Pershing ?
5 Jul 2015, 21:11 PM
#181
Posts: 738
Oh the Irony in posters that lobbied so hard to nerf blitz in the KT/Tiger but are apparently just fine with a superglue heavy tank.
5 Jul 2015, 21:28 PM
#182
Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2
Oh the Irony in posters that lobbied so hard to nerf blitz in the KT/Tiger but are apparently just fine with a superglue heavy tank.
Who is fine with super glue here? It was not even mentioned. Just crew, not super glue - I see big differnece here.
5 Jul 2015, 22:06 PM
#183
Posts: 4928
Who is fine with super glue here? It was not even mentioned. Just crew, not super glue - I see big differnece here.
Superglue is a key part of having a crew though? Pop-out, fix engine, pop-in, all in 3-4 seconds.
Imagine Pershings doing this constantly, you can never crit a Pershing because the second you take eyes off it, the crit is gone.
And for the record, I don't like Blitz-retreat or Superglue. Blitz should not be allowed to activate in Combat, and Superglue should take at least 10 seconds.
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> Kriegsbeute Doctrine|Partisan Rework|British Infantry Rework|Soviet Assault Squad <
5 Jul 2015, 22:10 PM
#184
Posts: 2280 | Subs: 2
Permanently Bannedlol 10 seconds
NO
NO
There is no recording in all WW2 history of a piat actually knocking off a vehicle. Yes, it was THAT bad.
5 Jul 2015, 22:22 PM
#185
Posts: 4928
lol 10 seconds
NO
I'm sorry, is repairing any critical in 10 seconds not fast enough for you? Nobody else can do that. The closest you have to that is Elite Armour's Critical Repair, but is more expensive, takes much longer, and triggers an abandon critical if the vehicle takes damage.
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5 Jul 2015, 22:22 PM
#186
Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2
Superglue is a key part of having a crew though? Pop-out, fix engine, pop-in, all in 3-4 seconds.
Imagine Pershings doing this constantly, you can never crit a Pershing because the second you take eyes off it, the crit is gone.
And for the record, I don't like Blitz-retreat or Superglue. Blitz should not be allowed to activate in Combat, and Superglue should take at least 10 seconds.
Again, why you consider crew as super glue? For me it's just extra rapirs squad in safe sector.
And we can all agree that Pershing should not let crew get out so why you bring this?
5 Jul 2015, 22:27 PM
#187
Posts: 4928
Again, why you consider crew as super glue? For me it's just extra rapirs squad in safe sector.
Because that's what they do, they have an ability to instantly repair critical damage for low cost. You can do it in 3 seconds, 1 second to exit, 1 second to click repair, 1 second to enter.
And we can all agree that Pershing should not let crew get out so why you bring this?
Because any vehicle crew can still insta-repair critical damage. At least Assault Engineers are expensive, and Rear Echelon combat ineffective. Say the Pershing gets engine damage, pull it back, have the Jackson crew jump out and start repairing. If they get attacked, the Jackson crew hops back in their vehicle while the Pershing returns fire. Crews were not designed to work with Heavy Tanks.
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> Kriegsbeute Doctrine|Partisan Rework|British Infantry Rework|Soviet Assault Squad <
5 Jul 2015, 22:30 PM
#188
Posts: 2280 | Subs: 2
Permanently Banned
I'm sorry, is repairing any critical in 10 seconds not fast enough for you? Nobody else can do that. The closest you have to that is Elite Armour's Critical Repair, but is more expensive, takes much longer, and triggers an abandon critical if the vehicle takes damage.
once you reach 75% ur crit is gone
That is enough of a nerf to crit repair
Why are you debating this? A competent usf player would just use another crew to repair a pershing crit. On top of this, relic has never released a commander that negates/disables a faction feature.
Pls count for 10 seconds, realize that a sturmpio will out repair you 9 times outa 10.
There is no recording in all WW2 history of a piat actually knocking off a vehicle. Yes, it was THAT bad.
5 Jul 2015, 22:45 PM
#189
Posts: 4928
Why are you debating this? A competent usf player would just use another crew to repair a pershing crit. On top of this, relic has never released a commander that negates/disables a faction feature.
And now you understand why I'm for disabling vehicle crews while using Pershing Doctrine.
Relic also haven't designed an army to compensate for the lack of a particular piece, and then added that piece back anyway.
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> Kriegsbeute Doctrine|Partisan Rework|British Infantry Rework|Soviet Assault Squad <
5 Jul 2015, 22:50 PM
#190
Posts: 255
Be that as it may, a Pershing, if implemented like a rough Tiger analogue would be a craptastic idea in balance terms that OH would not be able to cope with.
Wowowow, I'm surprised no one caught this.
You mean with superior AT guns than USF, superior handheld AT weaponry, easier access to GOOD AT mines, Stuka CAS on Par with P47 but cheaper, Pak 43.
LOL COME ON DUDE
5 Jul 2015, 22:54 PM
#191
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
I'm sorry, is repairing any critical in 10 seconds not fast enough for you? Nobody else can do that. The closest you have to that is Elite Armour's Critical Repair, but is more expensive, takes much longer, and triggers an abandon critical if the vehicle takes damage.
I suppose "different armies have different advantages and disadvantages" will fall on deaf ear with you?
And in regards to your next post, I don't see ost having LMG and shreck upgrades being disabled when you pick CAS or other muni convertion doctrine, or OKW having vet 5 disabled after picking specific doctrine.
