Commander/Doctrine Suggestions for Change and Hope

We all know that there are more than enough commanders that are pretty much useless, too situational, complained to uselessness, ect. But enough about the past (mostly). We need to fix this mess, or at the very least give some much needed light.

All but of the ideas given are specifically targeted to buffing, merging, adding, and improving unused commanders abilities and units.

And Oh Boy! more Text Walls incoming!

Most of these changes were implemented in a mod by Svanh Here

SOVIETS

Tank Traps, PMD6 Anti Personnel Mines, and PMD6M Anti Light Tank Mines
Affects: Tank Hunter Tactics and Defensive Tactics

• Merged together into one ability: Field Defenses
  2CP: Field Defenses
  (Allows Conscripts and Combat Engineers to build cheap and quick to place anti-personnel and vehicle disabling mines, Combat Engineers can also build tank traps.)
  

(Why can OKW can build tank traps, flak emplacements, and Trenches in one ability, while the Soviets have to waste 2 separate slots for mines and traps? It merging time)

Hold the Line! (From Unused Not Step Back Tactics)
Affects: Defensive Tactics

• Added to Defensive Tactics
  

(Can be balanced anyway you want, but it's a great defensive-esque ability for a supposed defensive commander)

Commissar (From Unused Not Step Back Tactics), Hit the Dirt!
Affects: Conscript Support Tactics, Guard Rifle Combined Arms Tactics

You know what, I'm already tired from typing, here, have a graphic:


(Commissars can be balanced anyway you want, I'd personally prefer if it gets vet. but it provides an indirect buff to conscripts and guards, and a much better use of a commander ability slot. If wanted, Conscripts could get 2 vet abilities in vet 1 by putting the flare mines in that same build menu with the sandbags. providing even more versatility.)

M42 AT (Aggressive Tickling) Gun
Affects: Defensive Tactics, Urban Defense

• New Ability: Canister Shot (Same as Greyhound)
  
• Stats Rebalanced to be more like a T70 as an AT gun, maybe with abit more pen. but a damage nerf to 65 from 80 against infantry (also a damage bonus of 15 vs. vehicles)
  

(No matter how you put it, the ZIS completely out classes the M42 in nearly every way except firing rate. So my idea (combined and influenced by others) is to make it more AI than AT, still deterring light vehicles and some mediums, while being useful against infantry. the Damage nerf is to prevent one shotting of infantry)

Forward Headquarters
Affects: Urban Defense Tactics

• Fuel Cost reduced to 45, Manpower Cost increased to 350
  

(After the Soviet Tech changes, Urban Defense became obsolete, as the 60 fuel cost means the FHQ rush would come in too late. the price changes pushes the FHQ rush earlier, while still giving the enemy time to prepare, and the increased manpower cost makes it slightly harder to pull off the FHQ rush without proper support.)

Vehicle Detection
Affects: Alot of Commanders

• Munition cost reduced by half.
  

(I can't think of anything else, I'm sorry)

WEHRMACHT

Defensive Fortifications and Trenches
Affects: (Pr)Osttruppen Doctrine, Defensive Doctrine

• Merged together into one ability: Defensive Fortifications
  2CP: Defensive Fortifications
  (Infantry can now build trenches, Pioneers can also build tanks traps.)
  

(Once again, 2 different abilities to build 2 basic things? merge!)

Forward Supply Station (From Unused Urban Assault Doctrine)
Affects: Defensive Doctrine

• Added to Defensive Doctrine
  

(Makes the Defensive Doctrine more defensive, and don't worry about FSS rushing, unlike the FHQ, it provides pioneers and a forward retreat point instead of medics and offensive buffs. Even then, it can be balanced to your own desires.)

Mechanized Groups (LMG grens and Pgrens)
Affects: Mechanized Assault Doctrine, Mechanized Doctrine

• Infantry inside the half-track now start with vet 1
  

(b-b-b-b-b-b-b-bb-bbb-b-b-bb-b--but Grittle! Yu cat guve fre vet leik that!!!!! Well, considering it comes at 3CP AND it costs quite abit of fuel (30-40 last time I checked) , I think these units should come pre-vetted at vet 1 at the very least. Same should apply to the Combat Engies in the USF Mechanized Company too.)

USF

WC51 w/ .50 cal.
Affects: Mechanized Company

• Renamed to WC51 w/ .30 Cal.
  
