-Raise fuel price of OKW T4 from 60 fuel to 90 fuel
-Decrease fuel price of the T4 Panzer Authorization upgrade form 60 fuel to 30 fuel
- Lock Obers including LMG 34, JP4 and doctrinal Ostwind + Flame Hetzer behind T4 and Panzer IV and Panther behind the Panzer Authorization upgrade
- Make the Flak gun disabled until Panzer Authorization is upgraded as it is in the current version
What does this do?
It gives OKW easier access to the JP4 which is helpful for games where OKW is struggeling to get ressource as all their tech + tanks are very expensive. And losing momentum is extremly punishing because of it.
It also makes LMG Obers come slightly faster. Obers without LMG are not cost-efficient and have NOT proven to be helpful so they are almost never used. Yes Obers even without LMG are pretty strong compared to vet 0 infantry but they are facing vetted and upgraded Allied infantry and without LMG they just bleed MP and feed vet as the 40MP per model reinforcement cost is balanced around LMG Obers.
Ostwind and Flame Hetzer will now arrive at the right time. Currently the Flame Hetzer arrives at the same time as the Ostheer P4 which is just too late for a 640 HP AI only vehicle without turret. OKW Ostwind also arrives too late in OKW's tech structure so it's never used despite being in a decent doctrine. This change would make the OKW Ostwind arrive at a similar timing of the Ostheer variant. So with my idea the Flame Hetzer and Ostwind would arrive around 30 fuel faster which is around one to two minutes.
Should be very simple to implement this and would help OKW become viable again.
Simple OKW tech rework idea
1 Jul 2020, 11:05 AM
#1
Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1
1 Jul 2020, 11:13 AM
#2
Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1
This change would be an improvement over the current system.
1 Jul 2020, 11:56 AM
#3
Posts: 518
Sounds like a good idea to me. Only slightly worried about the JP4. I think it should stay locked behind the "Authorize Panzers" Upgrade
Haha the votes on this alone show the euro synphatheizers feel they just deserve to win. Anytime an okw nerf is brought up. Brain dead faction that skilless people can play and i refuse to play because of it.
Playing with randoms
Haha the votes on this alone show the euro synphatheizers feel they just deserve to win. Anytime an okw nerf is brought up. Brain dead faction that skilless people can play and i refuse to play because of it.
I've talked with mods enough times, I know when I'm going overboard, I usually limit myself, but there is only so much tolerance I have for entitled, ignorant fucks like you
The idea that the Jackson needed ANY nerfing is so laughable. It only serves ONE task, how dare it be good at that. If it were a good against infantry like the Panther, King Tiger, Panzer IV, Jagtiger, Elefant, I could see how it might be a problem and need a nerf but it's not
Haha the votes on this alone show the euro synphatheizers feel they just deserve to win. Anytime an okw nerf is brought up. Brain dead faction that skilless people can play and i refuse to play because of it.
I've talked with mods enough times, I know when I'm going overboard, I usually limit myself, but there is only so much tolerance I have for entitled, ignorant fucks like you
I don't play this version of EZ mode very often because it's so boringly simple. But it is funny to see the Axis circle jerk with people complaining that the one faction with every crutch in the book is some how underpowered lol.
The idea that the Jackson needed ANY nerfing is so laughable. It only serves ONE task, how dare it be good at that. If it were a good against infantry like the Panther, King Tiger, Panzer IV, Jagtiger, Elefant, I could see how it might be a problem and need a nerf but it's not
Haha the votes on this alone show the euro synphatheizers feel they just deserve to win. Anytime an okw nerf is brought up. Brain dead faction that skilless people can play and i refuse to play because of it.
u deserve to lose if u don't have an Ele when there's an ISU.
Just stay out of topics u have no knowledge of, Latch.
Ranked, I only play USF. Wouldn't be caught dead playing Nazis with some sort of record being taken
I've talked with mods enough times, I know when I'm going overboard, I usually limit myself, but there is only so much tolerance I have for entitled, ignorant fucks like you, and wouldn't be surprised to be hit again, but I'm fed up with this bullshit and honestly, the sole fact that I'm not permad is what keeps me here having discussions about the game I like and yes, I do question myself why I still go back here to this free range insane asylum so often.
