target is in front of you. Furthermore, Volley-Fire requires munitions and you need to be still you properly use it, along with the fact you're taking more fire and suppression only kicks in after 5-7 seconds.