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WHY are soviets the center of winter balance patch

18 Dec 2016, 13:37 PM
#21
avatar of Osinyagov
Senior Modmaker Badge

Posts: 1389 | Subs: 1



Go and vote for British rebalance if that's what you want.

Instead of whining here go and vote on the polls that Relic are putting out that are prioritising the games balance :P

If people here aren't voting for the changes they want, then they don't have a right to complain about where the game is going Mr. Kpen.

Get involved :P


According to this vote: https://community.companyofheroes.com/discussion/243135/in-your-opinion-what-is-currently-the-main-balance-concern-in-coh2/p1
People vote for changes to non-viable EFA commanders (2 place). But this thing is "out of scope" in this patch. But other variants (even guards and no counter against LV for wehrmacht) are in the scope.
Vote will help when Relic agree with you, but won't when Relic disagree with you (imho) :lol:
18 Dec 2016, 13:37 PM
#22
avatar of tenid

Posts: 232

How does that model take account of units that are so weak they fall out of use and are forgotten, thus getting no votes on polls? Off hand, there are units like the Valentine and greyhound that you will virtually never see in a game. Some of them could do with even just minor tweaks to start - like lowering popcap slightly to be in line with equivalents.

Are Relic being made aware of these units?
18 Dec 2016, 13:43 PM
#23
avatar of shake4parkinson

Posts: 116

Permanently Banned

If people here aren't voting for the changes they want, then they don't have a right to complain about where the game is going Mr. Kpen.


im not kpen NotLikeThis

and lets be honest here, we all know that miragefla and the others do (NOT) care about nerfing brits as they either play ostheer or USF and thus have no issues with them as a faction, nor do they play 2v2 where brits are an even bigger problem. Hell, even kyle admitted (on your stream iirc) that allies (especially usf and brits) were slightly too strong. this was also supported by the fact that their winrate was quite above the average 1v1 axis winrate.

So what do they do? Give penals AT options so you dont have to go the AT HQ as soviets to get ZiS gun and instead just rely on penals with ptrs to deal with early armor. I mean, back in the day (aka now) you could counter penals with a luchs or 222, now that is gone.. why? does miragefla want to get high rank with soviets too or what? May i remind you that miragefla also was the genius behind USF mortar (and we all know how that turned out to be :D!!)

Want my involvement? Sure, np, here you go:
https://www.coh2.org/ladders/playercard/steamid/76561198000322345

are you seriously letting someone with less than 30 games of brits balance all 5 factions?

But wait, there is more :D!!

https://www.coh2.org/ladders/playercard/steamid/76561197996299790

huh.. 60 games on brits, he must know the faction in and out :D!!


Anyway, my tips for relic:

- decrease maxim crew

- remove usf mortar

- permaban anyone involved in getting usf mortar in the game in the first place

- remove flamethrower for penals, they are good now as they are. give them grenades maybe? idk idc

- make repair option on OKW HQ cheaper OR buff it to make it a more viable option, now it's just ignored as sturmpio's do the same work for less fuel

- dont nerf snipers as hard as they are on balance mod.

- give brit mortar fuel cost or decrease the time and damage reduction from the brace stance. Remove the "get out of jail free" card idea of bracing. If a brit player wants to place a static mortar somewhere let him reap the rewards but also enjoy the downsides of it.

- remove all callin units. Only leave KT but keep it as it is with fuel costs and building requirements. OR leave callins in but also give negative (passive) abilities to these commanders so that players need to make a tradeoff between having a good callin unit + a reduction in X (fuel, manpower, muntiion idk?) or taking a callin-free commander which means that you have to rely on actually outplaying your opponent more than just calling in unit and winning :D!!!

- dont make PIAT homing, it requires micro now and that's how it should be. Don't give those disgusting usf abusers another freelo faction to play. USF players are beatable cause they, in most cases, lack a brain or have low apm. If you give them brits for free like this the winrate will go up even more :')

There you go! i fixed the game.
18 Dec 2016, 13:47 PM
#24
avatar of Tiger Baron

Posts: 3145 | Subs: 2



Youre wrong, cost of upgrade is 35f 150 mp


Hmm, it was 25 before the buff to it's price I think.