I've talked with mods enough times, I know when I'm going overboard, I usually limit myself, but there is only so much tolerance I have for entitled, ignorant fucks like you
1 Jul 2020, 12:11 PM
#4
Posts: 3588 | Subs: 3
Make the gun a separate 250mp upgrade to activate.
1 Jul 2020, 13:23 PM
#5
Posts: 956
Flammenhetzer definitely needs to come earlier I agree. Yes to earlier Obers as well, feeling a big gap where your volks really are not matching up to LMG toting hordes of vet2/3 inf even at vet III+
Whilst the average player isn't going to make good use of an early JP4, good players would - this is a very deadly TD to have so early. It would by far come out the earliest out of contemporaries such as the SU-85.
Whilst the average player isn't going to make good use of an early JP4, good players would - this is a very deadly TD to have so early. It would by far come out the earliest out of contemporaries such as the SU-85.
For Italy! We have outfoxed the enemy once more!
1 Jul 2020, 13:45 PM
#6
Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1
Flammenhetzer definitely needs to come earlier I agree. Yes to earlier Obers as well, feeling a big gap where your volks really are not matching up to LMG toting hordes of vet2/3 inf even at vet III+
Whilst the average player isn't going to make good use of an early JP4, good players would - this is a very deadly TD to have so early. It would by far come out the earliest out of contemporaries such as the SU-85.
Ober will come later with this suggestions, lmg ober will come earlier.
1 Jul 2020, 13:50 PM
#7
Posts: 3114 | Subs: 2
Overall good changes.
I am not sure about how the Hetzer (which is still decent in urban team maps and hard to deal with without a tank) and the JP4 (exceptionally strong for its timing) changes would work out, but I this would probably more be an issue of moving the exact split between T3 and uprgrade +/-10 fuel to the most appropriate spot.
I am not sure about how the Hetzer (which is still decent in urban team maps and hard to deal with without a tank) and the JP4 (exceptionally strong for its timing) changes would work out, but I this would probably more be an issue of moving the exact split between T3 and uprgrade +/-10 fuel to the most appropriate spot.
1 Jul 2020, 13:56 PM
#8
19 
Posts: 1295 | Subs: 1
Ive always thought swapping the P2 and the flak trucks locations in the tech path would be interesting. T3 is such a no brainer in 1v1 but if the P2 was separated from the puma a real decision would have to be made by the player, would make meta much more interesting for OKW. Just my 2 cents.
1 Jul 2020, 14:21 PM
#9
Posts: 3031 | Subs: 3
-Raise fuel price of OKW T4 from 60 fuel to 90 fuel
-Decrease fuel price of the T4 Panzer Authorization upgrade form 60 fuel to 30 fuel
- Lock Obers including LMG 34, JP4 and doctrinal Ostwind + Flame Hetzer behind T4 and Panzer IV and Panther behind the Panzer Authorization upgrade
- Make the Flak gun disabled until Panzer Authorization is upgraded as it is in the current version
This was the original implementation of the first iteration from the reworked OKW t4 except that lmg34 and JP4 also required panzer authorization. But for some reason the team decided to put hetzer and ostwind behind authorization so that un-upgraded Obersoldaten could arrive 30 fuel earlier. A change that did literally nothing positive
1 Jul 2020, 14:23 PM
#10
Posts: 3588 | Subs: 3
This was the original implementation of the first iteration from the reworked OKW t4 except that lmg34 and JP4 also required panzer authorization. But for some reason the team decided to put hetzer and ostwind behind authorization so that un-upgraded Obersoldaten could arrive 30 fuel earlier. A change that did literally nothing positive
Agreed, earlier Obers deployment without weapon upgrade is literally pointless.
1 Jul 2020, 14:32 PM
#11
Posts: 213
Agreed, earlier Obers deployment without weapon upgrade is literally pointless.
Imo with our without weapon upgrade T4 just is too late. Shocks, falls, guards all come 5-10 mins ealier and perform the same. The unit needs either something special like reduced dmg (like grens) to compensate for that, or be buildable after the first truck set up.
1 Jul 2020, 14:55 PM
#12
Posts: 368
...
