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It's time Relic to finish the job with coh!

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30 Jul 2014, 21:54 PM
#121
avatar of GeneralCH

Posts: 419

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Jul 2014, 20:38 PMKiraye


It's not the system that is broken, only the ToV units are, too a certain degree. Also the OF factions are a buggy mess and would be fine with a few tweaks.


Reward units are there to offer a different gameplay. However a different gameplay is altering how the faction works/responds to enemy actions. You need to have this choice ingame, rather than before the game, since you dont know what strategy/doctrine the enemy will choose. Thats why it is broken.
OF factions cannot be fixed, since the balance is not the problem but the design.
31 Jul 2014, 06:18 AM
#122
avatar of Fanatic
Patrion 14

Posts: 480 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post30 Jul 2014, 15:56 PMNoun
I'll pass on the requests (both for updates to the existing game and the HD version).


Well that´s something i guess. Thanks. :-)


But what about the patching process. Is there a chance to include some of the Elite Mod Bug fixes into the game with this (or the next) patch? The solution is there, even the data file. All Smoking Gun would need to do is add the files. It would make a lot of people happy if bugs like the Stag MG oder the M10 miss fire bug would be fixed. :)

Any chance here?
31 Jul 2014, 13:56 PM
#123
avatar of 12ocky

Posts: 508 | Subs: 1



Reward units are there to offer a different gameplay. However a different gameplay is altering how the faction works/responds to enemy actions. You need to have this choice ingame, rather than before the game, since you dont know what strategy/doctrine the enemy will choose. Thats why it is broken.
OF factions cannot be fixed, since the balance is not the problem but the design.


Hmm the way it works now with TOV, it does work okayish. Believe me I prefer not to have such system either, but if that is what it would take for Relic to update COH. Than why say no?

Like most of the current TOV units are in a bad state and need some new redefining.
They need a unique characteristic, while still being the same balancewise.
31 Jul 2014, 15:25 PM
#124
avatar of GeneralCH

Posts: 419

jump backJump back to quoted post31 Jul 2014, 13:56 PM12ocky


Hmm the way it works now with TOV, it does work okayish. Believe me I prefer not to have such system either, but if that is what it would take for Relic to update COH. Than why say no?

Like most of the current TOV units are in a bad state and need some new redefining.
They need a unique characteristic, while still being the same balancewise.


You don´t know what you are talking about. The problem is the idea behind it, which leads to a bad design.
Each unit in each faction has a purpose for a particular strategy or counter. You cannot add or exchange multible units (which are supposed to work different than the units they replace, to be of interest) in a closed system, without severely alter the gameplay and thus the balance.

A vehicle, that replaces a stug, needs to work just like it in order to not change the gameplay. However thats contradicting the idea, that a replacment unit should have a different characteristic.
Gwagon is at first a anti tank unit, but the stug can fight infantry and tanks reliable. However the non doctrinal gameplay of USA involves rifle spam and doctrinal there are 2 anti tank infantry squads, the Gwagon cannot defend itself against.
How you want to fix this? It will end up to be just like the stugIV.
Thats also the process the M18 went through, just its now much better because it does not have a missfire bug and can cloak.
31 Jul 2014, 17:16 PM
#125
avatar of 12ocky

Posts: 508 | Subs: 1

Their counters are still the same: ATG's and M10's.
(Sure the Bazooka and M8 are the exception: works vs the Gwagon frontal armor where it doesn't vs the Stug. However the Gwagon is really good vs the Pershing, while Stugs don't stand a chance against it.)

Sure these 2 are unique, GWagon being a long range tank destroyer, and Stug being a robust assault gun. They both have their own playstyles ... wait a minute hang on.
What's your problem again with the Stug vs Gwagon interaction?


M18 has become a vehicle killer of doom, not so much a tank destroyer. I think that's an area where it can be changed.



31 Jul 2014, 17:46 PM
#126
avatar of capiqua
Senior Mapmaker Badge

Posts: 985 | Subs: 2

I wrote something about this in the official forum when betacoh1.

