OKW Need Some better Anti-Blob Tools

They trade MG for the absolute best armor roster in the game.

Not everyone has everything.

And another point - why blobs are so problematic for you? OKW can't counter blobs, maybe, ok, but, can USF effectivly counter some super-heavy or just heavy vechiles of OKW? As I said you before - each faction has something powerfull, something in core. But OKW has 2 cores at once - nice infantry with volksblobs and superior tanks, while USF should be happy about only infantry. It's not right actually.

This thread isn't a OKW vs US grudge match. If you feel that US has some weakness, feel free to make a thread about that.

This thread isn't a OKW vs US grudge match. If you feel that US has some weakness, feel free to make a thread about that.

OP wrote about "OKW has problems with dealing with blobs, specially USF blobs". And he and other guys mentioned, that USF blobs are big problem for them, so it is actually about OKW vs US match.

And I wanted to say not that "US has some weakness". I wanted to show, that weakness of OKW against blobs is instrument of balancing, which is pretty similar to "weakness of USF against heavy and super-heavy tanks".

I am the OP. Yes USF provides the best example, because they have the best blob. But it shouldn't be about one faction vs another is all I am saying. Brits blob is decent too, but more fragile and weaker AT when compared to the US.

In the end, balance should be done whenever it is needed.

Honestly a great general "fix" for blobs would be to get rid of all forward retreat points. Would increase the return to the action time on the bigger 3v3 and 4v4 maps.

I am the OP. Yes USF provides the best example, because they have the best blob. But it shouldn't be about one faction vs another is all I am saying. Brits blob is decent too, but more fragile and weaker AT when compared to the US.

In the end, balance should be done whenever it is needed.

Honestly a great general "fix" for blobs would be to get rid of all forward retreat points. Would increase the return to the action time on the bigger 3v3 and 4v4 maps.

But the point is every faction supposedly has strengths and weaknesses. OKW is as poor against blobs as USF is against super heavy tanks.

UKF has no mobile indirect fire whatsoever and their infantry sucks at fighting on the move, but lawd knows they're the toughest faction to knock from a fixed position + they have the best Allied armor.

Ostheer has crap line infantry and so-so medium armor but makes up for it with the best machine gun and AT Gun in the game, strong late game, as well as a diverse early game (Grens, flame pios, sniper, mortar, MG42).

Soviets also have crap stock line infantry, but good support weapons, crap stock medium armor, but great heavies, artillery, and call-in infantry.

OKW can't do much blob control and their line infantry is out-classed by Allies, but easily has the best armor in the game, including non-doctrinal access to the best heavy tank in the game.

USF has dominant and flexible line infantry and great light and medium vehicles, but really struggles late w/ hardly any indirect fire and extremely squishy armor top-to-bottom.

If you play as OKW, you know you're gonna have to work a little harder to deal w/ blobs. If you play as USF, you're gonna have to work a little harder to kill heaavy tanks. No reason any faction should be EZ-mode for dealing with every conceivable threat.

But the point is every faction supposedly has strengths and weaknesses. OKW is as poor against blobs as USF is against super heavy tanks.

Except, I think people generally think that blobs are a cancer to the game. All factions having a way to punish blobs would be good imo.

Except, I think people generally think that blobs are a cancer to the game. All factions having a way to punish blobs would be good imo.

Blobs are only way to make soviet or US infantry work right, because in small groups they are not so effective as in large numbers together. Same goes for Volks, Grens and others... You can't do anything about it. Destroy blobs and all weak-medium infantry will be UP to "specialized high costed infantry" like Obers, or Shocks. Obers will be powerfull in 1-2 squad grops against divided 1-2 squad groups of cons of rifles, but will lose to same infantry, but in bunch of 5-6 squads against them.

So, blobs may be cancer of CoH 2, but you can't just delete it simply. It will destroy entire idea of Soviet faction, for example, which means that "you have weak units at all (not only infantry), but powerfull in big masses". Without blobs axis will become really OP.

Welp, look like you like blobs. Lots of people don't.

Just because blobs are effective, doesn't mean it is good for the game.

I am in favor of making blobs less effective...and I blob all the time because is works.

The only thing OKW needs right now is the second round of reworks that will make all of their free stuff actually require investment of resources.

Welp, look like you like blobs. Lots of people don't.

Just because blobs are effective, doesn't mean it is good for the game.

I am in favor of making blobs less effective...and I blob all the time because is works.

I don't like blobs actually, they are too vunerable, too much resourses concentrated on 1 place, always dangerous.

And I only say, that blobs right now are only way to make bad or middle-quality infantry work right. You just can't use concsripts in small groups, because they are too weak. Same goes for riflemans - they are not "healthy" and dying fast. Same goes for Volks... all other infantry.

If you want to play without blobs, then entire infantry gameplay mechanic in CoH 2 should be revised. And it will make it only worse. So, I prefer to admit "lesser evil".

I don't like blobs actually, they are too vunerable, too much resourses concentrated on 1 place, always dangerous.

And I only say, that blobs right now are only way to make bad or middle-quality infantry work right. You just can't use concsripts in small groups, because they are too weak. Same goes for riflemans - they are not "healthy" and dying fast. Same goes for Volks... all other infantry.

If you want to play without blobs, then entire infantry gameplay mechanic in CoH 2 should be revised. And it will make it only worse. So, I prefer to admit "lesser evil".

IMO increasing ranged weapon range by 5, increasing LoS by 3 when in cover, reducing moving rifle multipliers (non assault units) to .4 and .5 (Garand) would end blobbing as we know it

If you say the stuka counters blobs then you haven't really used it.

