Maybe instead of complete re work of the faction, introduction of manpower penalty (similar to fuel and ammunition) would be enough to balance the faction out? I know in early alpha that was the case and then Relic decided to change this, but maybe reduction was too harsh? Instead of 66% income they should have introduce a 80% (similar to ammunition?)
I kind of like OKW concept. I just think it has been poorly executed. OKW floats manpower anyway.
OKW manpower penalty?
26 Feb 2015, 22:34 PM
#1
Posts: 1439
26 Feb 2015, 22:41 PM
#2
Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1
They float it because they have nothing to spend it on due to the fuel reduction you mentioned in your post. Raise the MP cost on vehicles by a large amount, and reduce the fuel cost. That way you can spend MP but you can still not spam tanks.
Reducing the MP income wouldn't stop the floating, it would just make it so they float slightly less and are gimped early game.
Reducing the MP income wouldn't stop the floating, it would just make it so they float slightly less and are gimped early game.
26 Feb 2015, 22:42 PM
#3
Posts: 4928
The problem is the lack of manpower bleed due to all their units getting ridiculous received accuracy bonuses with veterancy. Even Obers are cheap for what they do.
all you filthy hotchkiss lovers need to l2p #TeamPanzerIII
> Kriegsbeute Doctrine|Partisan Rework|British Infantry Rework|Soviet Assault Squad <
26 Feb 2015, 22:48 PM
#4
Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1
They have the same MP bleed as any other faction, the float really is not an issue till mid game when they have all their infantry units out the door like other factions do. For the rest of the factions in the game that's the time were they starting getting MP drained on reinforcing and making tanks, except OKW is stuck only reinforcing due to the fuel penalty.
26 Feb 2015, 22:56 PM
#5
Posts: 4928
They bleed less because they lose less troops due to them not being shot.
all you filthy hotchkiss lovers need to l2p #TeamPanzerIII
> Kriegsbeute Doctrine|Partisan Rework|British Infantry Rework|Soviet Assault Squad <
26 Feb 2015, 22:56 PM
#6
Posts: 2280 | Subs: 2
Permanently BannedMP penalty?
I dunno...
Change thier vet.
Vet 5 OKW units receive force fields and laser guided armaments
Or, Make multiplayer play like AA. Where OKW vehicles will randomly lose fuel and be abandoned. LEaving them to spend more fuel to get them back
I dunno...
Change thier vet.
Vet 5 OKW units receive force fields and laser guided armaments
Or, Make multiplayer play like AA. Where OKW vehicles will randomly lose fuel and be abandoned. LEaving them to spend more fuel to get them back
There is no recording in all WW2 history of a piat actually knocking off a vehicle. Yes, it was THAT bad.
26 Feb 2015, 22:59 PM
#7
Posts: 1026
To represent the small, manpower constrained nature of the 1944/45 German military, there should be an "existence penalty" of 33%. So when you pick OKW, there's a 1/3 chance you don't get to play the game and there's just nobody in that slot.
26 Feb 2015, 23:12 PM
#8
Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1
They bleed less because they lose less troops due to them not being shot.
This doesn't stop a tank from crushing you, or a howitzer shell from turning you into red mist, or a katyusha rocket filling you with shrapnel. Regardless, OKW simply doesn't have anything to spend MP on other than 1-2 units.
To represent the small, manpower constrained nature of the 1944/45 German military, there should be an "existence penalty" of 33%. So when you pick OKW, there's a 1/3 chance you don't get to play the game and there's just nobody in that slot.
This is already in the game, but for every faction.
26 Feb 2015, 23:18 PM
#9
Posts: 1130
Maybe instead of complete re work of the faction, introduction of manpower penalty (similar to fuel and ammunition) would be enough to balance the faction out? I know in early alpha that was the case and then Relic decided to change this, but maybe reduction was too harsh? Instead of 66% income they should have introduce a 80% (similar to ammunition?)
I kind of like OKW concept. I just think it has been poorly executed. OKW floats manpower anyway.
What is the reason you wish to do this and how do you believe it will make the okw a better faction? Just saying stuff isnt going to work.
horrida flamma bella
27 Feb 2015, 10:12 AM
#10
Posts: 1439
My reason is to let OKW stay the way it is. Elitist army with few but very powerful units on the field. Especially late game. Right now they are able to spam the hell out of infantry. This combined with insane Vet5 bonuses and very powerful units creates a composition that negates any infantry play late game. In one of the recent games I came across Vet5 Flashimjegers (or whatever you spell that) that obliterated my Rifles.
With less manpower you'll get less units which means OKW can keep their veterancy bonuses. Otherwise a serious rework is to be done.
With less manpower you'll get less units which means OKW can keep their veterancy bonuses. Otherwise a serious rework is to be done.
27 Feb 2015, 10:37 AM
#11
Posts: 680
I think op has a good point here. I like the design of the Okw-vehicles from the Kubel to KT. What I dont like is the 4 volks 3 obermeta. Let the vehicles stay as they are, maybe even obers are good and shrecks if the mp are reduced for okw. Its booring to see okwplayers suicide the blobs just to get new ones.
