while roket artillery destroy everything. Heavy howitzers do hit nothing. even rockets and mortars do better against static defensive structures and infantry.
my solution is
1. increse firing rate, reduce penetration. (howitzers were not for destroying tanks.)
2. reduce damage, increse AOE to reduce RNG.
3. reduce shells, reduce ability cooldown.
what's your thought?
Heavy howitzers are in very poor state.
20 Apr 2016, 20:44 PM
#1
Posts: 304
20 Apr 2016, 20:52 PM
#2
Posts: 118
(howitzers were not for destroying tanks.)
B4?
20 Apr 2016, 21:18 PM
#3
Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2
Add random crits when vehicle is hit.
Make B4 3-shells / 240dmg each howie, instead of one big nasty rng bomb.
Make B4 3-shells / 240dmg each howie, instead of one big nasty rng bomb.
20 Apr 2016, 21:26 PM
#4
Posts: 304
if you have different opinion. give it to this thread. welcome
20 Apr 2016, 21:29 PM
#6
Posts: 673
We had thread about it sometime ago. There we suggested to buff howitzers in other way:
1. Give supression to howitzers, like LeIG's had. That would be both reasonable and effective, that falling shells supressing infantry, that stand close enough to blast area.
2. Let direct hit's to enemie's vechiles cause small damage effects, like stunning or turret block, or, maybe with small chanses even engine damage.
Majority, that wrote in that old thread agreed with those buffs actually, because they making artillery more effective as long-range random-effective support guns.
Guess, it would be real best way to make Howitzers more effective in thier support role.
1. Give supression to howitzers, like LeIG's had. That would be both reasonable and effective, that falling shells supressing infantry, that stand close enough to blast area.
2. Let direct hit's to enemie's vechiles cause small damage effects, like stunning or turret block, or, maybe with small chanses even engine damage.
Majority, that wrote in that old thread agreed with those buffs actually, because they making artillery more effective as long-range random-effective support guns.
Guess, it would be real best way to make Howitzers more effective in thier support role.
20 Apr 2016, 21:40 PM
#7
Posts: 354
LeFH is kinda useful in 2v2+ against British simcity, you just need to know safe from counter barrage places. But in general howitzers underperform, I think they need bigger AOE with small damage, lower than 80.
20 Apr 2016, 22:13 PM
#8
Posts: 1585 | Subs: 1
Howitzers are bad because they can be countered by off maps too easily.
Side note: Artillery and especially howies were extremely effective against tanks. Tanks often only have 10-20 mm of armor on top and a shell dropping on an engine deck will light them up. The American army relied heavily on this to stop German tanks, and the Soviets just placed arty guns directly into tanks to build TDs.
Side note: Artillery and especially howies were extremely effective against tanks. Tanks often only have 10-20 mm of armor on top and a shell dropping on an engine deck will light them up. The American army relied heavily on this to stop German tanks, and the Soviets just placed arty guns directly into tanks to build TDs.
20 Apr 2016, 22:24 PM
#9
Posts: 3103 | Subs: 1
Howitzers are bad because they can be countered by off maps too easily.
Personally, I think that could be fine since we definitely don't want them to be too hard to take out and turn the game into an artyoff, but there should be changes to them in compensation of that.
E.g. Cost reduced, vet removed (because they're balanced around expecting to get rekt by off-maps), builds faster, gun is harder to destroy so off-maps won't totally remove the investment in a howitzer as easily.
20 Apr 2016, 22:31 PM
#10
Posts: 1304 | Subs: 13
Exchange some manpower for fuel so they are easier to field as fuel is plentiful mid-late game. Manpower is not.
After that, make it so the howitzer themselves cannot be one-hit by off-maps so they can be recrewed and repaired if it's just a yolo scout looking to drop artillery.
After that, make it so the howitzer themselves cannot be one-hit by off-maps so they can be recrewed and repaired if it's just a yolo scout looking to drop artillery.
20 Apr 2016, 22:44 PM
#11
Posts: 304
We had thread about it sometime ago. There we suggested to buff howitzers in other way:
1. Give supression to howitzers, like LeIG's had. That would be both reasonable and effective, that falling shells supressing infantry, that stand close enough to blast area.
2. Let direct hit's to enemie's vechiles cause small damage effects, like stunning or turret block, or, maybe with small chanses even engine damage.