• Add 20 Munitions upgrade for a .50 Cal MG, renaming it back to original name and increased attack power and penetration
  
• Increase Health from 180 to 200
  
• WC51 Crew bail out during combat reduced from 3 seconds to 1 seconds
  
• WC51 Crew comes with a free BAR and slightly more durability than a normal vehicle crew (Could be renamed to Assault Crew)
  

(Gives WC51 more scaling, and provides more incentives to push in more aggressively. AND gives it a reason to why it costs 20 fuel!)


M3 Assault Group
Affects: Mechanized Company

• Infantry inside the half-track now start with vet 1
  

(See Mechanized Group Changes in the Wehrmacht section for more info)

Assault Engineers
Affects: Mechanized Company, Armor Company

• Vet 2 now provides an extra man
  

(Not my original idea, but has been suggested and said many times. Assault Engies are too squishy late game, the vet bonus solves that.)

Elite Vehicle Crews
Affects: Armor Company

• Now makes all vehicle crews the ability to get to Vet 5
  
• Vet 4 Bonus: Faster Repair, more durability out in the field.
  
• Vet 5 Bonus: Vehicle Bailout during combat reduced to 2 seconds.
  

(Nice little bonus, not that USF vehicles can survive long enough for the crews to reach vet 5...)

Riflemen Flares and Rear Echleon Flamers
Affects: Rifle Company

• Merged together into one ability: Incendiary Training
  0CP: Incendiary Training
  (Rifleman can now fire flares to reveal the area, Rear Echleons can now use Flamethrowers)
  

(Atleast Soviets get flares through experience, Reefermen seem to waste an entire ability slot for flares.)

Combined Arms
Affects: Rifle Company, Heavy Calavary Company

• Munitions Cost reduced to 80
  
• Added to Rifle Company
  

(It was too expensive, and now Rifle Company is a little back to its former glory.)

Fired Up
Affects: Rifle Company

• CP cost reduced to 0
  

(Why was it at 2CP anyways? its just a sprint with a negative after effect.)

OKW

Flame Hezter
Affects: Firestorm Doctrine

• Substantially Reduce Vet Requirements
  
• Reduce CP requirement by 1
  

(Why is the darn thing so hard to vet?)

UKF

Advanced Emplacement Regiment (Excluding the Counter-Battery)For the May Balance Preview
Affects: Advanced Emplacement Regiment

• Tone Down Advanced Fortifications Nerfs by 25%
  
• Tone down Defensive Operations by like 1/2, okay?
  

(Holy Crackle Dackle, I hate yet to see more QQ about anything but this commander. But I understand, massed emplacements=no fun. But these nerfs are too extreme. Except for Counter-Battery, That was utterly and truly stupid and unbalance for the most part, but I do see why it was like that (Either arty or build units).)

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Okay all done for now, is good?

And what about the Mobile Assault Regiment, Land Mattresses rule 2v2+ while you suggest commisars for Soviets, let's try to fix what's broken then we'll think about the rest.

And what about the Mobile Assault Regiment, Land Mattresses rule 2v2+ while you suggest commisars for Soviets, let's try to fix what's broken then we'll think about the rest.

The Land Mattress is getting nerfed in the preview by coming 3 CPs later. If I had to nerf it even more, I would make it only have a crew of 3 instead of 4.

Also, the Commissars for Soviets is to buff 2 Commanders that really never see that much use compared to many others.

LM arrival nerf, Walking Stuka however, is fine...

And what about soviet assault group from lend-lize tactics?

And what about soviet assault group from lend-lize tactics?

I remember I did a thread about them awhile ago, I'll just paste it right here:

When Lend-Lease first came out, the Assault Guard/ M5 Half-Track combo made sense. it provided a nice T1/T4 play, skipping T2 and T3.

But this is the current year, and the soviet teching has changed, and why get the M5 Halftrack/Assault Guards when you can just get the regular M5 Halftrack by itself and possibly earlier than the 5CP requirement of the call-in?

This can be solved in a number of ways:

SOLUTION 1

-Reduce CP requirement to 4 CP
-Replace the M5 Halftrack callin with a special M5 Munitions Halftrack that act like the Brit's M3 truck by dropping LMG and PTRS goodies to fellow comrades.

SOLUTION 2

-Lower the CP requirement to 3CP
-Replace M5 Halftrack with the Clown car, keep the assault guards that come with it at 370 Manpower, 15 fuel.

