You must really like fire...
Hahah, you got me there! Maybe I should make every fire upgrade as part of my base strats.
retreat modifiers
15 May 2014, 14:25 PM
#21
Posts: 710
Hahah, you got me there! Maybe I should make every fire upgrade as part of my base strats.
15 May 2014, 14:43 PM
#22
60 
Posts: 93
Just make retreating units immune to damage so I don't have to use tactics please. 
15 May 2014, 15:07 PM
#23
Posts: 1637
]
Except, there is nothing wrong with it.
If you overextend your infantry, you will loose it.
Retreat was never supposed to be free "out of fail" card where angels descend upon your troops and with that divine intervention allow them to come out unharmed from the avalanche of bullets and flames.
Retreat makes your squads harder to kill for small arms and thats about it. If you've lost squad to anything else on retreat, it means you overextended or were successfully flanked.
ROFLMAO But I want my Angels!
If you did this OP the counter to the effectivness of the KV8 would be simply hitting the retreat button. Then this expensive call in would be useless really. Unless of course they countered it by BUFFING the flame damage to insta whipe levels like it was in the past and I dont think ANYONE wants that. Like SURPRISE KV8 *entire army gone*
The PTRS's are fine as they are. Whenever i'm up against Guard Infantry, I always have to be careful with my vehicles or the Guards will completely destroy them. Good range, good damage and fairly cheap; if anything, the PTRS should nerfed since it's ridiculously good for the price. Even in the hands of Conscripts, the PTRS's are extremely potent.
15 May 2014, 15:36 PM
#24
Posts: 4928
And what in your opinion would the role of the KV8 (or flameht for that matter) be after it's made even more useless compared to normal tank guns?
I don't think I've ever lose a full health squad on retreat by Flame Half-Track. The KV-8 on the other hand though... Funny how the FHT got nerfed and the KV-8 didn't.
all you filthy hotchkiss lovers need to l2p #TeamPanzerIII
> Kriegsbeute Doctrine|Partisan Rework|British Infantry Rework|Soviet Assault Squad <
15 May 2014, 15:49 PM
#25
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
I don't think I've ever lose a full health squad on retreat by Flame Half-Track. The KV-8 on the other hand though... Funny how the FHT got nerfed and the KV-8 didn't.
Then you haven't played the game from release up until march deployment patch.
And do I even need to remind you that KV-8 is exclusively AI heavy tank late game doctrinal call-in and FHT used to be 4 minute non doctrinal reinforce platform with extremely potent upgrade?
By the time KV-8 arrives you should have at least 1 P4, more likely 1 P4 and 1 StuG+pak.
By the time FHT arrived, you were lucky to have guards.
I know you still won't see the reason why FHT was nerfed and KV-8 not, but I don't expect exclusively one faction players to understand that or how balance works at all.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
15 May 2014, 15:54 PM
#26
Posts: 783 | Subs: 3
If you have nothing on your retreat path to kill the scout car/m5/KV8, that is your fault. To say you don't have control over this is incorrect, and as others have said, you overextended.
That idiot thought he won. In fact, he was wrong. Completely mistaken.No M3 he what things are not，just one moron.
The German oil scarcity, rare tanks cannot fight the Allied torrent. Kill the house to kill the German oil.
Every time lose may feel bad. Probably not the word lose your subconscious. Maybe I win you Not for the first time Maybe you you should go to recall,
The German oil scarcity, rare tanks cannot fight the Allied torrent. Kill the house to kill the German oil.
Every time lose may feel bad. Probably not the word lose your subconscious. Maybe I win you Not for the first time Maybe you you should go to recall,
15 May 2014, 16:03 PM
#27
Posts: 503
Permanently BannedLOL!
The retry on this game is a HUGE joke! NEED FOR SPEED mod on!
The soldier's heavy pinned, taking bullets and bombs in the head, you just click RETRY and the GUYS RUN to base easy!!!!
No have more than 10% realism..
The retry on this game is a HUGE joke! NEED FOR SPEED mod on!
The soldier's heavy pinned, taking bullets and bombs in the head, you just click RETRY and the GUYS RUN to base easy!!!!
No have more than 10% realism..
15 May 2014, 17:04 PM
#28
4 
Posts: 4301 | Subs: 2
i think we all are already used to how it is.
when it happens to me, i call bs and when i do it, i laugh
although, when there is a road on the retreat path, it's funny to see smaller vehicles out-running retreating units
when it happens to me, i call bs and when i do it, i laugh
although, when there is a road on the retreat path, it's funny to see smaller vehicles out-running retreating units
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15 May 2014, 17:52 PM
#29
Posts: 987
I agree with OP.
Yes, you should be wary when you're pushing/spreading out. But a high % chance of losing a squad is brutal punishment for capping anywhere past the mid-zone. This greatly reduces motivation to play dynamically and makes for a stale meta-game.