Give the leig a suppression ability. Make it so you have to activate it. Similar to volley fire.

I have a screenshot at home in a 4v4 with my exactly 250kills with my stukas. Get yourself a InfaredHT like you should be and it is very much an antiblob weapon.

Do not give Leig a suppression ability. It was removed for a very good reason. No one wants to go back to long range suppression snipers. If you want to make it similar to volley then increased received accuracy on the unit like they do to RE's and you will see why no one ever uses it.

Honestly I play every faction and in 3v3 4v4 modes there is no reason not to build the InfraHT then you can bombard with Lieg and Stukas to your hearts content.

I have a screenshot at home in a 4v4 with my exactly 250kills with my stukas. Get yourself a InfaredHT like you should be and it is very much an antiblob weapon.

Do not give Leig a suppression ability. It was removed for a very good reason. No one wants to go back to long range suppression snipers. If you want to make it similar to volley then increased received accuracy on the unit like they do to RE's and you will see why no one ever uses it.

Honestly I play every faction and in 3v3 4v4 modes there is no reason not to build the InfraHT then you can bombard with Lieg and Stukas to your hearts content.

You know, that is a great suggestion. I've only tried it out a few times. I will definitely give it another shot

The natural solution to early blobbing was the 20mm faptrack. However the boost to zook effectiveness, especially accuracy, has now made the 55 fuel faptrack a waste of resources. It is far too easy to kill for its cost.

The new solution would be to greatly reduce the fuel cost of the faptrack, leaving it still difficult to keep alive but making it much less a risky gambit to get early on, and you'll end up seeing them used more often to counter inf blobs.

I propose lowering the fuel cost to be in line with its effectiveness as a anti inf only vehicle that has to set up to fire, which I believe would be 30 fuel.

Joseph

The natural solution to early blobbing was the 20mm faptrack. However the boost to zook effectiveness, especially accuracy, has now made the 55 fuel faptrack a waste of resources. It is far too easy to kill for its cost.

The new solution would be to greatly reduce the fuel cost of the faptrack, leaving it still difficult to keep alive but making it much less a risky gambit to get early on, and you'll end up seeing them used more often to counter inf blobs.

I propose lowering the fuel cost to be in line with its effectiveness as a anti inf only vehicle that has to set up to fire, which I believe would be 30 fuel.

Joseph

Then get rid of it's AA capabilities. It'd be cheap as a SU halftrack but comes upgraded with AA. SU has to spend 120 muni to get AA capabilities.

I believe OKW halftrack already penetrates all light vehicles armor (not light tanks). M20, halftracks, greyhound, m3. There's a possibility that it might become too good of a defensive weapon. Imagine T1 SU. No counters unless build T2 or T3 Su76.

Then get rid of it's AA capabilities. It'd be cheap as a SU halftrack but comes upgraded with AA. SU has to spend 120 muni to get AA capabilities.

I believe OKW halftrack already penetrates all light vehicles armor (not light tanks). M20, halftracks, greyhound, m3. There's a possibility that it might become too good of a defensive weapon. Imagine T1 SU. No counters unless build T2 or T3 Su76.

A ridiculous idea, the faptrack was originally developed as an AA platform and only later used against ground troops out of desperation.

You've not taken the fact that the faptrack cannot move and fire, requiring a significant setup time before shooting, into your calculus.

Joseph

The natural solution to early blobbing was the 20mm faptrack. However the boost to zook effectiveness, especially accuracy, has now made the 55 fuel faptrack a waste of resources. It is far too easy to kill for its cost.

The new solution would be to greatly reduce the fuel cost of the faptrack, leaving it still difficult to keep alive but making it much less a risky gambit to get early on, and you'll end up seeing them used more often to counter inf blobs.

I propose lowering the fuel cost to be in line with its effectiveness as a anti inf only vehicle that has to set up to fire, which I believe would be 30 fuel.

Joseph

A fuel decrease would cause timing problems, so it will most likely not happen. It performs for its cost offensively, so a change to the set-up time or defensive capabilities is a more realistic change.

A fuel decrease would cause timing problems, so it will most likely not happen. It performs for its cost offensively, so a change to the set-up time or defensive capabilities is a more realistic change.

Unless you expect it to improve to the lynx's level of effectiveness I suspect no minor increases in ability will cause it to be used more often. Its a 55 fuel waste of resources, when for 10 fuel more, not including teching, I could have a lynx.

Players will always wait that out rather than take a unit that cannot be effectively used offensively and which dies to zooks so easy.

A proper boost to ability, leaving the fuel cost the same, would have to take the faptrack in the realm of a bofors emplacement.

Joseph

Unless you expect it to improve to the lynx's level of effectiveness I suspect no minor increases in ability will cause it to be used more often. Its a 55 fuel waste of resources, when for 10 fuel more, not including teching, I could have a lynx.

It is a waste of resources as it is now yes. That doesn't change the fact that a 30 fuel price tag will mess up the timing completely, so it most likely will never happen. Therefor the buffs have to be something else.

Players will always wait that out rather than take a unit that cannot be effectively used offensively and which dies to zooks so easy.

Joseph

I agree. So the solution should be to make it effective when used offensively, and more durable. Mobility (set up-time) and squishyness is what makes this difficult atm, so that's where the changes should be.

Ok,Why was sturmtiger Aoe ninja nerfed..??? its nerfed from 10 to 8..??? why