Or was it 15? Idk it was something with 5.
18 Dec 2016, 13:47 PM
#25
avatar of Stark

Posts: 626 | Subs: 1



Go and vote for British rebalance if that's what you want.

Instead of whining here go and vote on the polls that Relic are putting out that are prioritising the games balance :P

If people here aren't voting for the changes they want, then they don't have a right to complain about where the game is going Mr. Kpen.

Get involved :P


+++++++++++1

well said
18 Dec 2016, 13:48 PM
#26
avatar of Stark

Posts: 626 | Subs: 1



Hmm, it was 25 before the buff to it's price I think.

Or was it 15? Idk it was something with 5.


Hector is right, and it used to be 25
18 Dec 2016, 14:58 PM
#27
avatar of Stormless
Senior Caster Badge

Posts: 762 | Subs: 4



im not kpen NotLikeThis



Why are you using Kpen's photo lol?
18 Dec 2016, 15:34 PM
#28
avatar of Budwise
Admin Red  Badge
Donator 11

Posts: 2075 | Subs: 2

LOL, Relic basing balance from some community polls. They've garnered a community of comp stompers and 4v4 skirmish players. Good job! Lets listen to them!

Meanwhile, a group of 10-20 top players, modders, and veterans combined could balance this game the best it could get in a month I'd guess.

18 Dec 2016, 15:48 PM
#29
avatar of shake4parkinson

Posts: 116

Permanently Banned
jump backJump back to quoted post18 Dec 2016, 15:34 PMBudwise

Meanwhile, a group of 10-20 top players, modders, and veterans combined could balance this game the best it could get in a month I'd guess.



sorry cant hear you over the sound of PTRS's and usf mortars X~DDDD
18 Dec 2016, 16:19 PM
#30
avatar of Stormless
Senior Caster Badge

Posts: 762 | Subs: 4

jump backJump back to quoted post18 Dec 2016, 15:34 PMBudwise
LOL, Relic basing balance from some community polls. They've garnered a community of comp stompers and 4v4 skirmish players. Good job! Lets listen to them!

Meanwhile, a group of 10-20 top players, modders, and veterans combined could balance this game the best it could get in a month I'd guess.



Whatever your thoughts on the system are it doesn't change that we need to work with what Relic are giving us.

If you guys wanna rebel against the system by not doing that, and then complain about it afterwards that's totally cool, that's what this site is for. For the rest of us, let's get involved and do our best with the system we're given.

18 Dec 2016, 16:24 PM
#31
avatar of TheMachine
Senior Caster Badge

Posts: 875 | Subs: 6

18 Dec 2016, 16:27 PM
#32
avatar of Stormless
Senior Caster Badge

Posts: 762 | Subs: 4



Vote will help when Relic agree with you, but won't when Relic disagree with you (imho) :lol:


Haha. Yeah, it's a complex system over there at HQ.

Need authorisation for everything o.O
18 Dec 2016, 17:30 PM
#33
avatar of TheMachine
Senior Caster Badge

Posts: 875 | Subs: 6

To give a more serious answer:

Obviously we are very limited in scope and can only make changes about the scope that has been directed to us by Relic. Soviets have received the most changes due to being completely over performing in tournaments, watching through the vods of any recent tournament finals will show you that.

On top of that, we have been focusing most of our energy thus far into Soviets because the issue of Tier1 and Penals/Guards is far more delicate than just nerfing Overperforming light vehicles. As a result, it's what the majority of our play testing has gone towards. Better to tackle the difficult stuff first whilst we have plenty more weeks to go. Plenty of weeks for forum posters to actually play and actually send us replays.

