(Firstly this isn't a relic hate thread I am just generally curious.)
This is the studio that created the highest rated RTS of all time (vCoH)
And then you look at CoH 2 and it is full of so many frustrating factors/bugs/glitches that have never been fixed (I don't need to list them as we are well aware of them).
So the question is what happened to Relic? Why can they not fix these problems? Did most of the staff change? Are the new staff just a little bit terrible? Was it something to do with Sega taking over instead of THQ?
I mean relic obviously knows about all the problems in COH 2 (I am not taking about balance) so why are they unable to fix them (I am mainly taking about glitches were stuff just doesn't work)? Are they unable because they simply don't know how?
P.S: Coh 2 is still a great game and I play if everyday, it's just that these bugs are holding it back and I cannot understand why relic doesn't fix them
What happened to Relic?
29 Aug 2014, 03:06 AM
#1
Posts: 117
29 Aug 2014, 03:11 AM
#2
Posts: 2561
Well as far as the bugs go, I would guess that it is from the consistant patching of other things like balance. I don't think relic has ever had a game where they have consistently added content and adjusted balance as much as COH2. With more consistent changing of code, bugs are more likely to appear at a higher rate.
To be honest I like it better this way. I can ignore the occasional bug, but larger more structural problems really bug me.
Edit: Pun not intended.
To be honest I like it better this way. I can ignore the occasional bug, but larger more structural problems really bug me.
Edit: Pun not intended.
29 Aug 2014, 03:14 AM
#3
Posts: 1158
CoH 1 was just as bad as CoH 2 with bugs. As a matter of fact, the bugs lived longer back then.
29 Jul 2014, 12:16 PM by siuking666:
T34/76 is NOT a joke on my hands; Maybe on your hands you make it suck shit? but on me, No. I can kill a stug with a little micro, go toe to toe with a Panzer 4. Is it a joke? LOL T34/85 is apparently a very good tank. But no one says it "one hit wipe" or elefant penetration; up to a point i think this little medium tank just have too much health and too much firepower with that fuel cost.
29 Aug 2014, 03:15 AM
#4
Posts: 896
This is a question I was trying to answer about a year ago when the game was released. I have no definite answer, but the original team responsible for Coh1 did not make the current game. The team responsible for it is the same one that made us the "great" Opposing Fronts expansion.
The feeling I get is that the first team was passionate and detail oriented. The current team is just doing their job. With such complex product like coh that's just not going to cut it.
The feeling I get is that the first team was passionate and detail oriented. The current team is just doing their job. With such complex product like coh that's just not going to cut it.
29 Aug 2014, 03:16 AM
#5
Posts: 309
You're making the incorrect assumption that CoH1 was perfect from day 1. Far from it, it had just as many problems if not more, that were addressed at a much slower rate. People really need to take off the rose colored glasses and realise CoH1 isn't the perfect gem they believe it to be.
As for the actual staff changes, the only notable name that is absent to me is Josh Mosqueira who was the lead designer of CoH1, he's now moved on to blizzard and is the project lead for Diablo 3. How instrumental is the lead designer in the development of a game? I honestly have no idea but perhaps his absence is the answer you are looking for, but it would be unfair to the rest of the employees to assume one man was the be all and end all of a project. I'm also pretty sure the turnover rate in the games industry is one of the highest, some employees will stay at a company for 6-12 months and then move on. But people like Quin Duffy have been there for years.
As for the actual staff changes, the only notable name that is absent to me is Josh Mosqueira who was the lead designer of CoH1, he's now moved on to blizzard and is the project lead for Diablo 3. How instrumental is the lead designer in the development of a game? I honestly have no idea but perhaps his absence is the answer you are looking for, but it would be unfair to the rest of the employees to assume one man was the be all and end all of a project. I'm also pretty sure the turnover rate in the games industry is one of the highest, some employees will stay at a company for 6-12 months and then move on. But people like Quin Duffy have been there for years.
29 Aug 2014, 03:22 AM
#6
Posts: 440
CoH1 had problems too but people here should stop deluding themselves; CoH2 has been problem ridden for 1 solid year now and with every patch the overall situation gets worse and worse.
The response delay for instance is absolutely inexcusable in a small-scale tactical RTS game like CoH, optimization is as bad as day 1, mod support was sold-out in favor of a corporate DLC plan, and pathing...