I think if you're capping deep in enemy territory it's punishment enough to have to wait for the unit to run all the way back to base. I don't think either Soviets or Germans should face a high risk of losing a squad for having a dynamic playstyle. Do you remember the FHT lameness? That thing killing all your soviet brothers even when a full squad retreated. It ruined the game totally.
I don't see why players of either army should be punished so much for being adventurous.
You should be wary about were you cap. If you cap a long way from your own HQ then kv-8 is gonna smoke you. I am fine with kv-8s chasing and killing units who cap to deep in to enemy territory.
Yes, you should be wary when you're pushing/spreading out. But a high % chance of losing a squad is brutal punishment for capping anywhere past the mid-zone. This greatly reduces motivation to play dynamically and makes for a stale meta-game.
I think if you're capping deep in enemy territory it's punishment enough to have to wait for the unit to run all the way back to base. I don't think either Soviets or Germans should face a high risk of losing a squad for having a dynamic playstyle. Do you remember the FHT lameness? That thing killing all your soviet brothers even when a full squad retreated. It ruined the game totally.
I don't see why players of either army should be punished so much for being adventurous.
Let's keep it constructive
15 May 2014, 18:06 PM
#30
Posts: 4928
And do I even need to remind you that KV-8 is exclusively AI heavy tank late game doctrinal call-in and FHT used to be 4 minute non doctrinal reinforce platform with extremely potent upgrade?
By the time KV-8 arrives you should have at least 1 P4, more likely 1 P4 and 1 StuG+pak.
By the time FHT arrived, you were lucky to have guards.
Heavy use of ad hominem I see. Both the KV-8 and the FHT have their advantages and disadvantages, but imo the KV-8 is far superior. Before the nerf the FHT good, but not OP, all you had to do was blob 3 Conscripts and it couldn't touch you or it'll get AT 'naded to death. The KV-8 on the other hand does more damage than 3 FHT projectors combined (FHT only has 2), while also being a health tank and armour tank. I'm sure Soviet players would be frusterated if we got a Panther with 3 FHT projectors, but that's pretty close to what the KV-8 is. Honestly, you know a unit is bad when one of the best stratagies for it is to just drive it straight to the enemy's base and force them to pull all their Panzers back to HQ.
Also, ~65% of my games are as Soviets, but please keep up the ad hominem, it makes my argument look better in comparison.
all you filthy hotchkiss lovers need to l2p #TeamPanzerIII
> Kriegsbeute Doctrine|Partisan Rework|British Infantry Rework|Soviet Assault Squad <
15 May 2014, 18:23 PM
#31
Posts: 987
Before the nerf the FHT good, but not OP, all you had to do was blob 3 Conscripts and it couldn't touch you or it'll get AT 'naded to death.
I prefer to play as Germans but I disagree with that part of your post. Neither army should have a unit that forces the other army to blob or die. "All you have to do is put half your army in one place" - One does not simply put half your army in one place and maintain map control. The FHT was severely OP.
The KV-8 on the other hand does more damage than 3 FHT projectors combined (FHT only has 2), while also being a health tank and armour tank. Honestly, you know a unit is bad when one of the best stratagies for it is to just drive it straight to the enemy's base and force them to pull all their Panzers back to HQ.
I agree. It's over the top. As was the FHT which also used to run into people's bases with Benny Hill blaring. I say neither army should have units that can so quickly and unexpectedly destroy whole squads. Especially if they have heavy armour.
Let's keep it constructive
15 May 2014, 18:42 PM
#32
Posts: 231
Just a funny moment I had the other day. Gren saw the KV8 at 15:05, retreated at 15:07 and died at 15:09.
I agree that KV8 should punish heavy T1/T2 play, but giving the German player a one second window to retreat is brutal. Killing squads on retreat should usually only happen when the enemy is between the retreating squad and its base. Just driving forward and chasing a squad that instantly retreats to its death is approaching PE armored car level broken.
15 May 2014, 18:51 PM
#33
Posts: 783 | Subs: 3
Yea ok that shouldn't happen. Don't think that changing the retreat modifiers is the solution, however, as small arms is already very weak vs retreating squads. Changing the max damage on the KV8s flame thrower might be better.
That idiot thought he won. In fact, he was wrong. Completely mistaken.No M3 he what things are not，just one moron.
The German oil scarcity, rare tanks cannot fight the Allied torrent. Kill the house to kill the German oil.
Every time lose may feel bad. Probably not the word lose your subconscious. Maybe I win you Not for the first time Maybe you you should go to recall,
The German oil scarcity, rare tanks cannot fight the Allied torrent. Kill the house to kill the German oil.
