And i told you that sturms can purchase their schreks without needing a tech upgrade and dont tell me other wise because i am watching a OKW replay right now and it doesnt say requires SWS or converted HQ for schreks on sturms and besides in the 2 vs 2 vs 2 UK players whom both bulid double UC's and dive them on a single player you just gonna have to figure that out yourself but in 1 vs 1 noone unless they are a garbage troll noone legitemately buy that many UCs or WC 51s or M3's
I meant T70 guy wants Rak behind a midgame tech. So I asked what Okw can do with 4 UC at the beginning with Sturm & Volk.
RK 43
7 May 2021, 12:58 PM
#101
Posts: 43
7 May 2021, 13:45 PM
#102
Posts: 213
Making the Raketen into a Pak40/6-Pounder Anti-Tank Gun clone would be an OKW buff and nothing else. But i understand that blobbing 2 or 3 Raks can be problematic in teamgames.
From my experience the biggest problem is the reliability of the Raketen. The little shit misses half of its shoots or shoots somewhere in the ground. And the tracking feels shit too.
OKW has the best stock anti-tank power of all factions with the mobile+cheap puma, 60 range JP4 and Panther. Idk why the raketen tries to compete with them while being t0 and trash against light vehicles (or even cheap mediums). I would trade lower penetration/dmg with better reliability/cheaper cost any day of the weak. Something like the soviet m-42.
From my experience the biggest problem is the reliability of the Raketen. The little shit misses half of its shoots or shoots somewhere in the ground. And the tracking feels shit too.
OKW has the best stock anti-tank power of all factions with the mobile+cheap puma, 60 range JP4 and Panther. Idk why the raketen tries to compete with them while being t0 and trash against light vehicles (or even cheap mediums). I would trade lower penetration/dmg with better reliability/cheaper cost any day of the weak. Something like the soviet m-42.
7 May 2021, 13:48 PM
#103
Posts: 1660
And i told you that sturms can purchase their schreks without needing a tech upgrade and dont tell me other wise because i am watching a OKW replay right now and it doesnt say requires SWS or converted HQ for schreks on sturms and besides in the 2 vs 2 vs 2 UK players whom both bulid double UC's and dive them on a single player you just gonna have to figure that out yourself but in 1 vs 1 noone unless they are a garbage troll noone legitemately buy that many UCs or WC 51s or M3's
Sturm Schreck is shit
Try playing as OKW
7 May 2021, 13:48 PM
#104
Posts: 3114 | Subs: 2
I guess it would be situational with allowing faust snare threshold for certain tanks.
I just checked. It indeed makes a difference for tanks with health between 961 and 1120, which is the KV1 (effective health), IS2, ISU, both doctrinal Churchills and the KV2. All assuming the snare bounces. If it penetrates it doesn't make a difference for vehicles with 1040 health which is basically all of them and the window moves to 1041-1200 HP.
I think this could/should be changed to something slightly more useful. It's a bonus that is barely noticable. Every normal player that is not knees deep into stats will assume that +25% damage were a big bonus, while it actually does next to nothing for you.
7 May 2021, 15:31 PM
#106
Posts: 472
It has slightly lower penetration at both vet0 and vet3 that does not matter when facing stock Allied tanks (except for Churchill and Comet).
I think it's time for the people to realize that Churchill only has 240 armor.
vet 0 rak43 can pen with 75%
vet 3 : 93.75%
Please don't make people think Churchill is the tough one. They tank with hp, not armor.
7 May 2021, 15:53 PM
#107
Posts: 3114 | Subs: 2
I think it's time for the people to realize that Churchill only has 240 armor.
vet 0 rak43 can pen with 75%
vet 3 : 93.75%
Please don't make people think Churchill is the tough one. They tank with hp, not armor.
That's true, however my focus was more on the Rak having 100% pen chance against all other stock targets. The "lacking" penetration compared to the PaK40 does literally not matter against these units.
7 May 2021, 16:35 PM
#108
Posts: 43
considering what i want its better than engaging LV's with just rifles
Sturm Schreck is shit
Try playing as OKW
7 May 2021, 17:30 PM
#109
Posts: 1660
considering what i want its better than engaging LV's with just rifles
How merciful of you
7 May 2021, 17:39 PM
#110
Posts: 320
Btw, just looking at the camo bonus of the Raketenwerfer:
Is there any scenario where the damage bonus of the first shot fired from camo is actually useful?
You deal 200 damage instead of 160. The only way this will ever have effect is two camouflaged Raks firing at a T70, but this is almost going to make a difference in a real game. Other scenarios? Double Rak on dozer Sherman? But by far and large, that's about it?