- Pack of New maps of comunity
- Add BUG FIXES, OBSERVER MODE, GAMEPLAY of Elite mod ASAP.
- BALANCE of Elite mod, the study and supporting evidence of implementation is it would spend more time. But if many people is agree that this is included. Should be included.
- A bit of hype with COH1 Anniversary 22/09/2006 for new steam version. New maps help a lot to get people to buy COH1.

31 Jul 2014, 18:23 PM
#127
avatar of angelfrost

Posts: 49

Cross my fingers to have a present at 29/9/2014!!!

Well this would be a HAPPY 8 years Anniversary for CoH indeed!
31 Jul 2014, 22:54 PM
#128
avatar of ltaustinpowers

Posts: 69 | Subs: 1

i look forward to the future updates in this thread....i would like to see COH to how it was before the steam servers
1 Aug 2014, 09:11 AM
#129
avatar of black and white

Posts: 16

Definitely vcoh HD is the way, i say vcoh and not OF also. Because it will be a new product it will attract new buyers, and the good part is it will be already balanced quite good if you decide to import Elite Mod fix.

So new graphics(SLI support is a must, 2014 wtf, new gun sounds, here coh2 is much better than coh1, new maps, OBSERVER MODE. OPTIONAL: In order to add more depth you could make the flamethrowers droppable, MG42 droppable also after the squad wipe on retreat, and the best feature in COH2 the reverse button, i dont know what the pros would think about vaulting and the True Sight though. And thats it, Ill pay 30 bucks or more instantly.
1 Aug 2014, 13:46 PM
#130
avatar of angelfrost

Posts: 49

Definitely vcoh HD is the way, i say vcoh and not OF also. Because it will be a new product it will attract new buyers, and the good part is it will be already balanced quite good if you decide to import Elite Mod fix.

So new graphics(SLI support is a must, 2014 wtf, new gun sounds, here coh2 is much better than coh1, new maps, OBSERVER MODE. OPTIONAL: In order to add more depth you could make the flamethrowers droppable, MG42 droppable also after the squad wipe on retreat, and the best feature in COH2 the reverse button, i dont know what the pros would think about vaulting and the True Sight though. And thats it, Ill pay 30 bucks or more instantly.


I agree with most of what you saying but not with the OPTIONAL part.
Imagine one squad of grenadiers with panzershreck and flamethrower...it's not infantry anymore(from the aspect of ranged fighting).The mg drop on the retreat it's ok.

I don't want vCoH to be like CoH2 with reverse button, vaulting and True Sight, what it needs is more simple than implement new things in it, is to make as good as possible the characteristics that already has.
Plus more maps, fix balance, fix bugs, fix ranks, lobby and all the other things that most of people here asking. May be observer mode and better graphics say may be because as I have already said to a previous post I think graphics and sound are pretty strong despite the years.

At least that's what I think.
1 Aug 2014, 14:16 PM
#131
avatar of gunther09
Donator 22

Posts: 538

the birthday hype thing is a really nice idea for some PR stuff. Together with some updates........wow, you would probably get quite some magazines spend some lines on that.
1 Aug 2014, 20:29 PM
#132
avatar of black and white

Posts: 16



I agree with most of what you saying but not with the OPTIONAL part.
Imagine one squad of grenadiers with panzershreck and flamethrower...it's not infantry anymore(from the aspect of ranged fighting).The mg drop on the retreat it's ok.

I don't want vCoH to be like CoH2 with reverse button, vaulting and True Sight, what it needs is more simple than implement new things in it, is to make as good as possible the characteristics that already has.
Plus more maps, fix balance, fix bugs, fix ranks, lobby and all the other things that most of people here asking. May be observer mode and better graphics say may be because as I have already said to a previous post I think graphics and sound are pretty strong despite the years.

At least that's what I think.


