Issues with OKW

OKW T0 covers everything, though. When you include call-in infantry/MG34 the faction has very flexible/skipable teching.

You can't skip teching, you need T1 or T2. You can't just skip to Flak.

You can't skip teching, you need T1 or T2. You can't just skip to Flak.

When I say skip I mean only building two trucks (mech/BHQ and Flak)

Although it's possible to not go Flak though. (Just really hard.)

When I say skip I mean only building two trucks (mech/BHQ and Flak)

Although it's possible to not go Flak though. (Just really hard.)

OKW isn't designed to require all 3. They can if they want to, or if they want a Tiger II. But by design, you take one building for your early-mid and then you take your Flak for your mid-late.

i dont think there is a problem with the fuel conversion especially considering the significant hit to munitions i think that even with fuel conversion OKW are still on the back fot in terms of fuel which balances the heavy tanks, especially against the Americans if they get an early game advantage and take the fuel it makes it difficult foe OKW

Why don't you play OKW alittle, then tell me how they need to lose fuel conversion and have more expensive HQs. It very much seems like an Allied biased perspective. Also, "buying all officers, like how it's supposed to be played" is blatantly false. USF are supposed to be able to skip tiers and still be effective. A major part of the meta has been to skip lieutenant. USF are actually more effective at skipping a tier than Wehrmacht and Soviets, and arguably the OKW as well.

Wow the amount of backlash is mind boggling. I sincerely apologize lmao. I mean I knew I had it coming, that's why I put that bold text at the end. Didn't help tho apparently. I should've known OKW is a sensitive subject.

But anyways, you guys are drifting away from what I'm trying to get across. I said remove fuel/munitions conversions and increase HQ techs and then I provided reasons for them. The reasons may or may not be the best of reasons, but it still doesn't change the fact that there is something wrong with OKWs ability to convert.

It's like Close Air Support. The whole concept of converting resources to other resources in my opinion is just completely wrong and adds in many issues into the game. I even dislike the concept of Opel Blitz and Caches. Feautures like these things slightly weaken the concept of map control. If you don't have the fuel points but you have munitions, why on earth should you be able to convert the munitions to fuel to make up for the lack of territories. These things play with the very basics and core of the game.

Hmm... let us not forget that TAMPERING WITH RESOURCES RUINS THE GAME.
a) Close Air Support/Ostruppen Doctrine Fuel to Munitions Conversion --> Call-in spam + mines/shrek spam
b) Lend Lease --> M4C Sherman spam
c) Luftwaffe Supply --> Exploit fuel secured maps like Ettelbruck, Lienne Forest, old Semoskiy, etc.
d) Opel Blitz/Cache --> Compound munitions/fuel problem in 4v4s
e) Soviet unreleased No Step Back doctrine --> Ridiculous early game
f) Windustry --> 5 minute T70s, 7 minute T34s

Can I end my statement with a STOP TAMPERING WITH THE RESOURCES DAMMIT!!! IT IS NEVER A GOOD IDEA

Do you know why everyone thinks you are wrong? because you are wrong
and there is no shame in being wrong, but insisting on being wrong is wrong
That's your opinion, but it's dead wrong

Not sure why you think those abilities are ruining the game as they have existed since ages ago.
Well last time I played against you I only picked my commander (CAS) at 14 CP to drop a stuka dive bomb on ur stuff and you called me no skill/pro planes etc.
Your favorite faction (USF) also has abilities many think they are ruining the game, but are they ruining the game?!!

Comparing OKW conversion to CAS doesn't make sense because OKW conversion works at such a low efficiency. CAS conversion was a problem because it traded fuel for munitions at a very favorable 1:3 rate. This meant that for giving up not really that much fuel you could spam strafes/Shrecks/LMGs/whatever non-stop and there are many, many examples of people doing this at all levels of the game.

OKW conversion has its uses but it just isn't as powerful as that. For fuel - > munitions, it's two munitions for every 1 fuel. Passing over the fact it's not instant, that means that 50 fuel only gets you 100 ammo, which is worse even than the nerfed resource transfer CAS now uses.

The other conversion ability at 4:1 gives you enough fuel to get a Luchs if you spend 200 ammo on it.

I really don't see how these unfavorable rates allow you to undermine the effects of poor map control, but if shown a replay demonstrating otherwise, I'll gladly concede the point.

OKW's not designed to require all 3 trucks. It's not bad design, it's intentional.

lol yes its bad design if all people build is T0 and T4.

Same with USF.

lol yes its bad design if all people build is T0 and T4.

T0 is HQ and T4 doesn't exist!

But really, that's what OKW's designed for, they're supposed to be limited. They're limited in fuel, munitions, and tech. You can't restructure OKW's tech without taking away their freedom, if someone wants a forward base they can go for T1, if they want a Puma they can go T2.

Whether or not USF need restructured is a different topic.

First of all I want to say that I can clearly understand why Northweapon is calling these points that should be adjusted.

