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russian armor

Opinion Poll: Least Useful Unit

19 Apr 2015, 17:36 PM
#41
avatar of Brachiaraidos

Posts: 627

jump backJump back to quoted post19 Apr 2015, 17:21 PMMortar
Its hard for me to give any infantry a "least useful" status. Even the crappiest infantry is indispensable for capping territory



Partisans can't do that :foreveralone:

(Or can they? That may have been patched. I think it may have been? At the very least, for a long time they couldn't.)
19 Apr 2015, 17:47 PM
#42
avatar of VenstreDjevel

Posts: 55

fallschirmjager/for their cost with the current lack of formation they don't survive a grenade, sure if you are watching them at the time you can dodge it but due to the timing of them you will have a lot of units to watch so its just throwing away mp.
Puma isnt currently at its god like status thus never used since its better to go jpz or panther. Too weak and with the ptrs craze just a dead vehicle driving.
PIVj never seen it used of late, OKW has good end game tanks so okw commanders need to have more ai focus to be used.
M5A1 Stuart its got a gimmick the opposite of the greyhound but often dies to quickly to use it often enough, I would be open to giving it the canister shot if there was a button for change formation. America doesn't have the pop cap for mediocre tanks and the only tank its gonna critically damage is an unsupported one which for germans now is a dead tank anyway.
19 Apr 2015, 18:09 PM
#43
avatar of kamk
Donator 11

Posts: 764


.....
We have different opinions on both the werfer and partisans, then. I'd very much coin them as being the other way around in terms of usefulness, but that is, in the end, just my opinion.

Regardless. A little less biased? I left off the panzerwerfer and now it's a completely biased poll? Good to know.

Where do you read "completely biased"?

The point from Butcher, me, and others, being: if you create a poll, which already reflects your own view partly, and leaves out units based on your opinion, then it's biased.
Wouldn't you agree, you kinda already push your poll into a certain direction if you leave out units on purpose?



Anyways, was just food for thought, and we kinda end up argueing here way too much. :D
19 Apr 2015, 18:11 PM
#44
avatar of Brachiaraidos

Posts: 627

jump backJump back to quoted post19 Apr 2015, 18:09 PMkamk

Where do you read "completely biased"?

The point from Butcher, me, and others, being: if you create a poll, which already reflects your own view partly, and leaves out units based on your opinion, then it's biased.
Wouldn't you agree, you kinda already push your poll into a certain direction if you leave out units on purpose?


Only no?

As I've said. I created a poll listing just the units I see complained about on the forums as being completely useless, I disagree with a few on the list. The werfer was an oversight because I've not seen much about it on the forums for some time. Regardless of my opinion on it.

I can hardly put up a poll with every unit in the game, can I?
19 Apr 2015, 18:19 PM
#45
avatar of Kothre

Posts: 431

Oh my, this was a hard choice. I feel like irregulars or partisans could be the best (or worst, for that matter) choice, but I disqualified them in my vote since I never use doctrines with them, anyway. I was going to pick the SU-76, but it at least isn't so bad stat-wise if it came out way earlier. It's just bad for the price and tier it's in.

Now for my vote: rear echelon troops. They are useless. I barely even know why they're in the game at all. They suck at combat without munitions-expensive upgrades that are better used on riflemen, volley fire barely works and is costly, they can't build mines, they can't build sandbags, and they aren't needed for repairs. The only use I can think of them is fodder to throw inside captured vehicles, or if you're so far ahead and have 500 munitions, just go ahead and give them BARs.

Also, Ostruppen are actually good.
19 Apr 2015, 18:50 PM
#46
avatar of Highfiveeeee

Posts: 1740



LeFH has room for improvement just like the ML-20 but it is beast mode in Counterbattery mode.



True words, my friend.
LeFH is not very good with usual barrages but once it hits Vet 1 you can be very sure that the enemy won't have it's indirect fire units for a long time.
19 Apr 2015, 18:58 PM
#47
avatar of JHeartless

Posts: 1637

Stuart and WC51 need to be listed.

WC51 is too slow for its nerfed HPs/Armor currently. I use Mechanized to break the Meta and I cant get it to work. People that say otherwise dont use it. Just lost one well it tried to derp do the pathing in seconds to two Volks squads without Shreks and it had a Rifle squad shooting with the 50 the whole time.

Its like a gimped Async version of the M3. Its terrrrrrible now.
19 Apr 2015, 20:13 PM
#48
avatar of comm_ash
Patrion 14

Posts: 1194 | Subs: 1

Stuart and WC51 need to be listed.

WC51 is too slow for its nerfed HPs/Armor currently. I use Mechanized to break the Meta and I cant get it to work. People that say otherwise dont use it. Just lost one well it tried to derp do the pathing in seconds to two Volks squads without Shreks and it had a Rifle squad shooting with the 50 the whole time.

Its like a gimped Async version of the M3. Its terrrrrrible now.


