USF atnade behind 55 fuel wall?

Is it a bug or Riflemen can't get their atnade at vet1 anymore?

If it is not a bug, its completely crazy how it leaves you completely helpless before you get those 35 fuel and god forbid you to tech rack or grenade because if your opponent decides to build a vehicle on the mean time you're just fucked.

And if it was only a problem with the fuel but it take ages to upgrade your tiers, its like setting back grenadier panzerfaust to T2 or OKW faust requiring Full truck UP before unlocking {and not having the rak T0).

That's great because now if you want to tech capt you must chose between Atgun or atnade first. Its not even a nerf at this level its just regression gameplay. USF is forbidden to play extensively early game units you can even put back the HMG with the Stuart and M20 and Atgun with the pakhowi and AATH because there going to be nothing to protect them from a light vehicle rush and flank.

Any doctrine with early LVs is going to shit upon USF. You'll just have to apply early pressure and force the bleed so the USF player has to delay its teching and the magie happens: nothing will stop your lvs...

If you rech for racks.... you have access to bazooka....

Also, rebuilding rifles later, if you have to, means they WILL have AT nades and will not be roflstomped by any vehicle by default.

Only the 221 can potentially be an issue, at which timing you can just blob and get rid of most of its health. Once actual light vehicles roll around, you should have snares.

Getting nades too early has actual drawbacks now.

Ohhh, oh no a 251 *scary ghost noises* but what actually are the requirements the patch notes aren't very clear?

"AT Grenades no longer requires veterancy 1. Now requires either Mechanized Platoon, Mechanized Platoon, or Double Officers."

If it's deploying an officer then, c'mon that's usually the 3rd or 4th thing in any opening anyways, if it's locked behind the tech upgrade in that tier then... I'd like to see it first, but I would perhaps agree.

Only the 221 can potentially be an issue, at which timing you can just blob and get rid of most of its health. Once actual light vehicles roll around, you should have snares

And once the actual lights come around, you'll instantly have snares on all your squads instead of only on some of them.

It didn't seem to cause any issues in the dozens/hundreds of test/tourney games people played on the preview.

And once the actual lights come around, you'll instantly have snares on all your squads instead of only on some of them.

It didn't seem to cause any issues in the dozens/hundreds of test/tourney games people played on the preview.

Yeah that’s what I’m saying, this is a good change and doesn’t really give USF problems.

Seldom will be times when you will have vet1 rifles before the officer + upgrade. The biggest upside is the fact that getting wiped by stuka or werfer or lefh will no longer cripple you in the snare department, as the rebuilt rifles will be able to snare momentarily. Lost track of all the times a random lefh scatter took out one whole squad and left me without a snare in critical moments.

Ohhh, oh no a 251 *scary ghost noises* but what actually are the requirements the patch notes aren't very clear?

"AT Grenades no longer requires veterancy 1. Now requires either Mechanized Platoon, Mechanized Platoon, or Double Officers."

If it's deploying an officer then, c'mon that's usually the 3rd or 4th thing in any opening anyways, if it's locked behind the tech upgrade in that tier then... I'd like to see it first, but I would perhaps agree.

My mistake was to think that didn't affect the vet1 unlock. Tried it on cheatmode but only with vet0 riflemen.

Its indeed locked behind the tech upgrade, not the officer. I wouldn't have care much if was and I didn't thought they would remove the vet1 unlock with putting it behind the tech upgrade.

Looking at the level of reply I get here can feel the sufficiency of some people here. Not every game is balanced between opponent like in tournament, sometime you fuck up your early game but with the atnade lock so far behind around 6/7 minutes your almost dead if your opponent capitalize on it to rush a LV.

The scenario where you bleed too much early game and be forced to build an early ambulance will just put you in deep shit even if you managed to vet some of your riflemen. But that's probably because I'm not a top10 player that never commit such mistake that I'm stupid, USF is now only to be viable for top players that never fuckup their early game.

I agree, vet 1 or mech platoon would be fair. It grants snare to units build in the late game while not delaying it for the units build in the beginning. But as replied - everything had been tested by pro gamers and they felt good with that. Who are we to complain?.. Anyway, I think mech platoon is too much - any single officer should've been enough, imho.

OKW faust requiring Full truck UP before unlocking

It actually is like that, that's why I forced to pick fusis every time I see a brit, because by the time you tech to volks' pfaust, brit just overblob you, and raken can't hit UC most of the times.

While ago I suggested Vet 1 OR Major.

While ago I suggested Vet 1 OR Major.