Every time lose may feel bad. Probably not the word lose your subconscious. Maybe I win you Not for the first time Maybe you you should go to recall,
15 May 2014, 18:53 PM
#34
7 Posts: 1664
Just a funny moment I had the other day. Gren saw the KV8 at 15:05, retreated at 15:07 and died at 15:09.
I agree that KV8 should punish heavy T1/T2 play, but giving the German player a one second window to retreat is brutal. Killing squads on retreat should usually only happen when the enemy is between the retreating squad and its base. Just driving forward and chasing a squad that instantly retreats to its death is approaching PE armored car level broken.
This seems like a reasonable situation to me. (no sarcasm)
The Grens are unsupported, on the mid vp of Crossing which is always savagely contested( thus an amazing spot to set teller mines and cripple tanks) with the entire unit boxed in to green cover.
In addition you're at the 15:00 minute mark with no tier three or four and two Shocks and your opponent has seven infantry units on the field which I'm gonna throw out a guess are ALL Grens.
Sure, three second wipes suck, but this is a big-picture LTP situation for your opponent more than it is a KV8 OP one. How often does this happen to top 100 players?
15 May 2014, 19:08 PM
#35
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
Heavy use of ad hominem I see.
Not sure if you even know what ad hominem means...
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
15 May 2014, 19:17 PM
#36
Posts: 3552 | Subs: 2
He is Marshall Bruce Mathers cousin, Andrew Homer Mathers right?
Resident Soviet Whiner and Grand Master Bias Jedi; General Secretary of the Soviet Whine Hydra Collective; Axis Hating Sheeple; Allied Butt Buddy! Collect Them All!
Also the African Branch of TAB Bulletins
PS: The Italian Army fought with courage and skill
Also the African Branch of TAB Bulletins
PS: The Italian Army fought with courage and skill
15 May 2014, 19:27 PM
#37
Posts: 4928
Not sure if you even know what ad hominem means...
You spent as much time undermining me as you did focusing on the argument.
all you filthy hotchkiss lovers need to l2p #TeamPanzerIII
> Kriegsbeute Doctrine|Partisan Rework|British Infantry Rework|Soviet Assault Squad <
15 May 2014, 19:32 PM
#38
Posts: 366
Just a funny moment I had the other day. Gren saw the KV8 at 15:05, retreated at 15:07 and died at 15:09.
I agree that KV8 should punish heavy T1/T2 play, but giving the German player a one second window to retreat is brutal. Killing squads on retreat should usually only happen when the enemy is between the retreating squad and its base. Just driving forward and chasing a squad that instantly retreats to its death is approaching PE armored car level broken.
thankyou for posting this.. this is exactly what i meant. that is vet 3 gren squad trying to cap the vp and got insta-torched to death with 0 chance of survival. Some people will say support it properly or you should never wander alone but that is easier said than done.. you cannot blob from point strat point to another..At some moment you will have to spread out and cap the map and this is a prime example of how horrendously powerfull flamers are.
if the gren squad didnt retreat they should get the fate they deserved. but this shouldent happen on retreat
edit** after reading some post again i must say that Im NOT saying KV8 is OP. Im saying, Units on retreat shouldent die easily, espeically veteren infantry either conscripts or shocks or grens. KV8 is a DEDICATED anti infantry tank, It owns infantry well and good BUT it shouldent roast everything on retreat
in some post i read that retreating will become a soft counter to kv8..well isnt it now? and im just advocating a squad surviving a retreat. i have no other problems with units.
We choose our joys and sorrows long before we experience them
15 May 2014, 19:35 PM
#39
Posts: 987
This seems like a reasonable situation to me. (no sarcasm)
The Grens are unsupported, on the mid vp of Crossing which is always savagely contested( thus an amazing spot to set teller mines and cripple tanks) with the entire unit boxed in to green cover.
How often does this happen to top 100 players?
Even if the grens were supported, they would have died anyway. 2 paks wouldn't have stopped that from happening.
What difference do you think it would make to have support there? The KV would've taken some damage and that's all. The grens would still have died. It's far too harsh.
Neither army should have super-rapid-squad-wiping units. It's not reasonable. And even top-100 players lose plenty of squads in this manner.
1 second is not a reasonable amount of time to expect players to react when the punishment for a "slow" 2-second reaction is losing a whole squad.
Let's keep it constructive
15 May 2014, 19:41 PM
#40
Posts: 366
Even if the grens were supported, they would have died anyway. 2 paks wouldn't have stopped that from happening.
What difference do you think it would make to have support there? The KV would've taken some damage and that's all. The grens would still have died. It's far too harsh.
Neither army should have super-rapid-squad-wiping units. It's not reasonable. And even top-100 players lose plenty of squads in this manner.
1 second is not a reasonable amount of time to expect players to react when the punishment for a "slow" 2-second reaction is losing a whole squad.
THIS^^
We choose our joys and sorrows long before we experience them
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