I think the firefly is pretty good. It's a solid tank destroyer. You have to consider the army around the unit: brits have potent 6lbers, 17lber emplacements and PIATs which are excellent for supporting your tanks.
Firefly and the tulip
5 Oct 2015, 18:29 PM
#81
Posts: 1384
5 Oct 2015, 18:33 PM
#82
Posts: 176
In what reality are Piats good?
They miss stationary engine blown targets and they don't fire over shot blockers.
They miss stationary engine blown targets and they don't fire over shot blockers.
5 Oct 2015, 18:43 PM
#83
Posts: 1384
In what reality are Piats good?
They miss stationary engine blown targets and they don't fire over shot blockers.
They miss as often as bazookas do. They're cheap and do decent damage. They're good against light/medium tanks or halftrucks/cars. Also really good for base raping. (especially against OKW's trucks.)
5 Oct 2015, 19:33 PM
#84
Posts: 176
You obviously don't play Brits often, they don't hit as often as Bazookas do because of the nature of there targeting. If a Zooka fires and misses it can still hit - Piat can't.
5 Oct 2015, 20:50 PM
#85
Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1
You can guarantee hit's on enemy vehicles using attack ground with PIAT's. Also still no addressing of the fact that Tulips have piercing which means you can skill shot tanks through wrecks and buildings.
5 Oct 2015, 21:03 PM
#86
Posts: 1930
You can guarantee hit's on enemy vehicles using attack ground with PIAT's.
which still isn't a guarantee against moving target. Not to mention it's still one additional challenge you need to keep track of in a game.
If you're busying control your tanks, you're probably not manually launching your PIAT. How long before people leaving to dodge in a curve to avoid the PIAT?
5 Oct 2015, 21:05 PM
#87
Posts: 1384
You obviously don't play Brits often, they don't hit as often as Bazookas do because of the nature of there targeting. If a Zooka fires and misses it can still hit - Piat can't.
Tanks suffer a significant accuracy penalty while moving, so playets regularly stop to shoot. The range on the PIATS rival the sniper so as long as you have vision you can often hit them from further away than they can see you. People also underestimate the PIATS a lot. And you can always use attackground to hit them when they are moving. I'm quite good at that.
It's not the easiest weapon to use or the most reliable, but it's still good. I prefer them over bazookas/schrecks since they have such long range and are quite cheap.
5 Oct 2015, 21:13 PM
#88
Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1
which still isn't a guarantee against moving target. Not to mention it's still one additional challenge you need to keep track of in a game.
If you're busying control your tanks, you're probably not manually launching your PIAT. How long before people leaving to dodge in a curve to avoid the PIAT?
If you attack ground to were a tank is moving or in the middle of it then it will be hard to miss. I mean I would kill to have better micro rewarded with Zooks and Shreks in the same way.
Regardless, this thread is not about PIATS, I was merely commenting on them not being useless.
5 Oct 2015, 22:13 PM
#89
Posts: 1944 | Subs: 2
Tanks suffer a significant accuracy penalty while moving, so playets regularly stop to shoot. The range on the PIATS rival the sniper so as long as you have vision you can often hit them from further away than they can see you. People also underestimate the PIATS a lot. And you can always use attackground to hit them when they are moving. I'm quite good at that.
It's not the easiest weapon to use or the most reliable, but it's still good. I prefer them over bazookas/schrecks since they have such long range and are quite cheap.
PIATs do good damage but they miss moving targets near 100% of the time when not attacking ground. Thats not balanced when units like Shreks or Bazookas can autonomously engage vehicles with some success while you micro in other places, but PIATs require you to baby sit them to get hits. Its also imbalanced when you consider the fact that people playing at mediocre levels probably don't make use of this and have handheld AT that is 10x worse than their opponent who isn't putting in any extra effort either. Just because there is a work around to make something shitty perform better doesn't make it balanced.
6 Oct 2015, 01:10 AM
#90
Posts: 1216
That goes for everything but barrage weapons that can attack ground.
Just because you can click on something, doesn't mean the missiles will stop at it.
They stop only in contact with shot blockers and armor, will pass through anything else, ignoring it.
End of the day, Tulip rockets can be fired at anything, including infantry, buildings and team weapons., and I think this should be changed to only vehicles.
