Panzerwerfer - the forgotten Ostheer arty

Thats my point. T4 is powerful ostheer weapons. The Panzerwerfer is a powerful unit.

But it's not really a power unit. T4 Ostheer is almost never bought for the Panzerwerfer alone so I don't think there'd be much of a problem if the Panzerwerfer came earlier. It may mess with support weapon strats, but the Katyusha and the Walking Stuka already do that and come much earlier than the P. Werfer. And if someone did go Werfer, it sets the player back in armour.

I don't think it would be game-breaking if it came earlier in its current form given how close it needs to be to be effective. In its current form, why not save up for units that can actually break the line and do more that are available in the same tier? It would also fix the voice line for BP 2

If it remains in T4, however, I would want to see an AOE boost in the lessening of its damage drop-off in addition to a slightly lower cooldown. So even if some rockets miss, you'd still be able to significant health damage to troops in the target zone from the AOE rather than relying on pure wipes to get something out of it.

pwerfer is so ass

And again noone takes maps into account here. On smaller maps with a lot of vision breakers the Panzerwerfer is very useful if you want some indirect. Ofc, if you are playing more open maps and feel the urge to get close to your target, I trust some of you to actually drive forward, shoot and lose the unit flatout.

The only map pwerfer is usable on is langres

Yea, it needs some luv.

IMO it's not fair buffing ost units that need luv (light vehicles, pwerfer, sturmpanzer) without nerfing sniper, turbomortar, and mayybbeee even grens.

I'm afraid I don't quite understand what you mean?

Edit, sorry you mean countering the LefH I assume. Sure I guess, but only infantry companie offmap is guarantued to kill it. Armour is utterly random and airbornes not going to work; nor is mech (?), rifle (Phos) or recon (?) I believe.

Vet 3 Major will always kill it too. Getting it to Vet 3 isn't hard. And Yes, I have vetted my major before to counter the LEFH.

IMO it's not fair buffing ost units that need luv (light vehicles, pwerfer, sturmpanzer) without nerfing sniper, turbomortar, and mayybbeee even grens

Sniper will be fine with target tables, Mortar is fine would rather the Soviet Mortar be brought up to par, and what the fuck is wrong with Grens of all things?

Sniper will be fine with target tables, Mortar is fine would rather the Soviet Mortar be brought up to par, and what the fuck is wrong with Grens of all things?

Didn't know about target tables, mortar is over performing for cost, grens are over performing for cost with upgrades.

I don't want to de-rail this thread, I'm just scared of even more power creep.

ive been playing coh1 and coh2 for a very long time yet i dont know what target tables are. someone explain

ive been playing coh1 and coh2 for a very long time yet i dont know what target tables are. someone explain

Basically until now every weapon had fixed damage, penetration and accuracy, regardless of what it was shooting at. Relic relied on armour, hit points and target size, and a single set of equations. It is a nice and streamlined system.

A "target table" is adding the ability to tweak these values (and others like supression related vars etc.) based on what the weapon is shooting at.

Until now a conscript squad only ever dealt 8 damage per shot to anything it penetrated. With target tables you can make them do 40 damage per shot to Panzerfusiliers but keep normal damage against anything else (for no reason but for lulz).

The best example where this will be useful is the PTRS. Since it got buffed accuracy to be able to hit infantry every once in a while (so Guards don't suck), now it cannot ever miss even the lightest of vehicles (because they have much larger target size than infantry). They will also be able to make the PTRS inflict less damage to infantry than armour (IIRC they already did this, 27 base dmg + 13 bonus versus armour but I think that was a hack, and now they are making it into a full feature).

If used sparingly, target tables will allow adding many little balance tweaks. Just an example, if they want to they could now change the Stuka divebomb against ML20 to leave it at 10% hit points, but keep its effectiveness against other targets. Or they could make the Zis get bonus versus the Jagdpanther. Or the t34/76 ram could inflict more damage to kingtigers. Etc.

In CoH1 target tables were the only way to tweak a weapon, it was used to a ridiculous degree. Every single weapon in the game had to have values against every single tank in the game. I expect they will not be going down this route, but simply add the possibility to change damage or accuracy here and there. You couldn't just increase the "damage" of a cannon; you had to go through its target tables and increase the damage for every enemy armour. Adding an armour type (ex. vehicle) meant having to go through every single weapon in the game and adding a target table for that new armour type. Adding a weapon meant populating it with target tables against every single goddamn armour type already in the game.

ive been playing coh1 and coh2 for a very long time yet i dont know what target tables are. someone explain

Target Tables are basically a way to allow you to balance things by making it so what happens when you shoot depends on what your shooting at. Examples: All small arms always hit vehicles, PTRS's do 27 damage to infantry and 40 to vehicles.

Didn't know about target tables, mortar is over performing for cost, grens are over performing for cost with upgrades.

I don't want to de-rail this thread, I'm just scared of even more power creep.

Target Tables were announced a couple weeks ago. Ost Mortar is fine, Soviet Mortar is crap. There is nothing wrong with Grens or the MG 42 they have.

From a 1v1 perspective:

The main issue I had with the panzerwerfer was that it came too late. People have made points that T4 is only bought for panther 90-95% of the time; that is true.

Let's say that in a 1v1, an Ostheer player is on the backfoot to the Soviet player. Ostheer only has a fuel pt. muni, vp, and a few other strategic points. He's down on the fuel.
He's got a couple of MGs, 3-4 grens, a mortar, and two PaK guns because the Ostheer player is worried about an IS-2 coming in.

All of a sudden, a katyusha barrage comes raining in and the Ostheer player's strategy is, more or less, fucked.

If The situation were reversed, say, the Soviet player is on his/her backfoot, there is no fast panzerwefer that the Ostheer player has access to. Sure, there's a mortar, maybe an Lefh, but that was shit.


This new patch changes that dynamic, though. I'm not sure how the Panzerwerfer fits in relative to the soviets.

The Americans are just fucked for late game indirect fire. There's no denying that, really.

The audio cue for t3 unlocking does mention rocket artillery; that's been there since the beta for CoH2 back in 2013 when they moved the panzerwerfer to T4.

Target tables are essentially "exception rules". Do XYZ to ABC except blah blah blah.

Simple but very powerful and useful in this scenario.

Panzerwerfer OP pls nerf

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qePyJawDzTw

Panzerwerfer OP pls nerf

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qePyJawDzTw

Vet 3 Major will always kill it too. Getting it to Vet 3 isn't hard. And Yes, I have vetted my major before to counter the LEFH.

What's the range on the Vet 3 Major Artillery?

Just give Panzerwerfer flame rocket like vCOH Nebel and all is well.

pls no axes already opee and we dont need another arty to join the war.