DO NOT get me started on pathing and AI...
The response delay for instance is absolutely inexcusable in a small-scale tactical RTS game like CoH, optimization is as bad as day 1, mod support was sold-out in favor of a corporate DLC plan, and pathing...
DO NOT get me started on pathing and AI...
29 Aug 2014, 03:25 AM
#7
Posts: 309
CoH1 had problems too but people here should stop deluding themselves; CoH2 has been problem ridden for 1 solid year now and with every patch the overall situation gets worse and worse.
aaaaaaaaaaaaand CoH1 was problem ridden for 5+ years? It still has problems. Whats the difference? Dat hyperbole doe
29 Aug 2014, 03:28 AM
#8
Posts: 896
To clarify, Coh1 had some bugs and some poor design elements (like the way stealth functioned for example), but the problem with coh2 is that for every area it moved 1 step forward, it seems it has moved 1 step backward in another area. Examples, fast teching, gimmicky play, blobbing, horrible vehicles pathing. This is not acceptable for a sequel.
29 Aug 2014, 03:42 AM
#9
Posts: 440
aaaaaaaaaaaaand CoH1 was problem ridden for 5+ years? It still has problems. Whats the difference? Dat hyperbole doe
What game-breaking problems were there before they moved to steam? Please enlighten me? Comparing the relatively minor bugs in CoH1 to the massive calamity that is CoH2 is just nuts and anyone who knows anything about both games would agree.
Dat poor argument doe.....
29 Aug 2014, 07:50 AM
#10
Posts: 1221 | Subs: 41
What game-breaking problems were there before they moved to steam? Please enlighten me? Comparing the relatively minor bugs in CoH1 to the massive calamity that is CoH2 is just nuts and anyone who knows anything about both games would agree.
Well, to name a few that were never really fixed, except maybe the first one that kinda got fixed thanks to the move to Steam.
1. Relic Online constantly failing to record games, leading to the endless cries of "drophacker!!!11111" everywhere. Also generally rewarding wins to the very few people who actually were drophacking.
2. Squad split capping
3. Stuck weapon teams after retreat
4. Stuck on retreat, pinned on retreat, etc. Super easy to cause in coh1 with certain abilities.
5. Fun unit bugs like the M10 misfire, puma friendly fire, etc
29 Aug 2014, 07:56 AM
#11
Posts: 1210 | Subs: 1
To be fair. Just about every single person who worked on vcoh, left. They formed Smoking Gun studios or interactive whatever. Right after Vcoh came out. Hence why Opposing Fronts was a mess and Tales of Valor even worse. COH2 despite the god christ awful alpha, the game has turned out remarkably well. Their support has been an incredible improvement over the none existant support of vcoh. The patches are more frequent and there is better communication. Relic recently released the BEST entry in the series after vcoh being the Western Fronts Armies. It has breathed new life into the game for someone who is a series vet and didn't give a toss about the game anymore to be honest. My love for it is rekindled.
29 Aug 2014, 07:57 AM
#12
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
The opening post is so full of rose tinted glasses.
CoH1 wasn't as great, as bugless and as balanced as people make it seem.
What is more, it wasn't even half as frequently patched as CoH2 is, which means they took LESS care of it then they do with coh2.
CoH1 wasn't as great, as bugless and as balanced as people make it seem.
What is more, it wasn't even half as frequently patched as CoH2 is, which means they took LESS care of it then they do with coh2.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
29 Aug 2014, 08:16 AM
#13
1 
Posts: 165
Did you ever thought about that it just looks like CoH2 would be such a mess, because they bring out constant patches?
They deliver a better support for CoH2 to constantly fix issues in Game.
vCoH didn't had that support and through this there had been less patches per month/year. That's the reason many old players think that vCoH hadn't been such a mess ...
Old memories are old! New stuff is new! Raging members are raging!
They deliver a better support for CoH2 to constantly fix issues in Game.
vCoH didn't had that support and through this there had been less patches per month/year. That's the reason many old players think that vCoH hadn't been such a mess ...
Old memories are old! New stuff is new! Raging members are raging!
29 Aug 2014, 08:37 AM
#14
Posts: 589
we are about due for a balance patch any day now..