But now I think we're happy with where Soviet T1 is, or at least it's as good as we can get it given the scope. So we'll probably be focusing more of our attention to the USF and British changes we have made, but I suspect those will only need minor changes, if anything.
18 Dec 2016, 17:44 PM
#34
avatar of TheSleep3r

Posts: 670

But now I think we're happy with where Soviet T1 is


too bad there are about 3 of people who like this change
18 Dec 2016, 17:51 PM
#35
avatar of TheMachine
Senior Caster Badge

Posts: 875 | Subs: 6



too bad there are about 3 of people who like this change


Don't take the vocal minority of people whining on the forums who haven't played the mod as word that nobody likes the changes. People who are neutral or positive about the changes are less likely to comment, angry/negative people are always more likely to engage with any internet thing. Especially as those people are probably actually playing the mod instead of endlessly theory crafting on the forums.

10 people commenting on a thread isn't representative of the entire community.
18 Dec 2016, 18:16 PM
#36
avatar of TheSleep3r

Posts: 670



Don't take the vocal minority of people whining on the forums who haven't played the mod as word that nobody likes the changes. People who are neutral or positive about the changes are less likely to comment, angry/negative people are always more likely to engage with any internet thing. Especially as those people are probably actually playing the mod instead of endlessly theory crafting on the forums.

10 people commenting on a thread isn't representative of the entire community.


So you're working as you wish, implementing ideas heard never before that everyone (anyone?) that is positive about them is silent, ignoring the <<vocal minority>> completely despite so many solid counterarguments I've read. I've played your balance mod and I hope after the tournament your team will admit the direction of these changes is wrong.
18 Dec 2016, 18:31 PM
#37
avatar of ferwiner
Donator 11

Posts: 2885



Don't take the vocal minority of people whining on the forums who haven't played the mod as word that nobody likes the changes. People who are neutral or positive about the changes are less likely to comment, angry/negative people are always more likely to engage with any internet thing. Especially as those people are probably actually playing the mod instead of endlessly theory crafting on the forums.

10 people commenting on a thread isn't representative of the entire community.


Current community poll result suggests that what you created is a second most liked option. So it's definitely much more popular than TheSleep3r thinks. There is another option that is first though. In fact, I have monitored the poll closely the whole time and that option was first the entire time. Could we see that option tested in 1.4? It's definitely worth trying. And much less controversial.
18 Dec 2016, 19:07 PM
#38
avatar of skemshead

Posts: 611



Current community poll result suggests that what you created is a second most liked option. So it's definitely much more popular than TheSleep3r thinks. There is another option that is first though. In fact, I have monitored the poll closely the whole time and that option was first the entire time. Could we see that option tested in 1.4? It's definitely worth trying. And much less controversial.


The level of contribution in that poll is terrible. Really cannot tell anything by it due to the low numbers. I would have thought more members visited this site in last 24 hours.

As to the notion that those that support the changes do so in silent anonymity, well there may be an element of truth in that but its harly a resounding endorsememt.

Personally i wish many more played the mod and joined the discussion.
18 Dec 2016, 21:53 PM
#39
avatar of FalseAlarm

Posts: 182

Permanently Banned
But now I think we're happy with where Soviet T1 is, or at least it's as good as we can get it given the scope. So we'll probably be focusing more of our attention to the USF and British changes we have made, but I suspect those will only need minor changes, if anything.
Yes, with T1 being the strongest and most versatile structure in game, time to buff USF and UKF as well :megusta:
18 Dec 2016, 23:29 PM
#40
avatar of Mistah_S

Posts: 851 | Subs: 1


- remove all callin units. Only leave KT but keep it as it is with fuel costs and building requirements. OR leave callins in but also give negative (passive) abilities to these commanders so that players need to make a tradeoff between having a good callin unit + a reduction in X (fuel, manpower, muntiion idk?) or taking a callin-free commander which means that you have to rely on actually outplaying your opponent more than just calling in unit and winning :D!!!

Dude, no... The Fuseliers are a call in for a reason.
Also, how will this affect commandos and other infiltration units?


If you guys wanna rebel against the system by not doing that, and then complain about it afterwards that's totally cool, that's what this site is for. For the rest of us, let's get involved and do our best with the system we're given.

+1 I hear yer!


too bad there are about 3 of people who like this change

Lol, I too am wondering why they chose sov first
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