Personally I only use conversion to fuel in like 1/100 games. Conversion to ammo is something different, since the conversion is 10x better.

I wouldn't remove the conversion ability, simpely the reason for what will you give them back? In my opinion you should only convert is when you got too much of 1 resource (lets say 300+).

About the increased cost for the HQ's I can live with it if it's for the mechanized. I've had so many games with a 4:25-5:30 Puma, which is in my opinion too OP. I keep in mind the decreased fuel income, but I personally don't really feel that much of a penalty.

Surely you can't just lose some tanks, without feeling it, since I always get a hard blow if I lose any tank at any period of the game.

How about repleacing fuel --> muni with buildable muni caches?

T0 is HQ and T4 doesn't exist!

But really, that's what OKW's designed for, they're supposed to be limited. They're limited in fuel, munitions, and tech. You can't restructure OKW's tech without taking away their freedom, if someone wants a forward base they can go for T1, if they want a Puma they can go T2.

Whether or not USF need restructured is a different topic.

My bad, i meant T3, you know what I meant.

And no, who said anything about restructuring their tech?

When I say they are badly designed, look at the way they play, almost every game is a fucking infantry spam fest. Same with USF, horrible faction design.

In fact, most of the OKW commanders promotes fucking infantry spam and blobbing (fusiliers doc espically). It's almost as if the faction is designed for infantry spamming every game.

As an example here are the strategies avaiable to them:

Infantry spam --> more infantry --> tanks to win.
Infantry spam --> blob infantry with shit AT --> tanks to win.
Kubel --> infantry spam --> tanks to win.

Most of the other options / weapons provided in T1-T2 are so bad, they arn't even used most of the time.

On another example, OKW is the only faction that is the most likely to float manpower out of all the other factions (due to shit fuel and muni income to balance out the mp). So in essense you usually have leftover manpower in comparison to your shit fuel income. WHAT IS THE MOST RELIABLE WAY TO SPEND IT?

Spam infantry. Human wave = more capping after winning engagements. GG.

For a mainly manpower based faction, their manpower choices are complete shit. As I said, they are badly designed.

Plain and simple.

My bad, i meant T3, you know what I meant.

And no, who said anything about restructuring their tech?

When I say they are badly designed, look at the way they play, almost every game is a fucking infantry spam fest. Same with USF, horrible faction design.

In fact, most of the OKW commanders promotes fucking infantry spam and blobbing (fusiliers doc espically). It's almost as if the faction is designed for infantry spamming every game.

As an example here are the strategies avaiable to them:

Infantry spam --> more infantry --> tanks to win.
Infantry spam --> blob infantry with shit AT --> tanks to win.
Kubel --> infantry spam --> tanks to win.

Most of the other options / weapons provided in T1-T2 are so bad, they arn't even used most of the time.

On another example, OKW is the only faction that is the most likely to float manpower out of all the other factions (due to shit fuel and muni income to balance out the mp). So in essense you usually have leftover manpower in comparison to your shit fuel income. WHAT IS THE MOST RELIABLE WAY TO SPEND IT?

Spam infantry. Human wave = more capping after winning engagements. GG.

For a mainly manpower based faction, their manpower choices are complete shit. As I said, they are badly designed.

Plain and simple.

What? There is nothing in OKW T1 or T2 that isn't great.
IeG gun is amazing.
IR HT is a maphack.
Jagdpanzer is an efficient tank destroyer at Vet 0 and hardcounters a horde of Allied armor by itself at Vet 5.

Flak HT creams infantry, and it's the weakest thing in T2.
Puma hardcounters all light vehicles, can easily kill mediums if you're paying attention, and does just fine against infantry if at Vet 2 or higher- and it vets quite easily.
Stuka Zu Fuss- best arty in the game bar none.

OP- The conversions are one of those things that are OP in some circumstances, and totally useless in others. I'd say they balance out overall.

What? There is nothing in OKW T1 or T2 that isn't great.
IeG gun is amazing.
IR HT is a maphack.
Jagdpanzer is an efficient tank destroyer at Vet 0 and hardcounters a horde of Allied armor by itself at Vet 5.

Flak HT creams infantry, and it's the weakest thing in T2.
Puma hardcounters all light vehicles, can easily kill mediums if you're paying attention, and does just fine against infantry if at Vet 2 or higher- and it vets quite easily.
Stuka Zu Fuss- best arty in the game bar none.

OP- The conversions are one of those things that are OP in some circumstances, and totally useless in others. I'd say they balance out overall.

IeG gun is amazing = lol, no
IR HT is a maphack = yea... thank god it can fight
Jagdpanzer = lol, you could do the same with racketten costing less
Flak HT creams infantry = lol, so 45 fuel for something that isn't even a light tank?
puma = about the only thing thats good in their base tiers
Stuka = sacrifice for a tank... lol, although it is good if opponent is stupid.

Out of all of those units, only Puma and stuka seem reasonable, and thats only sometimes.
Compare that with T3 units: Panther, Panzer, Ubertroopers.