29 Aug 2014, 08:37 AM
#15
Posts: 37
The opening post is so full of rose tinted glasses.
Please stop copy-pasting that phrase. You keep repeating those words like you knew what they ment. The opening post said "the studio that created the highest rated RTS of all time (vCoH)", which it arguably still is - atleast one of the highest rated.
CoH1 wasn't as great, as bugless and as balanced as people make it seem.
The opening post didn't state it was bugless or anything above. Maybe he's wondering that with all that knowledge, feedback and experience Relic had from CoH1 they couldn't quite break the bank with CoH2. Yes, there was a problem named THQ which surely had an impact, but some of Relics own decisions have felt so illogical that it seemed like they wanted to shoot their own foot on purpose. Nevertheless, it's still too soon to give CoH2 it's final verdict.
...it wasn't even half as frequently patched as CoH2 is...
I don't see the point to compare patching frequency from 8 years ago to this day. It's great that patching is more common and frequent, but it's a shame some use it as an excuse to release unfinished game. And no, I am not referring to CoH2.
Free Palestine - Save Gaza
29 Aug 2014, 08:37 AM
#16
Posts: 262
The opening post is so full of rose tinted glasses.
What is more, it wasn't even half as frequently patched as CoH2 is, which means they took LESS care of it then they do with coh2.
Nope, patching was harder to do back in vCoh days becaus they didn't have Steam. Now it is alot easier to bring patch to the people with Steam than with that horrible downloader that relic or THQ used.
In hoc signo vinces!
29 Aug 2014, 09:36 AM
#17
Posts: 987
OK, let's not compare the support on CoH2 to CoH1. But then let's compare Relic to other game developers. Are they delivering the support you can expect with other games?
OP has a point, CoH1 had something which CoH2 still doesn't have. I haven't worked out what it is exactly but there was some magic in vcoh. The feel of the gameplay, the atmosphere, the strategy options... For its time it was practically flawless.
As someone said, the original dev team left Relic, leaving us with the people who thought Brits were a good idea. Brits were the antithesis of Vcoh and really spoiled the game. It's that development team that we still have today designing CoH2. They don't have the finesse of the original team.
Now CoH2 does get more patches and some new features are great. And I'm hoping they can iron it out because it is potentially better than vcoh.
BUT the OP's main point is good. There are a lot of bugs and game-breaking units and other very serious problems with the game. The Relic team reacts to these incredibly slowly.
OP has a point, CoH1 had something which CoH2 still doesn't have. I haven't worked out what it is exactly but there was some magic in vcoh. The feel of the gameplay, the atmosphere, the strategy options... For its time it was practically flawless.
As someone said, the original dev team left Relic, leaving us with the people who thought Brits were a good idea. Brits were the antithesis of Vcoh and really spoiled the game. It's that development team that we still have today designing CoH2. They don't have the finesse of the original team.
Now CoH2 does get more patches and some new features are great. And I'm hoping they can iron it out because it is potentially better than vcoh.
BUT the OP's main point is good. There are a lot of bugs and game-breaking units and other very serious problems with the game. The Relic team reacts to these incredibly slowly.
Let's keep it constructive
29 Aug 2014, 09:47 AM
#18
Posts: 954
COH2 single campaign is focusing on Ruskie war crime instead of heroism on COH1(I don't care truth or not), that's kinda bull crap when the game named company of HEROES.
First off all. Tripwire so gud, 10 ammo for a whole dead squad ? + sight.
Vehicle capture point can win games, blitzkrieg save a tank. Fair Deal i think
29 Aug 2014, 09:55 AM
#19
Posts: 752
COH2 single campaign is focusing on Ruskie war crime instead of heroism on COH1(I don't care truth or not), that's kinda bull crap when the game named company of HEROES.
*Guy who doesnt appreciate the portrayal of individual heroism of the protagonists in the face of horrible adversity and injustice not only from the enemy, but from their own side as well*
Think you might want to re-examine what you consider to be heroism.
"You are competitive if play to win and make efforts to improve." -Basilone
29 Aug 2014, 09:56 AM
#20
Posts: 2561
Yeah the development team has always been really bad. Late game vs early game design, Tiger Ace, and the entire soviet tech tree. It's a good thing Relic has such a great balance team or this game would have been dead a year ago.
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