Panzer 4 penetration.
3 Nov 2015, 14:02 PM
#41
Posts: 210
No editing, no tricks. Just made them fight straight up 1st recording through.
Panzer IV has better penetration than the Sherman, Cromwell and T34 at longer ranges (which is standard engagement range). It beats out any medium tank the majority of the time.
It has more armor than any other medium tank.
At vet2, it has more armor than an EZ8. What are people trying to argue here?
The Ausf J. version is literally almost on par with the EZ8, with the EZ8 having a slight upper hand.
3 Nov 2015, 14:16 PM
#42
Posts: 1653
3x +5% armour bullitin for OKW Pz4 makes it pretty even to beat a EZ8
3 Nov 2015, 14:26 PM
#43
1 
Posts: 2307 | Subs: 4
I wish they would add increased pen at vet 3 or something.
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3 Nov 2015, 14:34 PM
#44
1 
Posts: 2885
Thank you for unbiased poll austerlitz 
As for the topic: its not p4 that needs cost decrease, its the BP2.
As for the topic: its not p4 that needs cost decrease, its the BP2.
3 Nov 2015, 15:01 PM
#45
Posts: 219
Like most other players I use P4s to deal with allies infantry rather than with allies tanks since you have tank destroyers and At guns for that job.
And when thinking about the AI role the P4 is clearly over priced in that sector, being easily outperformed by sherman (due HE Shells) and by cromwells (due high speed crush). P4 vs Shermans vs Cromwell is rather a RNG fest, unless it's the P4 okw, so you could say they perform on the same level against each other.
I think it would be ok to decrease to costs of P4 to Sherman/Cromwell level, while reducing the P4 OKW version by 10 fuel, to show its superiority over Cromwell/Sherman.
+1 to this
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3 Nov 2015, 16:29 PM
#46
Posts: 279
No editing, no tricks. Just made them fight straight up 1st recording through.
Panzer IV has better penetration than the Sherman, Cromwell and T34 at longer ranges (which is standard engagement range). It beats out any medium tank the majority of the time.
It has more armor than any other medium tank.
At vet2, it has more armor than an EZ8. What are people trying to argue here?
The Ausf J. version is literally almost on par with the EZ8, with the EZ8 having a slight upper hand.
let me ask you this..
why does the Pershing "Heavy" tank which comes at 13 cp from a doctrinal commander and costs 600mp and 230fuel and also is limited to 1 LOSE to the cheaper non tech Panther that also DOESNT HAVE a limit of 1?
why should the panzer 4 beat the E8??
does the t34-76 beat Panzer 4s??
does the sherman beat Panzer 4s??
These two posts are the reasons I believe p4 is fine. That amazing armor is compounded by its frankly ridiculous vet 2. It's the best workhorse medium tank in the game, period.
3 Nov 2015, 16:35 PM
#47
3 
Posts: 545
LOL the T 34-76 being in Tier 4 for that performance.
3 Nov 2015, 16:40 PM
#48
Posts: 392
LOL the T 34-76 being in Tier 4 for that performance.
"its fine spam it"
3 Nov 2015, 16:57 PM
#49
3 Posts: 545
3 Nov 2015, 17:11 PM
#50
Posts: 1802 | Subs: 1
I wish they would add increased pen at vet 3 or something.
Actually, that's something I want to see for all mediums, mostly T34/76.
3 Nov 2015, 17:18 PM
#51
Posts: 509 | Subs: 1
Seriously, there are a few axis units which need a buff. But certainly it is not p4.
3 Nov 2015, 17:29 PM
#52
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
Actually, that's something I want to see for all mediums, mostly T34/76.
Like getting 34/76 to vet3 possible is in other circumstances then sinking tiger crossing the ice
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
3 Nov 2015, 17:37 PM
#53
4 Posts: 474
Like getting 34/76 to vet3 possible is in other circumstances then sinking tiger crossing the ice
Can confirm, my t34 got to vet 3 when it rammed a tiger in the ice
3 Nov 2015, 17:39 PM
#54
Posts: 738
I would like to see a cromwell buff first
3 Nov 2015, 17:46 PM
#55
Posts: 1617
It can't even penetrate the rear of an IS-2...it needs some pen buff.
4 Nov 2015, 00:42 AM
#56
8 Posts: 2470
Like most other players I use P4s to deal with allies infantry rather than with allies tanks since you have tank destroyers and At guns for that job.
And when thinking about the AI role the P4 is clearly over priced in that sector, being easily outperformed by sherman (due HE Shells) and by cromwells (due high speed crush). P4 vs Shermans vs Cromwell is rather a RNG fest, unless it's the P4 okw, so you could say they perform on the same level against each other.
I think it would be ok to decrease to costs of P4 to Sherman/Cromwell level, while reducing the P4 OKW version by 10 fuel, to show its superiority over Cromwell/Sherman.
34/76 vs pIV is also (or at least was for quite a while) an RNG fest that the 34/76 could win, despite costing 25 less fuel than a pIV and for some of that time having better AI. the pIV is certainly the better tank though.
point being that as long as relic doesn't have standardized prices for similar things it's really hard to judge cost efficiency of similar units between the factions.
It can't even penetrate the rear of an IS-2...it needs some pen buff.
IS-2 has 205 rear armour and the pIV has pens of 120/110/100. a pIV has at best a 59% and at worst a 48% chance of penetrating the rear armour of a IS-2. both of those values are greater than 3%, the cutoff value on penetration, and thus, at all ranges, the pIV can penetrate the rear armour of an IS-2.
i don't feel like doing the numbers but the same is true the frontal armour, with a lower pen chance.
4 Nov 2015, 02:10 AM
#57
Posts: 348
The Panzer is a general purpose tank. The Stug is the dedicated tank fighter.
I meant to write Panther Panzer lol my bad. :/
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4 Nov 2015, 02:23 AM
#58
Posts: 2561
It can't even penetrate the rear of an IS-2...it needs some pen buff.The allies mediums have the same problem with Tigers. It's a problem with the rear armor of heavies, not the P4.
4 Nov 2015, 02:28 AM
#59
Posts: 3103 | Subs: 1
The allies mediums have the same problem with Tigers. It's a problem with the rear armor of heavies, not the P4.
Indeed. Nerf all heavies' rear armour, that would be a systematic change long overdone for the viability of most base tier mediums.
4 Nov 2015, 02:36 AM
#60
Posts: 353
panzer 4 good for deal any workhorse but not good to spam like sherman T-34 for Flank Heavy tank because their Low pen in close range
they need Stug 3 or Pak 40 For help to deal Heavy and use Panzer 4 for tanker role (if lost can replace to Panther )
they need Stug 3 or Pak 40 For help to deal Heavy and use Panzer 4 for tanker role (if lost can replace to Panther )
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