The American BAR

Make it less effective as it is now while on the move, meanwhile more effective as it is now while stationary.

Riflemen accuracy on the move with BARs are imo, too effective while on the move, especially when bunched up with 2-3 squads together. This promotes bloobing and adds effectiveness to it at that. My change I propose is a simple, yet effective. A squad while still is more vulnerable then a squad moving.

BAR blobbs > 1919s blobbs 9/10 times. Despite commander choice.

BAR blobbs > 1919s blobbs 9/10 times. Despite commander choice.

That's questionable. More so in team games, but you shouldn't underestimate 1919s on vet3 rifles in the lategame. It's like what Obers were supposed to be.

Make it less effective as it is now while on the move, meanwhile more effective as it is now while stationary.

More effective while standing still? That thing already outdamages or competes with most SMGs at close range while performing almost on the same level as the best LMGs at long range. How exactly do you want to buff it even further while standing still without making all other weapons obsolete?!

Also, the much bigger problem are double-BAR Riflemen. They outperform any LMG squad and can compete with most close-range squads.

P.S.:

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Are we at that level again? How about we judge a sentence by the worth of its words, not the person saying it? Oh wait, that would require using actual arguments instead of behaving like a child.

2-3 squad together but what if they manage to get cover for each squad correctly does it still count as blober

because me my self also did confused why im treat other mainline inf way different from riflemen

Since the introduction of the USF mortar riflemen simply need to be toned down.

Since the introduction of the USF mortar riflemen simply need to be toned down.

If it was up to me, I would relocate up ALL t0 support weapon

2-3 squad together but what if they manage to get cover for each squad correctly does it still count as blober

because me my self also did confused why im treat other mainline inf way different from riflemen

They are very different because USF does not have any alternative infantry other than very few doctrines, but riflemen are very adaptable. Soviets have guards and shocks. Ost has Pgrens, and the rare Stormtroopers. OKW has Sturmpios, Jaegers, Obers, Falls, and even the Kubal. USF has Airborne which costs too much manpower and arrives a bit too late. Not usable inf such as Recon support IR pathfinders and paras. And finally Assault Engineers where they die too quickly to be any use.


I would like to remind all that double-bar riflemen are actually weaker than panzergrenadiers. The Vet 3 RA is tone down in the WBP so they are, in my opinion, are largely fine. USF has other larger problems that could be address.

Double bar riflemen are only weaker then Pg in heavy cover and mid distance. They will beat them easily at far range.

In addition they probably have more vet by the time they run to Pgs.

In addition Pg have a higher cost and cost more.

I'm an axis fanboy btw people. Let that be known.

In a vacume yes I did see that vet 3 PGs beat vet 3 riflemen with LMGs, when was the last time you seen green cover in late game? It's all yellow or red by then. And not to mention most engagements involve indirect fire as well as movement.

There is a reason why USF blobbing is so common. My goal here is to simply change the BAR around to a point where it's effective still, just in a different way.

I think the BAR is perfectly fine. It requires an initial upgrade. Later costs munitions to equip and it can be dropped. The problem might be the huge recieved acc bonuses on the riflemen rather then this weapon itself.

I'm an axis fanboy btw people. Let that be known.

In a vacume yes I did see that vet 3 PGs beat vet 3 riflemen with LMGs, when was the last time you seen green cover in late game? It's all yellow or red by then. And not to mention most engagements involve indirect fire as well as movement.

There is a reason why USF blobbing is so common. My goal here is to simply change the BAR around to a point where it's effective still, just in a different way.

Well another way to stop this blobbing is to make MGs a bit more effective in suppressing. Changing the bar as you stated will make it a bit too similar to the 1919 where you would then just A move everywhere. Blobbing is a legitimate strategy but should have effective legitimate counters.

A different suggestion just popped into my head. Why not make it the Bar Rack into a different weapon? You could make it into a Thompson rack, Grease Gun rack, or a Carbine rack Still making into from a mid range weapon to a close range weapon but weaker and cheaper?

I think the BAR is perfectly fine. It requires an initial upgrade. Later costs munitions to equip and it can be dropped. The problem might be the huge recieved acc bonuses on the riflemen rather then this weapon itself.