Whats wrong with the reverse button? What is wrong?
1 Aug 2014, 21:54 PM
#133
avatar of Cyru$

Posts: 83

vaulting it´s a nice feature indeed, but reverse button takes out the vehicle micro, which I personally like it the way it is in coh1. It would be better to enhace the pathing (speacilly with halftracks) than adding reverse button. Also, the capping systems in coh2 could be fine, but being able to cap with at guns and deployed support weapons went too far imo and feels kinda lame.

Angelfrost is spot on imo, it´s not about reworking the game with new mechanics. I think this won´t ever happen, too much programming changes involved and you have coh2 for that. It´s more about improving what we got.
2 Aug 2014, 00:43 AM
#134
avatar of 12ocky

Posts: 508 | Subs: 1

Agreed on the enhanced pathing, there is still some room for improvement there. I guess we could ask Kiraye to implement that in Elite mod after I post my final version. Soon™. (Probably Sunday)
2 Aug 2014, 05:46 AM
#135
avatar of PingPing

Posts: 329

If the pathing from COH2 is any indicator of an "improvement" - I'd be happy with vCOH's pathing as is.
2 Aug 2014, 08:21 AM
#136
avatar of Fanatic
Patrion 14

Posts: 480 | Subs: 1

Some CoH1 vehicles have a excellent pathing (PE Panthers for example) on the other hand some vehicles pathing is just unacceptable (PE HTs).

CoH2 has the edge over CoH 1 in matters of vehicle pathing. There are some small improvements and the pathing is more or less even no matter what vehicle you look at. This equality is a huge improvement.

Still, in my point of view the reverse button means to give up in the face of the pathing problems. They weren't able to find a solution so they bypass the issue by including the reverse button and call this a great new feature.
2 Aug 2014, 08:31 AM
#137
avatar of angelfrost

Posts: 49



Whats wrong with the reverse button? What is wrong?


Enhanced pathing is the Key and not the reverse button, I want the micro of vehicles, I like it, those little things are the ones that define vCoH. Most of the vehicles in the game halftracks, StuH, Stags etc they don't have so good pathing ...sometimes you want to break the monitor(lol) they just doing what they want, you just watching them maneuvering around a spot with no excuse. If they did what you order them to do there is no need of reverse button.
2 Aug 2014, 08:37 AM
#138
avatar of angelfrost

Posts: 49

Some CoH1 vehicles have a excellent pathing (PE Panthers for example) on the other hand some vehicles pathing is just unacceptable (PE HTs).

CoH2 has the edge over CoH 1 in matters of vehicle pathing. There are some small improvements and the pathing is more or less even no matter what vehicle you look at. This equality is a huge improvement.

Still, in my point of view the reverse button means to give up in the face of the pathing problems. They weren't able to find a solution so they bypass the issue by including the reverse button and call this a great new feature.



You are so right!I'm 100% with you.Either way I prefer micro over reverse button.
2 Aug 2014, 20:32 PM
#139
avatar of empirescurropt

Posts: 708 | Subs: 1

well i download the beta version in coh but i dont now if im alowed to broadacast our not so i wont i will put the normal steam version im looking for guys who still play coh and want to do a Mini turment in coh to broadcast in my stream i realy tink that will be fun if they did coh turney realy but coh its dead barly got plp playing they nedd to do someting to kepp it alive maybe sale time by coh2 and get coh free !


could bring more members to coh im the type of guy wen i buy games like colection play 1 game just to now the history soo could be a "good ting to kepp the servers roling a bit" just a idea
3 Aug 2014, 08:08 AM
#140
avatar of Arashenstein

Posts: 250

jump backJump back to quoted post20 Jul 2014, 14:17 PM12ocky
Everybody would like if they kept updating COH.

However, they are letting the game die out in favor of their Western Fronts expansion. They are trying to lure the old vCoh fans to COH 2 with this expansion because it really looks like vCoh a lot more. But yet it's still far from the same.

Chances for a vCoh update are very slim I'm afraid.


i correct you my man, Western front is COH Opposing Front not VCOH, dont forget people who made that AWESOME VCOH were some different team ;) ;) western front is as crappy as opposing fronts and i am really lucky i got it in a give away.
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