I use the WC51 quite a lot, and while it is overnerfed, it is by no means useless. I enjoy using it on large maps with the vet 1 to move reinforcements around at the speed of light (vaux farmlands). In 1v1, it is useful for pushing volks out of cover early and disrupting sturmpio pathing, as well as to chase down kubel and the HQ truck. I think the WC51 would be fine with a slight accel buff and maybe a weapon buff.
19 Apr 2015, 21:03 PM
#49
avatar of Alexzandvar

Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1

The issue here is that each unit preforms shit in it's defined roll, so as far as your poll goes it means nothing because they are all terrible at their designated roll.
19 Apr 2015, 21:16 PM
#50
avatar of JHeartless

Posts: 1637



I use the WC51 quite a lot, and while it is overnerfed, it is by no means useless. I enjoy using it on large maps with the vet 1 to move reinforcements around at the speed of light (vaux farmlands). In 1v1, it is useful for pushing volks out of cover early and disrupting sturmpio pathing, as well as to chase down kubel and the HQ truck. I think the WC51 would be fine with a slight accel buff and maybe a weapon buff.


I dont have an issue with its acceleration. But it turns like a damn SU85. Its fine forward and backward. But if this thing needs to make a turn it pretty much stops and pivots in place.

So for almost the cost of a rifle squad plus a SIGNIFICANT amount of fuel yeah its pretty useless in the grand Scheme of things. The same could be said of the SU76. IT HAS BARRAGE! So therfore not useless. The Stuart has Stun therefore not useless! The Irregulars have an LMG so they must not be useless!

Its really really bad for what you pay vs what you get and the role it plays in its own doctrine. If it cost the same as a Kubel fine thats fair.
19 Apr 2015, 21:19 PM
#51
avatar of Brachiaraidos

Posts: 627

The issue here is that each unit preforms shit in it's defined roll, so as far as your poll goes it means nothing because they are all terrible at their designated roll.


They are indeed all often considered terrible (with the possible exclusion of prOPstruppen). That's why they're on the list.

It's an opinion poll for what the community, as individuals, consider the most terrible.

If your opinion is all of the above for being exactly equally horrible, that's fair enough.
19 Apr 2015, 21:36 PM
#52
avatar of Mr. Someguy

Posts: 4928

Voted Irregulars. Everything on that list has some use if it comes out at the right time and is micro'd well. Irregulars however just have none, they cannot fight, reinforce is more expensive than Conscripts, and their LMG's are statistically worse than their Grenadier/Guards counterparts.


Partisans can spring from buildings and lay traps.
SU-76 is weak, but has 60 range.
DshK is a superior Maxim.
45mm AT gun used well can keep armour at bay.
Rear Echelon are very cheap and can suppress core infantry units, especially with upgrades.
WC-51 Truck can get the jump on Ostheer, or ruin a Kubel start.
Ostruppen are cheap and spammable.
Irregulars are cheap initially, but come with higher reinforce, small squad size, low durability, and poor DPS.
19 Apr 2015, 22:08 PM
#53
avatar of turbotortoise

Posts: 1283 | Subs: 4

what about the latest graduate from the funkwagon skewl of unit design the IRHT? ...

<444>3 stug iii is safe from everyones ire.
19 Apr 2015, 22:12 PM
#54
avatar of Brachiaraidos

Posts: 627

what about the latest graduate from the funkwagon skewl of unit design the IRHT? ...

<444>3 stug iii is safe from everyones ire.


Useless in 1v1, but 2v2 up its low cost of entry can make it useful.

Perfectly happy to buy one for Crossing in the Woods to keep an eye on those pesky Bolshevik movements.
19 Apr 2015, 22:42 PM
#55
avatar of Interloper

Posts: 93

How about the Stuart?
19 Apr 2015, 23:09 PM
#56
avatar of Tobis
Senior Strategist Badge
Donator 11

Posts: 2307 | Subs: 4

I would say Irregulars because they force you into using such a trash commander. Partisans aren't so bad on some maps.

The StugG also deserves to be on this list.
19 Apr 2015, 23:48 PM
#57
avatar of ilGetUSomDay

Posts: 612

For those of you upset there are no axis units on this list (besides ostruppen which I feel should not be on it) be greatfull. This list is not all allies out of pure bias, as it turns out there are a large amount of useless units in their factions.

As axis there are a few potentials that could be on the list, but none of them are utterly garbage like the SU-76 (Sorry RedXWings, you know its true :foreveralone: ). The static artillery, the panzerwerfer, the flame halftrack. All of these units do have their place and actually can accomplish things unlike a bunch of the allies units such as the SU-76, irregulars, ppsh cons (why is it such a downgrade? :facepalm: ) Dshk, Thompson upgraded crews :guyokay: etc.
19 Apr 2015, 23:52 PM
#58
avatar of Vuther
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 3103 | Subs: 1

Thompson upgraded crews

I don't think I ever actually bought that. It's pretty immediately obvious why you ain't gonna use that - the unit would have insta-kill every other infantry unit in CQC in 2 seconds at a minimum to me make even consider that.
20 Apr 2015, 00:13 AM
#59
avatar of ElSlayer

Posts: 1605 | Subs: 1

20 Apr 2015, 00:46 AM
#60
avatar of Appleseed

Posts: 622

no brummbar? my vote goes to brummbar
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