SOLUTION 3

-Lower CP requirement to 2CP
-Just have only the Assault Guards come out at 300 Manpower

ASSAULT GUARDS IN GENERAL

The unit itself doesn't make any sense at all. it overlaps both penals and shock troops, but lack the cheapness of the penals or the durability of the shocks, and also comes out waaaaaaaaaay too late to be of any use. so I would recommend the 2nd or 3rd solution.

but regardless of which solution is chosen, I would like the following changes effect the Assault Guards:

• Renamed to Lend-Lease Guards
  
• All 6 men carry SVTs
  
• Can either get 4 Thompsons or 2 Bazookas as upgrades (Both cost 75 Munitions each)
  

With these changes, it better reflect the Lend-Lease Doctrine by having zookas and tommy guns, and makes the Lend-Lease Guards more of a unique role of choosing either full on AT or AI.

And what about the Mobile Assault Regiment, Land Mattresses rule 2v2+ while you suggest commisars for Soviets, let's try to fix what's broken then we'll think about the rest.

EF Defensive commanders are so very clearly not fine. Bad options are significant issues as well.

wow, i actually like most of these

In regards to Assault Guards, they should just be SMG Conscripts. Conscripts would provide more utility to the rest of your army by way of Merge, Oorah and AT grenade.

In regards to M-42, some ideas that might make it a more useful and viable unit:
- Can camouflage, like Rak43
- Fragmentation Round toggle, which increases anti-infantry but lowers rate of fire, ineffective against vehicles
- Tread Shot like AEC, or Critical Shot like UKF Sniper, or Fire Smoke Shell from Cromwell
- Canister Shot ability that instantly suppresses target infantry/ area, or Buttons target enemy vehicle
- Classic Target Weak Point ability, which stuns targeted vehicle if successfully hit; can be designed to fire like Tulips

In regards to Defensive Doctrine HQ idea, it should instead be a designation of a built bunker instead; it does not rely on ambient buildings, requires you to build a bunker first, and ideally a bunker that's not situated at the front and upgraded with MGs. Their relative durability against small arms but fragility against heavier fire, negates the apparent ease in converting bunkers. Only one can be designated at a time, but can be re-designated after cooldown without needing to destroy designated bunker.

In regards to Mechanized Groups, the two call-ins involve Grenadiers with LMGs and Panzergrenadiers without Panzerschrecks. The LMG Grenadier is fine because you're trading munitions and 250 halftrack for fuel; Panzergrenadiers I don't know, I actually think it might be more useful if it was LMG Grenadiers or Assault Grenadiers instead. Relic has removed all unit call-ins that gave veterancy, so this would be consistent with that ideal (at least until Relic change their mind later on); this applies to other ideas involving giving veterancy at spawn.

Regarding Elite Vehicle Crews, the SMG Thompson upgrade should include things like bonus to experience gain or defensive buffs like the mentioned faster repair speed, to be a bit more generalist in usefulness. At least Sturmpioniers get upgraded to minesweeper mostly for the bonus to repair speed.

Grittle's Ideas

Here's your regularly scheduled testing mod. Have fun!

Some specifics:

• The M42 retains its original accuracy values (which are slightly higher than the T-70's)
  The retreat point that is supposed to be on the Forward Supply Station doesn't seem to be working
  
• I changed the Mechanised Assault Group Grenadiers to have the same vet bonuses as standard Grens
  
• The WC51 crew now have a BAR and 0.8 starting target size
  
• The 20 munition upgrade multiplies penetration by 3 (from 3/2/1 to 9/6/3) and burst ROF by 1.5 (from 8 to 12)
  
• I couldn't change the bail-out time of vehicle crews with vet so they receive a 50% repair speed boost at vet 4 and no longer have repair penalties at vet 5
  
• While you can see all five vet stars on vehicle crews, they must have the upgrade to gain experience past vet 3
  
• I reverted the armour nerf on advanced fortifications (from +10 to +45)
  
• I reduced the number of auto-engineers on the forward assembly from 4 to 2
  
• I took the third option with assault guards
  

And what about soviet assault group from lend-lize tactics?

I would prefer to replace the assault group, to weapons rack access.

Here's your regularly scheduled testing mod. Have fun!

