Conscript PPSH assault package

Jump back to quoted post7 Nov 2020, 18:02 PMKatitof

I can't see how it would be "too viable" given this is the exact thing volk MP40s get and we don't see all of the volks being upgraded because of that.

Also, it would be incredibly unsustainable, map control or not, given at least 30 nade cost and oorah cost.
However even stun nade would do.

Jump back to quoted post7 Nov 2020, 18:31 PMelchino7

Even with 40muni PPSH, you still didn't want to use Cons against OKW.

Jump back to quoted post7 Nov 2020, 18:31 PMelchino7

3-6 PPSH can be fine but require much more tweaking than it's worth. For starters, i don't think you can just paste their current performance, give them 6x and call it a day. It would probable see an individual performance nerf with slight better 6 man performance but at the end of the day it would be an overall nerf cause it's better to have less weapon with better performance.

Imagine if we were to nerf G43 on Grens and give them 4 instead. They would suck ass.

Jump back to quoted post7 Nov 2020, 18:31 PMelchino7

As far as the SVT goes, i do think it walks a thin line but i think it's easier to adjust the commander, specially when you can just balance the IL2 rocket strafe without affecting other commanders. If anything this last months, we know that the commanders is not carrying the Soviets, at least on 1v1.

Jump back to quoted post7 Nov 2020, 18:34 PMSkysTheLimit

Read what I said again and tell me how you could possibly pull that out? I said sprint is better not that smoke is useless

Shocks also have nothing to do with what I said. You know you can use hoorah to flank and go around things right? It's a lot more surprising than a squad walking through a smoke grenade they just threw

Jump back to quoted post7 Nov 2020, 19:16 PMflyingpancake

I like JibberJabberJobber's idea on this matter. This seems like this would give them a little nudge without them growing too strong.

''Increases veterancy gain by 20%.
Munition cost from 60 to 45 munitions.

PPSH Conscripts become quite good once they're fully vetted. From some limited tests they seemed to be able to beat vetted MP40 Volks reliably in a straight-up 1v1. I don't want to touch the raw performance of this ability, because it's part of some already strong doctrines and bundled with hit the dirt. Instead, PPSH Conscripts should be able to reach their full potential earlier with faster veterancy gain (same bonus as 7 men Conscript upgrade) and better affordability.''

Jump back to quoted post7 Nov 2020, 19:20 PMgbem

i think mid-long DPS to match the MP40`s dps curve and some sort of HE/concussion grenade should also be considered...

Jump back to quoted post7 Nov 2020, 18:46 PMSkysTheLimit

Right I see what you're saying now. Can't remember if I have time periods correct but this was probably during the reign of penals
...

Jump back to quoted post7 Nov 2020, 19:34 PMflyingpancake

I think this could be done by giving the cons 6 ppsh and tweaking the ppsh to match volk mp40 performance. I have only skimmed this tread yet but it seems that people are resistant to this idea.

Jump back to quoted post7 Nov 2020, 16:59 PMgbem

uhh conscript PPSHs drop in DPS sharply beyond range 10... far more than volk mp40 do... at range 20 volk mp40s have the more DPS as the mosin nagant at 2.7 vs 1.9 while cons ppsh have 0.691

Jump back to quoted post7 Nov 2020, 19:46 PMKirrik

Just checked. Conscript PPSh's were the only combat unit SMG that didnt get buff. There you go. that explains why they suck balls

Jump back to quoted post7 Nov 2020, 19:51 PMVipper

Nice theory but wrong since the majority of units using SMG have only SMGs and thus little mid/far DPS. Conscripts on the other hand use bolt action/smgs and thus already have DPS beyond 10 meters.

Jump back to quoted post7 Nov 2020, 19:52 PMKirrik

Yea majority of units dont have only three smgs either.

Jump back to quoted post7 Nov 2020, 19:55 PMVipper

And you fail to understand the benefits of having 3 transferable SMGs.

Having 3 SMG means that conscripts lose less close DPS one the lose entities.

That is why ST are not a very successful squad because when they lose a model they lose 25% of their DPS.

Jump back to quoted post7 Nov 2020, 20:08 PMKatitof

Just like penals, su-76, M5 and many, many other non meta units - they are way too amazing for us plebs to use them effectively, only micro demigods, like vipper there know their true value and have skill high enough to unlock their full potential.

If you think they are bad, that's just your bad theory, you noob pleb.

Jump back to quoted post7 Nov 2020, 20:16 PMSkysTheLimit

This is literally your exact attitude 90% of the time you post

No one said ppshs are amazing. Not me. Not vipper. We have simply said they aren't as bad as OP is suggesting, and that giving SIX of them to cons without any tuning is a bad suggestion

Stop making shit up

Jump back to quoted post7 Nov 2020, 20:18 PMKatitof

1) Neither I am saying they should be 6 man, I've already said what could help them without making them no-brainer choice.

Jump back to quoted post7 Nov 2020, 20:18 PMKatitof

2) You have missed my point like B-4 misses max range target.