Yeah. Feels like it's impossible to wipe no-health vet3 riflemen on retreat with non-aoe arms.

I'm an axis fanboy btw people. Let that be known.

In a vacume yes I did see that vet 3 PGs beat vet 3 riflemen with LMGs, when was the last time you seen green cover in late game? It's all yellow or red by then. And not to mention most engagements involve indirect fire as well as movement.

There is a reason why USF blobbing is so common. My goal here is to simply change the BAR around to a point where it's effective still, just in a different way.

No, your point is to remove USF from the game. In longer games, USF player use rifles and calliopes because almost everything else has been nerfed to shit. Rifles are already getting nerfed in the next POS patch (Winter Unbalancing Patch).

The thing is USF the riflemen simply need to scale into the late game given Jacksons and Shermans are too fragile to fight tanks 1v1.

BARs being double equipped are there to fight elite Axis infantry. I always play USF without mortar as I hate using broken units. A solution to this double BAR madness would be give a single upgrade ala CoH1 style and tweak vet accuracy bonus instead so mid game double BAR riflemen don't roflstomp all infantry. That way Rifles can still scale into late while giving chance for Axis to hold until elites come out.

If you guys still want to nerf vet 3 riflemen then give me non-doctrine Rangers instead for late game.

Also other than Rangers(meta right now) and Paras which comes in a lame doctrine, USF has simply no other choice BUT riflemen. Want to stop Rifle spam, make our doctrinal infantry worthwhile. I have a few suggestions on doing it as well.

This is what I see most games I play (2v2)

The American starts off with some respect of skill, spreads units, uses cover, uses strategy etc. then it seem like at a drop of a dime it becomes the (no nade upgrade) Bars start appearing and the blobbing starts.

Usually starts off unsuccessful, but then the calliope starts. Or the landmattress, or even the USF motor knocking out my MGs

Meanwhile the blobbing starts becoming vet 2/3 the LMGs are more and more.

Understand there are two type of blobbing, senseless blobbing with most if not all the USF units

And then there is the "skilled" blobbing, where there are 4-6 riflemen but split, 3/3 or 2/4. Backed by a motor/calliope.

Which brings me back to the fact that OH does not have a unit that effectively knocks out blobbs or deters them, such as as the oswtind or p4. Riflemen are able to walk up and around these units with the odds of a wipe or a hit being low. The USF player knows that OH tanks are unable to really punish for blobbing let's say as a Cromwell or comet or Sherman could etc.

Now as for the 1919s that have to be at a complete stand still to fire, I'm proposing a slight nerf to bars on the move but a buff to them being still. Someone can work the math out to where the 1919s still out perform in the still category.

Also other than Rangers(meta right now) and Paras which comes in a lame doctrine, USF has simply no other choice BUT riflemen. Want to stop Rifle spam, make our doctrinal infantry worthwhile. I have a few suggestions on doing it as well.

No, make the Jackson great again. It was nerfed because the Axis fanboys didn't think a USF T4 tank destroyer should be able to beat a Ost T3 tank.

The P47 was also nerfed to shit. It's a 240 munition ability that is incomparably worse than the 200 munition ability that Ost get, because apparently Stugs, Pak40's and Panthers just aren't enough for most axis players.

In any case, I'd be surprised to see another patch after this next one. Any patch where the developers are fine with Conscripts not scaling but felt the desperate need to buff assault grenadiers is just not going to turn out well.

This is what I see most games I play (2v2)

Now as for the 1919s that have to be at a complete stand still to fire, I'm proposing a slight nerf to bars on the move but a buff to them being still. Someone can work the math out to where the 1919s still out perform in the still category.

Doesn't the upcoming patch limit 1919s to one per squad? Not sure how that factors in.

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Which brings me back to the fact that OH does not have a unit that effectively knocks out blobbs or deters them, such as as the oswtind or p4. Riflemen are able to walk up and around these units with the odds of a wipe or a hit being low. The USF player knows that OH tanks are unable to really punish for blobbing let's say as a Cromwell or comet or Sherman could etc.
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Horseshit. Watch one of Thanatos or Theodosius's (sp?) replays. See them rack up 30-40 kills with and Ostwind or 50+ with a Panzerwerfer.