Why do you believe picking doctrine should disable stock core mechanic of a faction?
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
5 Jul 2015, 23:09 PM
#192
Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2
Because that's what they do, they have an ability to instantly repair critical damage for low cost. You can do it in 3 seconds, 1 second to exit, 1 second to click repair, 1 second to enter.
Because any vehicle crew can still insta-repair critical damage. At least Assault Engineers are expensive, and Rear Echelon combat ineffective. Say the Pershing gets engine damage, pull it back, have the Jackson crew jump out and start repairing. If they get attacked, the Jackson crew hops back in their vehicle while the Pershing returns fire. Crews were not designed to work with Heavy Tanks.
Well, I dont see anything wrond with other crews jumping out. It's just a way to get repairs with same speed as OKW.
5 Jul 2015, 23:26 PM
#193
Posts: 4928
Why do you believe picking doctrine should disable stock core mechanic of a faction?
Because they were designed without that doctrine in mind, and designed with elements to compensate. Adding that doctrine and keeping the compensation would mean they get to have their cake and eat it too.
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> Kriegsbeute Doctrine|Partisan Rework|British Infantry Rework|Soviet Assault Squad <
5 Jul 2015, 23:26 PM
#194
8 Posts: 2470
given all the repair that OKW has i don't see any issue with USF having vehicles crews with the pershing. the only people shafted here are OKH/USSR which isn't news to anyone. the pershing itself shouldn't have a crew because otherwise it makes it too easy to stack pershings (even if you can't while the crew is alive) but other than that i don't see any issue with USF having crews at the same time.
there is no point in having cake if you can't eat it too. also, precedent says that doctrines never subtract from a faction, only add things. sometimes those things are OP, sometimes they're UP.
Because they were designed without that doctrine in mind, and designed with elements to compensate. Adding that doctrine and keeping the compensation would mean they get to have their cake and eat it too.
there is no point in having cake if you can't eat it too. also, precedent says that doctrines never subtract from a faction, only add things. sometimes those things are OP, sometimes they're UP.
5 Jul 2015, 23:35 PM
#195
Posts: 1891
USF tanks and vehicles are designed to be used insanely aggressively. Hence super glue
The Fascisti Will Pay.
5 Jul 2015, 23:47 PM
#196
Posts: 4928
there is no point in having cake if you can't eat it too
That's not how the saying works. You can have your cake, or you can eat it. If you eat it, you no longer have cake. Ergo, you cannot have your cake and eat it too. What that means in layman is you can't have the best of both, it's one or the other.
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> Kriegsbeute Doctrine|Partisan Rework|British Infantry Rework|Soviet Assault Squad <
5 Jul 2015, 23:54 PM
#197
Posts: 2561
Come next patch the effect of heavy tanks is going to be limited enough that no one will care about the Pershing.
The only limitation for it that is needed will be that it will be limited to one for the entire game. Otherwise players would be able to decrew to get around the heavy limit.
The only limitation for it that is needed will be that it will be limited to one for the entire game. Otherwise players would be able to decrew to get around the heavy limit.
5 Jul 2015, 23:55 PM
#198
8 Posts: 2470
you often can have the best of both worlds though, you just need enough money
6 Jul 2015, 00:09 AM
#199
Posts: 2053
I would think its possible to code it so that an abandoned vehicle is still tied to the heavy tank limit.
Still would prefer Jumbos...
Still would prefer Jumbos...
6 Jul 2015, 00:14 AM
#200
1 Posts: 3052 | Subs: 15
Why are you guys acting like the Pershing will be an American KT?
It'll simply be an American Panther, but slow,and likely less armor than a panther. Which will be unique and balanced.
No doubt. Relic isn't THAT stupid,are they?
Even if Pershing turns out to be a true heavy,it's not like axis is limited in At Options. The only reason the IS2 is a problem is the ridiculous front armor it hAs,and the fact that you can abuse the fact that you don't have to tech by spamming them. Which was sort of fixed this patch.
They will also likely have a "heavy tank crew" similar to M20 crew, and will simply prevent you from building another until that crew is dead so no popcap abuse.
And assuming you'll have to tech for callins by the time Pershing is released, I doubt you'll be seeing giant fleets of jacksons and Pershing rectifying everything, because tech costs are OP. You'll likely need all 3 officers for it.
It also will still lose to JTKT+ JP4,or elefant + anything with a 75mm gun, no matter HOW op it manages to be.
It'll simply be an American Panther, but slow,and likely less armor than a panther. Which will be unique and balanced.
No doubt. Relic isn't THAT stupid,are they?
Even if Pershing turns out to be a true heavy,it's not like axis is limited in At Options. The only reason the IS2 is a problem is the ridiculous front armor it hAs,and the fact that you can abuse the fact that you don't have to tech by spamming them. Which was sort of fixed this patch.
They will also likely have a "heavy tank crew" similar to M20 crew, and will simply prevent you from building another until that crew is dead so no popcap abuse.
And assuming you'll have to tech for callins by the time Pershing is released, I doubt you'll be seeing giant fleets of jacksons and Pershing rectifying everything, because tech costs are OP. You'll likely need all 3 officers for it.
It also will still lose to JTKT+ JP4,or elefant + anything with a 75mm gun, no matter HOW op it manages to be.
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