Majority, that wrote in that old thread agreed with those buffs actually, because they making artillery more effective as long-range random-effective support guns.
Guess, it would be real best way to make Howitzers more effective in thier support role.
Suppression is very good idea. Actually, infantry getting heavy arty fire used to go prone to avoid shrapnels.
20 Apr 2016, 22:52 PM
#12
Posts: 1954
My opinion
Make howitzers like other team weapons that don't get destroyed while crewed.
Decrease cost to 320-360
Lower number of shells to 4 for lefh (150 damage), 3 for ml20 (200 damage), 1 B4 (600) damage
AOE small for full damage, but larger AOE for smaller damage plus suppression (at large distance from center the lefh and ml20 should only have 0.3x damage)
Make vet abilities be smoke, arty flares, and maybe reduced cooldown. Possibly precision strike but make that cost munitions
The old ML20 that shot 4-5 shells but had good AOE was fine. People didn't use it much because Relic gave everyone CAS. The buff then nerf made it lousy. The lefh would be about as bad except that the target size for sim city is large enough to make the lefh useful.
Make howitzers like other team weapons that don't get destroyed while crewed.
Decrease cost to 320-360
Lower number of shells to 4 for lefh (150 damage), 3 for ml20 (200 damage), 1 B4 (600) damage
AOE small for full damage, but larger AOE for smaller damage plus suppression (at large distance from center the lefh and ml20 should only have 0.3x damage)
Make vet abilities be smoke, arty flares, and maybe reduced cooldown. Possibly precision strike but make that cost munitions
The old ML20 that shot 4-5 shells but had good AOE was fine. People didn't use it much because Relic gave everyone CAS. The buff then nerf made it lousy. The lefh would be about as bad except that the target size for sim city is large enough to make the lefh useful.
20 Apr 2016, 23:05 PM
#13
Posts: 27
I think if you lowered their cost to around 400 mp they would be fine since offmaps kill them off quite easily. Hell it's not that difficult to take em out now that they have to be build outside the base.
20 Apr 2016, 23:17 PM
#14
Posts: 738
less shells and bigger boom
20 Apr 2016, 23:19 PM
#15
Posts: 304
less shells and bigger boom
Simple And quite nice.
20 Apr 2016, 23:27 PM
#16
Posts: 1930
less shells and bigger boom
Simple And quite nice.
less shells and bigger boom is just going to cause more Squad swipe, especially against the wehr grenadier.
21 Apr 2016, 17:13 PM
#17
Posts: 5279
Limit to 1
Make gun not break when crewed
Give plethora of abilities
Give suppression
Make all barrages (and abilities) cost muni
Reduce MP cost
No chance of spam, good support unit. Relying on it reduces off maps and mines and upgrades.
Make gun not break when crewed
Give plethora of abilities
Give suppression
Make all barrages (and abilities) cost muni
Reduce MP cost
No chance of spam, good support unit. Relying on it reduces off maps and mines and upgrades.
#stalinwept
21 Apr 2016, 18:22 PM
#18
Posts: 1890 | Subs: 1
+1 to Miragefla
Its mostly about them being cost prohibitive and the risk/reward of them being 1 shotted by an offmap (especially in team games) resulting in them currently being not worth it. A token fuel cost in exchange for MP makes sense (it's what relic did for Land Mattress).
I'm kind of intrigued by Brad's suggestion to drastically reduce price but also reduce range to promote more forward building of Howies. It would make them more accessible AND more effective due to the reduced scatter of being closer. I don't think it would solve the problem but it's a good starting point to think from.
Its mostly about them being cost prohibitive and the risk/reward of them being 1 shotted by an offmap (especially in team games) resulting in them currently being not worth it. A token fuel cost in exchange for MP makes sense (it's what relic did for Land Mattress).
I'm kind of intrigued by Brad's suggestion to drastically reduce price but also reduce range to promote more forward building of Howies. It would make them more accessible AND more effective due to the reduced scatter of being closer. I don't think it would solve the problem but it's a good starting point to think from.
21 Apr 2016, 18:24 PM
#19
Posts: 673
Limit to 1
Maybe 2? 1 Howitzer can't be enough, really. 2 is always OK, making more is throwing MP and popcap into nothing.
21 Apr 2016, 20:27 PM
#20
1 Posts: 927
Supression to arty is retarded, basicly if you ever get cought in a barrage you have to auto-retreat. Micro to dodge shells would be pointless thus less skill.
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