Commander Update Beta 2021 - Soviet Feedback

Jump back to quoted post3 Apr 2021, 18:08 PMPip

The B4 was changed because it was AIDS. It was an inconsistent RNG cannon that either did nothing at all, or instantly killed a medium tank with lucky scatter.

I'm not saying that the "new" B4 is a good unit, it seems as though it needs further changes, but I am glad that the Balance Team seem to want to rework it into less of a memegun and into something that's actually usable/not AIDS to play against.

I'd personally suggest the AOE be increased on shells significantly, the damage somewhat lowered (So it doesn't obliterate squads), the number of shells increased, and perhaps having landed shells cause suppression/force buttoning/stun vehicles temporarily. I expect numbers would want to be tweaked a lot, but I think this would give it an identity apart from other howitzers. "Massive single nuke" certainly fit the B4 thematically, but I don't think it was something that could really stay as it was.

All howitzers are pretty AIDS to begin with, though.

Jump back to quoted post4 Apr 2021, 00:25 AMKatukov

The B-4 doesn't deserve to be reworked. Its an intentionally designed death cannon that largely had an impact in only team games, and hitting a tank with a direct hit was extremely rare to begin with. I have no justification for the existence of this gun, other than it's unique, memey purpose. Whats more, it needs the accurate shot back, but it does less damage to compensate and not insta kill tanks. Whatever the solution may be, it is not what the modders thought up of.

Might as well give it confetti instead, I'd rather have an useless artillery piece that MIGHT be completely busted, and not this three shot noob trap

Jump back to quoted post4 Apr 2021, 01:31 AMPip

It'd be even more useless if it /couldnt/ oneshot mediums, though. It's just a dumb memegun that inhabits a pretty bad design space; Major changes are needed to make it anything less than a retarded and frustrating gimmick, I feel.

Jump back to quoted post3 Apr 2021, 17:16 PMKatitof

KV-2 does not underperform in any way... You may be using it wrong, but it is very good unit that murders infantry and fends off tanks below panther.

Jump back to quoted post31 Mar 2021, 22:01 PMNapalm

Give the KV2 purpose and love!

Jump back to quoted post4 Apr 2021, 14:34 PMNapalm

Look, I get that I'm bad at the game and I'll never get good, but are you sure the KV-2 is balanced and has a clearly defined role?

Jump back to quoted post4 Apr 2021, 14:40 PMAarotron

Id say it has. It great heavy tank that turns infantry to mush and makes any medium scale tank regret coming in front of it. It has infantry fighting boost and can become effectively mobile ml 20 with the ability to stay in place to increase range and reload.

So it can be breakthrough tank or defensive powerhouse, depending what units you surround it with. Only real limitations come when vs other heavy tanks, but its not as big issue when you build army to help against that.

Jump back to quoted post4 Apr 2021, 15:33 PMgeneral_gawain

You should know what you are talking about:

1) It doesn't turn infantry to mush. It has same MGs as T34/76, the main cannon is the same too but with 0,5 seconds higher ROF. T34/76 is much more cost efficient at dealing damage to infantry. You get the first earlier by far and the second not much after your first KV-1.

2) Range doesn't get increased with Hull-down. That is part of the problem. You have a 40 Range meat shield that just got shot from 60 range PAK/JPIV or 50 range Raketen/Panther. Free Vet for opponent.

Overall with the current nerf its just nort worth it anymore. You want a decent doctrinal soviet tank for medium fights and AI that can take on a Panther if paired? I would go for T34/85 any day.

Jump back to quoted post4 Apr 2021, 15:53 PMArray

they are discussing the KV2

Jump back to quoted post4 Apr 2021, 14:34 PMNapalm

Look, I get that I'm bad at the game and I'll never get good, but are you sure the KV-2 is balanced and has a clearly defined role?

Jump back to quoted post3 Apr 2021, 07:39 AMMMX

I've tried out the new B-4 in the commander revamp beta and also got somewhat mixed results, so i dug a bit deeper. if you visualize the old vs new aoe profile, the reason for these underwhelming results - especially against vehicles - becomes pretty obvious

Jump back to quoted post3 Apr 2021, 03:09 AMNorthWeapon

I think preventing Vickers K drop is too much baby sitting. It is a change directed specifically towards very rare scenarios where teammates share weapons. You are nerfing THE PLAYER by limiting control, not THE GUN.

I think chasing little unintended features and strategies takes way too much time and is futile because there are way too many unintended features in this game.

Going after usf vehicle sharing, M4 Sherman dozer upgrade exploit, and other similar unintended features will take forever and feels silly from the balance team to go after.

A lot of this is very rare and benefits teamwork and coordination. I see these exploits as a good thing not a bad thing. Dropping a Vickers K for your soviet teammate should be rewarded because the UKF player is looking out for his teammates.

A OST player dropping a med bunker on a Mechanized OKW player is a similar scenario. You don't want to somehow prevent this exploit because it is unintended.

No, it should be rewarded.

Don't kill creativity in the game. That is where balance team should draw the line. Very few people are happy to see halftrack Vickers drop being nerfed. This is an incredible blow to the incentive to buy this halftrack.

Balance team should focus on balancing units themselves, not considering rare scenarios of things happening. It is very silly.

"We have changed X because in these rare circumstances it can be used in an unintended way." I think this is extremely silly because there are a million unintended things you can do and thus futile.

Tldr don't nerf strategies, coordination, creativity, or power/control of players. Nerf the tools instead. You can nerf the Vickers, but don't remove ability for players to share them, that is specifically removing player control and coordination which is almost always bad design.

Jump back to quoted post4 Apr 2021, 17:49 PMfrostbite

m4c shermans main gun misses infantry to often on multipurpose rounds.

Jump back to quoted post4 Apr 2021, 17:52 PMPip

What, more than any other tank?

Jump back to quoted post4 Apr 2021, 17:55 PMfrostbite

it dont have much aoe in the shot and scatter sucks unlike for example a p4

Jump back to quoted post4 Apr 2021, 18:27 PMPip

I just checked the statistics, and you're right! For whatever reason the M4C has some pretty terrible scatter/AOE stats. I wonder why? It's basically just a slightly worse t34/85 in most respects, isnt it?