Which unfortunately wouldnt improve anything really, and it would render an entire veterancy stage useless once major is deployed

The scenario where you bleed too much early game and be forced to build an early ambulance will just put you in deep shit even if you managed to vet some of your riflemen. But that's probably because I'm not a top10 player that never commit such mistake that I'm stupid, USF is now only to be viable for top players that never fuckup their early game.

On average you will get the snares faster with this change. YOu basically have to not cap a single point for the first 5 minutes of the game to be unable to afford the very first tech even if you have to go ambu first.

Maybe try to actually tech your lieut/captain as fast as possible instead of teching nades, ambu and build 3 caches in the early game, just a thought. You dont have to be a top 10 player to cap a few points and click 2 buttons.

Which unfortunately wouldnt improve anything really, and it would render an entire veterancy stage useless once major is deployed

Not necessarily. Vet1 could well give regular bonuses on top of giving the AT grenade unlock, there's nothing stopping the unit getting both an ability and bonuses with the same veterancy level.

Maybe try to actually tech your lieut/captain as fast as possible instead of teching nades, ambu and build 3 caches in the early game, just a thought. You dont have to be a top 10 player to cap a few points and click 2 buttons.

Could you be more pedantic with your answer? probably not. Don't you see that you're just ruining BO's diversity with this argument? Why suddenly should early nade or rack or ambulance become unviable just to please top10 players?

Could you be more pedantic with your answer? probably not. Don't you see that you're just ruining BO's diversity with this argument? Why suddenly should early nade or rack or ambulance become unviable just to please top10 players?

pedantic statements need pedantic answers.

You act like you auto lose when you do something like early nades or ambu which simply isnt the case, just make it count or you CAN be punished for it.
Most top10 players (atleast as far as i know) dont even care about this change cause its such a minor one in the early game. Like srsly, 50 fuel tech is not a huge burden... how far behind do you have to be for a 222 to arrive before your tech?
You do get the upside of a late game rifle being able to actually snare a vehicle btw

Yeah and it's much better this way. Theres almost no possible situation where the previous setup was better. Very few negatives and lots of upside, it's a good change

Not necessarily. Vet1 could well give regular bonuses on top of giving the AT grenade unlock, there's nothing stopping the unit getting both an ability and bonuses with the same veterancy level.

Vet 1 snare is just awful imo, it made USF unnecessarily annoying to play in some situations. e. g. when you play vs someone who plays defensive af and doesnt give you a chance to vet up riflemen, then rushes a vehicle

Tested it out in a game yesterday with the 221/223 as my 3rd unit. First two pokes had squads running but 3rd one caught me by surprise with an AT nade. Timing seems fine. Late game it's not that different to treating them like cons.

Vet 1 snare is just awful imo, it made USF unnecessarily annoying to play in some situations. e. g. when you play vs someone who plays defensive af and doesnt give you a chance to vet up riflemen, then rushes a vehicle

Oh no, I agree, but I'm saying that Riflemen could still unlock AT grenades from vet1, while also getting them in the current (Newly added by this patch) method as well, giving them a little more flexibility. Vet1 riflemen always have AT grenades, but ALL riflemen automatically unlock the AT grenades at vet0 once you have both officers or a second-tier officer upgrade.

Vet1 in this case would give AT grenades, and also another bonus. The former is deprecated when you universally unlock the AT grenades.

Vet 1 snare is just awful imo, it made USF unnecessarily annoying to play in some situations. e. g. when you play vs someone who plays defensive af and doesnt give you a chance to vet up riflemen, then rushes a vehicle

I've run into OKW going 2 Kubel start vs USF, since riflemen are already crap vs vehicle and you can bleed them and don't care anymore about their vet1.


There is something the people here don't understand, I'm not saying a general unlock for atnade isn't good where it is, but that you're now cut from different build orders since you need this tier unlock to keep your RM from being bullied by LVs and every fuel based upgrade you get before that is just going to be a suicidal decision.

Now its x3RM into lt/capt and tier upgrade or you can be taken pants down by an early LV.

My opinion is this is a regression in design for the faction.
Why wouldn't I be allowed to have an extensive early game, building 2xHMG or a Mortar and a HMG before getting my T1 upgrade, or if I want to unlock grenades and Ambulance before getting a Stuart. Or if I don't plan to get any light vehicle at all and prefer to get Grenade&bars&ambulance instead.
Because some dudes at TOP level decided so because they don't do that in their games?

What does it cost them to keep the Vet1 Atnade unlock AND having it unlock for every RM once teching?