6 Oct 2015, 03:37 AM
#91
Posts: 1384
PIATs do good damage but they miss moving targets near 100% of the time when not attacking ground. Thats not balanced when units like Shreks or Bazookas can autonomously engage vehicles with some success while you micro in other places, but PIATs require you to baby sit them to get hits. Its also imbalanced when you consider the fact that people playing at mediocre levels probably don't make use of this and have handheld AT that is 10x worse than their opponent who isn't putting in any extra effort either. Just because there is a work around to make something shitty perform better doesn't make it balanced.
I agree, they could be more accurate.
I should also clarify that my original comment is speaking about roles and arsenal. PIATs will always be in the game, they will always hurt tanks. Their role won't change even if they do get a buff in the near future.
6 Oct 2015, 03:38 AM
#92
Posts: 1384
That goes for everything but barrage weapons that can attack ground.
End of the day, Tulip rockets can be fired at anything, including infantry, buildings and team weapons., and I think this should be changed to only vehicles.
I disagree. It's 150 munitions and being an all purpose damage dealer is the only thing that justifies that cost. It's hardly spammable, so I don't see the issue.
6 Oct 2015, 07:14 AM
#93
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
That goes for everything but barrage weapons that can attack ground.
End of the day, Tulip rockets can be fired at anything, including infantry, buildings and team weapons., and I think this should be changed to only vehicles.
Dude... they can NOT, they will go OVER every single thing that isn't a tank or shot blocker.
That means they will go OVER infantry, OVER weapon teams, OVER cover that isn't a garrison, because they can NOT hit the ground.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
6 Oct 2015, 12:18 PM
#94
Posts: 41
Permanently BannedI'd rather see a centaur nerf than firefly buff.
6 Oct 2015, 18:31 PM
#95
Posts: 176
Honestly if they reduced the reload from 10s > 6/7s and nerfed the tulip cost / damage i'd be fine with it. As it stands you just drive up to a Firefly with any low cost medium tank and they just win.
6 Oct 2015, 23:41 PM
#96
8 Posts: 2470
Dude... they can NOT, they will go OVER every single thing that isn't a tank or shot blocker.
That means they will go OVER infantry, OVER weapon teams, OVER cover that isn't a garrison, because they can NOT hit the ground.
not true, they go through buildings
7 Oct 2015, 00:36 AM
#97
Posts: 1891
Crocodile + 3 Fireflys= you win the game assuming you have vetted infantry sections.
Firefly is a niche unit as it should be, to compensate Brits have best AT gun, 17 pounder, and absurd medium armor. Also best lategame infantry and best offmaps.
Firefly is a niche unit as it should be, to compensate Brits have best AT gun, 17 pounder, and absurd medium armor. Also best lategame infantry and best offmaps.
The Fascisti Will Pay.
7 Oct 2015, 02:47 AM
#98
Posts: 1216
Dude... they can NOT, they will go OVER every single thing that isn't a tank or shot blocker.
That means they will go OVER infantry, OVER weapon teams, OVER cover that isn't a garrison, because they can NOT hit the ground.
You misunderstand me: When I say the ability can attack ground and not be limited to vehicles, I mean the Tulip ability doesn't require you to target vehicles to fire them. Obviously the intended and most target would be a vehicle or a building, but I've been able to destroy units like AT guns and infantry with them.
What this also means s that you can exploit this feature by firing the Tulips at shot blockers to destroy enemy units adjacent to them. I've been able to do this and save my Firefly, or destroy an annoying AT gun through this tactic, a tactic I don't think should exist.
7 Oct 2015, 05:13 AM
#99
Posts: 1384
You misunderstand me: When I say the ability can attack ground and not be limited to vehicles, I mean the Tulip ability doesn't require you to target vehicles to fire them. Obviously the intended and most target would be a vehicle or a building, but I've been able to destroy units like AT guns and infantry with them.
What this also means s that you can exploit this feature by firing the Tulips at shot blockers to destroy enemy units adjacent to them. I've been able to do this and save my Firefly, or destroy an annoying AT gun through this tactic, a tactic I don't think should exist.
Why not? It's a situational micro trick.
7 Oct 2015, 07:55 AM
#100
Posts: 1216
FIne, then I want Target Weak Point to also be "tricked" into disabling AT guns, too.
Why not? It's a situational micro trick.
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