Commander Update Beta 2021 - British Feedback

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 09:12 AMVipper

BAR-K IS are good mid range without having to vet like riflemen, while double Bren Raid section are better than LMG lifmen at long range for 20 munition more.

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 09:08 AMKatitof

Pls provide evidence to back your claims that its otherwise.
You're the one who made that claim.

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 08:44 AMKatitof

Inb4 someone actually is naive enough to believe that royal engineers are actually good if you put weapons on them other then PIATs, lets remember that REs are the ONLY infantry in the whole game who do NOT get ANY accuracy vet.

Their firepower does not scale, its ALL about the weapon itself and it falls short badly against vetted inf.

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 09:08 AMKatitof

Prove it first before asking proofs of others, excel sheet hero.

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 09:43 AMSander93

The max range DPS difference for double Bren Raid Section vs M1919 + BAR Riflemen is negligible (18,9 vs 17,9) while being significantly worse at close to mid range in case they get overrun. In other words, it wouldn't be an issue.

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 09:43 AMSander93

And I highly doubt anyone would use it anyway, because double Bren IS would be way better at mid to far range and the difference between the Lee Enfields at close range becomes negligible too, given how those models are the first to drop.

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 10:32 AMKatitof

And it doesn't change a single thing about that I've said.

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 10:32 AMKatitof

Which is, again:
They are the ONLY unit in game with ZERO accuracy vet.

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 10:32 AMKatitof

Their damage scaling is EXCLUSIVELY upgrades.

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 10:32 AMKatitof

You're getting worked up to prove me wrong on an argument I never made, clown.

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 10:32 AMKatitof

And it doesn't change a single thing about that I've said.

Which is, again:
They are the ONLY unit in game with ZERO accuracy vet. Their damage scaling is EXCLUSIVELY upgrades.

You're getting worked up to prove me wrong on an argument I never made, congrats.

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 10:46 AMHannibal

Double Bren heavy engies do perform decently in combat, although they are exceptionally munitions heavy, but then so are IS. How they scale does not matter that much. Saying they do not get accuracy with vet is misleading because they do get combat bonusses when in cover (however not 100% if on Sten only or if it also works for other weapons).
I think if you manage to vet your engies early, they are a decent pick to make them a fighting unit. Building a fresh one in the late game for that purpose is what is not working.

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 10:46 AMHannibal

Double Bren heavy engies do perform decently in combat, although they are exceptionally munitions heavy, but then so are IS. How they scale does not matter that much. Saying they do not get accuracy with vet is misleading because they do get combat bonusses when in cover (however not 100% if on Sten only or if it also works for other weapons).
I think if you manage to vet your engies early, they are a decent pick to make them a fighting unit. Building a fresh one in the late game for that purpose is what is not working.

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 10:50 AMVipper

One has also to keep in mind that R.o. get received accuracy/reifocment bonus that are combat bonuses and Heavy sapper get armor.

Once reaching vet 3 heavy sappers are one of the most durable squad in game.

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 10:56 AMKatitof

Their in-cover bonuses are exclusively for STEN guns, they affect no other weapon and despite high values, its very minor and insignificant increase compared even to 15% accuracy of pios/CEs.

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 11:05 AMHannibal

At vet 3 yes. At vet2 they are fairly average. That's why I said it is probably best to use the once that vetted early while rebuilding one late game does not give a big benefit over an IS that already performs better at vet2.



If it is for sten only then it is indeed only a small short range increase. It does not change the fact that the unit still is a decent combat squad, especially for 6 pop.

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 11:34 AMVipper

If my calculation are correct the bonus is around 23%-24% more DPS at all ranges so is not "that" small while being available from vet 1.

Any issue has more to do with the restriction to cover than the bonus itself.

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 11:34 AMVipper

If my calculation are correct the bonus is around 23%-24% more DPS at all ranges so is not "that" small while being available from vet 1.

Any issue has more to do with the restriction to cover than the bonus itself.

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 11:46 AMHannibal

The discussion was about 2xBren heavy sappers. They only have two squads and are a long range squad, so the vet1 bonus will not contribute much.

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 06:28 AMVipper

Imo the Vicker-K /Raid section will probably cause issue.

Although turning Vicker-K into BAR might seem to be ok there are fundamental difference between USF and UKF unit that one should consider.

IS start with lower target and better far DPS tha riflemen and BAR-K fixes their main weakness: Close DPS and on the move DPS.

IS with 1 bren/BAR-K will simply perform excellent in all range.

Ro.E compared to RE might start a bit slow but once they vet up they become way too durable thus double BAR-K or even 3 weapons on them including flamer will make them a very cost efficient unit in late with lots of utility.

In a similar manner Raid section with double bren (or brain/BAR-K) will also perform great at all range similar or even superior to LMG Riflemen.

Giving BAR-K to UKF is more like giving LMG riflemen to UKF than simply giving them riflemen.

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 11:44 AMKatitof

Indeed a great bonus for TWO weak guns, exclusively at CQC, exclusively in cover, compared to accuracy bonuses for ALL weapons, picked up included, all other engineers have.

You're clowning hard now, this is completely meaningless for your tripple LMG long range scenario and sounds good exclusively on paper.

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 08:44 AMKatitof

... it falls short badly against vetted inf.

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 10:32 AMKatitof

...Their damage scaling is EXCLUSIVELY upgrades.
..

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 10:56 AMKatitof

... despite high values, its very minor and insignificant increase compared even to 15% accuracy of pios/CEs.

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 12:30 PMleithianz

They perform almost same to the RM with higher reinforce cost & no snare according to this(https://youtu.be/C75_nvhL_e8?t=841).

TBH, I don't think I'll play 1v1 with UKF after this patch either.

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 12:38 PMVipper

1) reinforcement cost is a "bug" and it going down

2) Those are Double Vicker-K RS and of course they will perform similar to double BAR riflemen. They stat are changed to match those of riflemen. Double Bren Raid sections (or 1+1) would had won that test.

My point is that UKF already have access to LMG and the changes make them perform like LMG RM.

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 12:48 PMleithianz

1) good to know. So it suppose to be 28?

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 12:48 PMleithianz

2) I thought vickers K is better than bren. Was it not?

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 12:48 PMleithianz

My point is UKF gain access to RM WITHOUT snare means nothing. Just play USF with RM would be better. I don't see why you are complaining.

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 12:52 PMVipper

I am simply pointing out potential issues.

Jump back to quoted post3 May 2021, 12:56 PMleithianz

UKF (obviously) performs bad in current patch, and giving what seems RM without snare can change nothing. I'll change my comment, I don't see potential issue here.