I think this could be changed to something more useful. +100% accuracy for a guaranteed first hit or so. I'm not saying the Rak really needs it, but those additional 40 damage seem fairly useless, even if you run around with two of them at all times.
If you look at it, a lot of "better rounds" end up being pretty negligible unless up against say super heavy tanks. OKW and Jackson Hvap rounds add 30% dmg and 30% pen, but that means the shot only does 200, which means it takes the same amount of shots for lights/meds. The pen is really what you pay for.
They all got nerfed because the ability to 2-3 shot a tank vs 3-4 shot it was too strong, so in this context it had the same idea but got the same nerf and probably just got forgotten.
7 May 2021, 17:43 PM
#111
Posts: 4183 | Subs: 4
Btw, just looking at the camo bonus of the Raketenwerfer:
Is there any scenario where the damage bonus of the first shot fired from camo is actually useful?
You deal 200 damage instead of 160. The only way this will ever have effect is two camouflaged Raks firing at a T70, but this is almost going to make a difference in a real game. Other scenarios? Double Rak on dozer Sherman? But by far and large, that's about it?
I think this could be changed to something more useful. +100% accuracy for a guaranteed first hit or so. I'm not saying the Rak really needs it, but those additional 40 damage seem fairly useless, even if you run around with two of them at all times.
I've tried getting the JP4 vet 5 damage changed for about 4 years. Eventually I gave up because they're just placeholding it on the veterancy slot. Even though it's useless they don't really want it to have something because both units generally do "ok" and are not in need of any bonus. 1% boost in accuracy would be better than this.
7 May 2021, 21:14 PM
#112
Posts: 3114 | Subs: 2
If you look at it, a lot of "better rounds" end up being pretty negligible unless up against say super heavy tanks. OKW and Jackson Hvap rounds add 30% dmg and 30% pen, but that means the shot only does 200, which means it takes the same amount of shots for lights/meds. The pen is really what you pay for.
They all got nerfed because the ability to 2-3 shot a tank vs 3-4 shot it was too strong, so in this context it had the same idea but got the same nerf and probably just got forgotten.
I agree that you usually buy those rounds for the pen increase. The Jackson rounds have an important function especially against heavies though. It is a timed ability, so there will be more than only one shot as well. Even against meds, they actually don't increase the time to kill by that much while allowing a three shot if you get an additional bazooka/snare/light mine in.
8 May 2021, 05:22 AM
#113
Posts: 163
Pick your worst considered standard AT gun of any faction and I would prefer that over RK.
8 May 2021, 06:49 AM
#114
Posts: 1660
I've tried getting the JP4 vet 5 damage changed for about 4 years. Eventually I gave up because they're just placeholding it on the veterancy slot. Even though it's useless they don't really want it to have something because both units generally do "ok" and are not in need of any bonus. 1% boost in accuracy would be better than this.
The heat shell bonus damage is also almost always useless and should be traded for longer ability duration
8 May 2021, 06:50 AM
#115
Posts: 1660
Pick your worst considered standard AT gun of any faction and I would prefer that over RK.
Pretty much, I go out of my way to steal enemy at gun when I play as OKW.
8 May 2021, 09:18 AM
#116
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
Pick your worst considered standard AT gun of any faction and I would prefer that over RK.
Nothing wrong with that.
Personal preference doesn't mean puppchen is bad in any way compared to all others.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
8 May 2021, 18:05 PM
#117
Posts: 3423 | Subs: 1
Making the Raketen into a Pak40/6-Pounder Anti-Tank Gun clone would be an OKW buff and nothing else. But i understand that blobbing 2 or 3 Raks can be problematic in teamgames.
It shouldn't be a clone. Just a slightly worse version of the pak. Give it 60 range but keep it's pen the same as rk43. And no TWP, just keep the camo
You can safely give it ZiS camo movement if the unit can no longer retreat
8 May 2021, 21:15 PM
#118
Posts: 5279
Isn't the pak38 in game from campaign? If so maybe slap that in there instead and could make the rak doctrinal if someone wants it
#stalinwept
8 May 2021, 21:45 PM
#119
Posts: 1660
Isn't the pak38 in game from campaign? If so maybe slap that in there instead and could make the rak doctrinal if someone wants it
Uh? Really, got a screenshot of it?
10 May 2021, 14:02 PM
#120
Posts: 5279
Uh? Really, got a screenshot of it?
It was more a question than a statement. I havnt played the vanilla campaign in a dog's age, but I thought there were "lesser" AT in the campaign and early TOW missions
#stalinwept
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