Some specifics:

• The M42 retains its original accuracy values (which are slightly higher than the T-70's)
  The retreat point that is supposed to be on the Forward Supply Station doesn't seem to be working
  
• I changed the Mechanised Assault Group Grenadiers to have the same vet bonuses as standard Grens
  
• The WC51 crew now have a BAR and 0.8 starting target size
  
• The 20 munition upgrade multiplies penetration by 3 (from 3/2/1 to 9/6/3) and burst ROF by 1.5 (from 8 to 12)
  
• I couldn't change the bail-out time of vehicle crews with vet so they receive a 50% repair speed boost at vet 4 and no longer have repair penalties at vet 5
  
• While you can see all five vet stars on vehicle crews, they must have the upgrade to gain experience past vet 3
  
• I reverted the armour nerf on advanced fortifications (from +10 to +45)
  
• I reduced the number of auto-engineers on the forward assembly from 4 to 2
  
• I took the third option with assault guards
  

Holy Smokes, Thank you once again Svanh!

Relic now remove all vet units call-ins, so I don't think that's possible to call in Vet 1 Assault Engins

Some wehrmacht and soviet commanders really could use some love. "German infantry doctrine"

There is a shitload of useless commanders that could need some tweaking.
Same goes to normal units and their abilities (Vet 1 Med Kit srsly?)

Relic now remove all vet units call-ins, so I don't think that's possible to call in Vet 1 Assault Engins

The problem with the preivious pre-vetted call-ins were that they came in really early (OCP Vetted reefermen and about 2CP vet 3 grens in terms of income)

The difference with these mechanized call-ins are that they:

1)Come in at CP3-4, so it's pretty late in the early game
2)Cost A quite a bit (30 fuel for a 250 halftrack)
3)That fact it comes with a vehicle which unless its the USF 1, has no attack at all. unless....


But I understand the concerns, I hated seeing vet 1 reefermen 1 minute into the game. (although the flamer change to RE was too much in my eyes, but that's a different story.)

I remember I did a thread about them awhile ago, I'll just paste it right here:

When Lend-Lease first came out, the Assault Guard/ M5 Half-Track combo made sense. it provided a nice T1/T4 play, skipping T2 and T3.

But this is the current year, and the soviet teching has changed, and why get the M5 Halftrack/Assault Guards when you can just get the regular M5 Halftrack by itself and possibly earlier than the 5CP requirement of the call-in?

This can be solved in a number of ways:

SOLUTION 1

-Reduce CP requirement to 4 CP
-Replace the M5 Halftrack callin with a special M5 Munitions Halftrack that act like the Brit's M3 truck by dropping LMG and PTRS goodies to fellow comrades.

I wholeheartedly support this idea with one tweak - The M5 munitions halftrack should drop BARs and zooks (there already is the model in the game - the AI sometimes picks a hidden commander with it).

It's a the Lend-Lease doctrine after all - give those Soviets some US weaponry!

Forget about pre-vetted units for the Mech call ins for the Wehrmacht, just give the 250 the ability to reinforce already and an upgrade for an MG34/42 already to justify it's fuel price instead of doing the stupid vet gimmicks again and Relic and everybody else crying about it later on, give the AA mobile repair station upgrade to the M3/M5 Half-track call in for the USF, there, problem solved.

And yes, please, revert the nerfs to AER PARTIALLY, they were a bit over the top, the only thing that was unbalanced was counter-arty ability but that's it, being annoying doesn't mean being effective as well, talking about the emplacements.

Forget about pre-vetted units for the Mech call ins for the Wehrmacht, just give the 250 the ability to reinforce already and an upgrade for an MG34/42 already to justify it's fuel price instead of doing the stupid vet gimmicks again and Relic and everybody else crying about it later on, give the AA mobile repair station upgrade to the M3/M5 Half-track call in for the USF, there, problem solved.

Well, for some reason, you can get main gun criticals on the 250 for some reason, so a gunner on top could work...

But Reinforce for the 250? nah B. that's too much they could reduce the fuel by 5.

M3 Half-Track Repair Upgrade could work, but I feel Pre-Vet 1 Unit inside the vehicle is the easiest and most effective route, Your getting early game units in the mid game with a fuel cost and a pretty weak vehicle, the Vet 1 easily justifies the mid-game entry and the fuel cost.

Well, for some reason, you can get main gun criticals on the 250 for some reason, so a gunner on top could work...

But Reinforce for the 250? nah B. that's too much they could reduce the fuel by 5.

M3 Half-Track Repair Upgrade could work, but I feel Pre-Vet 1 Unit inside the vehicle is the easiest and most effective route, Your getting early game units in the mid game with a fuel cost and a pretty weak vehicle, the Vet 1 easily justifies the mid-game entry and the fuel cost.

Giving the half-track itself a mg-42 upgrade option for 60 munitions would be nice. It would at least give it a greater purpose if for some reason the passengers died.