27 Feb 2015, 10:41 AM
#12
4 
Posts: 369
This doesn't stop a tank from crushing you, or a howitzer shell from turning you into red mist, or a katyusha rocket filling you with shrapnel. Regardless, OKW simply doesn't have anything to spend MP on other than 1-2 units.
OKW's fuel income being capped has nothing to do with it. If I play the boring old call-in game with Soviets I won't have any vehicles until 10CPs, yet I'm always starving manpower. If I play OKW, I'm always floating, even though I actually build more vehicles with OKW than with Soviets.
27 Feb 2015, 10:59 AM
#13
Posts: 2396 | Subs: 1
Reduce the amo income to 66% again, make OKW mines cheaper and buff raketen so that in order to counter early tanks and vehicles OKW player will need to combo shrecked volks with raketen and maybe mines if he doesn't start with puma building. There you are.
BeefSurge wrote:
A lot of people have an image of how they want a faction to play, leading to problems. This is why you have people complaining about lack of Soviet bunkers, why T34/76 sucks, why Cons don't scale, Grens don't get normal grenades, Muricans don't get heavy tank, OKW laser weapons and Die Glock Death Bell, etc.
A lot of people have an image of how they want a faction to play, leading to problems. This is why you have people complaining about lack of Soviet bunkers, why T34/76 sucks, why Cons don't scale, Grens don't get normal grenades, Muricans don't get heavy tank, OKW laser weapons and Die Glock Death Bell, etc.
27 Feb 2015, 12:11 PM
#14
Posts: 830 | Subs: 2
Consider that M20 and Shermans bleed them, so NO
OFC NO
OFC NO
I was ranked 1 in 1vs1 with the 4 factions available in 2015.
27 Feb 2015, 12:12 PM
#15
Posts: 621
I think okw tend to float mp cause they dont have fuel caches but Im not a good player so I wouldnt know but one option would be to give their reinforced barbed wire a slight mp cost
27 Feb 2015, 12:34 PM
#16
Posts: 974 | Subs: 2
2 Weapon slots and LMG 34 upgrade for Volks would help alot, i know OKW sucks to play, because you get ripped with it but that would do it more balanced in early and late game vs. those USF OP crap.
27 Feb 2015, 14:39 PM
#18
Posts: 1484
Increase the price for Volks to 240 MP+ or increase reinforcement cost if they vet 3 +. Also, why not just get rid of this vet 5 bullshit all together. What OKW needs an over haul and best way to do it is to give them support weapons and get rid of this call in MG-34 bull. This will help MP float much better.
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27 Feb 2015, 16:04 PM
#19
Posts: 4951 | Subs: 1
My reason is to let OKW stay the way it is. Elitist army with few but very powerful units on the field. Especially late game. Right now they are able to spam the hell out of infantry. This combined with insane Vet5 bonuses and very powerful units creates a composition that negates any infantry play late game. In one of the recent games I came across Vet5 Flashimjegers (or whatever you spell that) that obliterated my Rifles.
With less manpower you'll get less units which means OKW can keep their veterancy bonuses. Otherwise a serious rework is to be done.
Reducing MP income isn't going to make them "elite" it's going to ruin OKW's early game chances even more. OKW's first units are by no standard "elite", Volk's are the worst baseline starting infantry in the game till they reach vet 3.
And MP float would still happen because OKW will still eventually get all their units out, and then stop spending because they have no bloody fuel to spend MP on tanks/vehicles.
If you want OKW to be "elite" with reduced MP income make it so the starting units are "elite" and thus able to handle the immense amount of allied infantry on the field early game.
I think op has a good point here. I like the design of the Okw-vehicles from the Kubel to KT. What I dont like is the 4 volks 3 obermeta. Let the vehicles stay as they are, maybe even obers are good and shrecks if the mp are reduced for okw. Its booring to see okwplayers suicide the blobs just to get new ones.
To bad OKW doesn't have the fuel to make vehicles. So even if you nerf the shit outa OKW infantry they will still be everywere because of the fuel penalty.
Increase the price for Volks to 240 MP+ or increase reinforcement cost if they vet 3 +. Also, why not just get rid of this vet 5 bullshit all together. What OKW needs an over haul and best way to do it is to give them support weapons and get rid of this call in MG-34 bull. This will help MP float much better.
Why the hell should they cost more than Allied basic starting infantry when they are worse in every stat until Vet 3?
27 Feb 2015, 16:07 PM
#20
Posts: 531
OKW just needs 3 levels of vet.
i believe the most broken part of the faction is the -50% accuracy reduction on vet 5 volks
and the fact that volks get a level of veterancy for each panzershreck rocket they hit a tank with (nearl 100% accuracy)
i believe the most broken part of the faction is the -50% accuracy reduction on vet 5 volks
and the fact that volks get a level of veterancy for each panzershreck rocket they hit a tank with (nearl 100% accuracy)
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