Good ideas. Various prices and build times might need to be adjusted somewhat, but overall would give OKW breathing room when on the back foot. Having earlier AI options may also indirectly discourage the mandatory Luchs and open up Battlegroup builds.
1 Jul 2020, 21:45 PM
#13
Posts: 51
This was the original implementation of the first iteration from the reworked OKW t4 except that lmg34 and JP4 also required panzer authorization. But for some reason the team decided to put hetzer and ostwind behind authorization so that un-upgraded Obersoldaten could arrive 30 fuel earlier. A change that did literally nothing positive
Somehow, these last minute decisions implemented to otherwise good changes don't surprise me and likewise the origin of these decisions. The Obersturmbannführer, is gaining power...
2 Jul 2020, 01:30 AM
#14
Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2
Plus one
My controls weren't working
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.
Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.
2 Jul 2020, 09:51 AM
#15
Posts: 1304 | Subs: 13
Testing it in the mod and still need more data, but the early OKW AI vehicles can become very potent, and possibly oppressive given their timing.
Will need to play more games to see how oppressive BG -> doctrinal can be.
I do at least like the changes and early Jagdpanzer IV is something I always believed should be available since it's a response vehicle that no one would ever rush.
Will need to play more games to see how oppressive BG -> doctrinal can be.
I do at least like the changes and early Jagdpanzer IV is something I always believed should be available since it's a response vehicle that no one would ever rush.
2 Jul 2020, 10:08 AM
#16
Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1
Testing it in the mod and still need more data, but the early OKW AI vehicles can become very potent, and possibly oppressive given their timing.
I don't know, considering other factions can rush AI vehicles even faster.
UKF Centaur:
30+110+100-20 = 220 fuel
Ostheer Ostwind
40+105+100-20= 225 fuel
For comparison OKW Hetzer post-rework
60+105+90-10= 245 fuel
OKW Ostwind post rework
60+105+100-10 = 255 fuel
2 Jul 2020, 10:09 AM
#17
Posts: 3166 | Subs: 6
But for some reason the team decided to put hetzer and ostwind behind authorization so that un-upgraded Obersoldaten could arrive 30 fuel earlier.
Some reason being the choice between potentially letting 2-3 good vehicles come too soon and potentially creating a whole host of issues or trying to make Obersoldaten fit into builds easier. Even if the latter hasn't really worked out (though personally I use early Obers quite a bit and find the split tech costs a lot easier to manage), it was the safer choice because there was next to no feedback on the new vehicle timings.
2 Jul 2020, 10:12 AM
#18
Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1
Some reason being the choice between potentially letting 2-3 good vehicles come too soon and potentially creating a whole host of issues or trying to make Obersoldaten fit into builds easier. Even if the latter hasn't really worked out (though personally I use early Obers quite a bit and find the split tech costs a lot easier to manage), it was the safer choice because there was next to no feedback on the new vehicle timings.
Again why is it OK for UKF and Ostheer to have super fast AI vehicles but not OKW? Makes no sense to me.
I know OKW T0 is very versatile but so is UKF T0+T1 and Ostheer with Shreck Pgren support and call in infantry.
Just look at the fuel calculations of rushing vehicles for the factions.
2 Jul 2020, 10:16 AM
#19
Posts: 3166 | Subs: 6
Again why is it OK for UKF and Ostheer to have super fast AI vehicles but not OKW? Makes no sense to me.
I didn't say it wouldn't be okay for OKW to have access to fast AI vehicles, I said there was barely any feedback on the changes in the test mod. The Centaur and Ostheer Ostwind have been tried and tested (and adjusted) through the years so we know they are fine now within their factions, while making several vehicles available 30-40 fuel earlier for OKW would be a huge change to their army roster that we just couldn't risk at the time.
2 Jul 2020, 11:17 AM
#20
Posts: 3588 | Subs: 3
Again why is it OK for UKF and Ostheer to have super fast AI vehicles but not OKW? Makes no sense to me
Because UKF can't deploy 1CP JLI or 2CP Fallschirmjagers and the Quad is doctrinal.
Ostheer can but needs to skip a tier and the 222 is not as oppressive.
OKW does not need a super AI vehicle early, especially with the raketen in T0. The OKW's issues lie elsewhere.
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